How many bets am I supposed to lose on river this hand?

[Xelent]

I am a very new Omaha player and was playing 6/12 with a full kill at the Wynn when this kill hand came up. My memory is a little fuzzy, but the important part was that I was out of position and the villain had just killed the pot so this was a 12/24 hand. I have JJA2 and the flop comes J99. I lead the flop and villain who is a tight/solid player calls. Turn is a blank and I lead and he calls. On the river another blank comes and he raises me. I am from a hold'em background and I have the 2nd nuts (turn and river were under J). Am I not supposed to even 3 bet him here? If I 3 bet and he 4 bets, do I stop there? Thanks ahead of time.

[grandgnu]

I would have capped it myself. There's only one hand, 9/9 that can beat you here. If he just has 9's full, you've got him. Quads can happen, and it sucks when they happen to you (I had A/A on a flop of A/4/9 and then a 9 on the turn, and my opponent online happened to have called my pre-flop raise with 9/9, whoops! And I didn't hit my low draw either)

But I wouldn't have played my hand any differently. Many players will pay off your nut full house with an underfull, and in the long run you'll make more money capping it with the nut full house, than fearing quads at every turn.

[Ironman]

I'm with GG on this. Hands like this don't come along very often. I would have reraised and lost the maiximum possible against the quads.

I'll take my chances.

Dave

[Wintermute]

not more than 4 bets though (head up is not capped); if he reraises, he's got quads

[grandgnu]

[ QUOTE ]
not more than 4 bets though (head up is not capped); if he reraises, he's got quads

[/ QUOTE ]

Not really. There are plenty of players who will re-raise with just trips with a strong kicker (or weak kicker) because they don't know what they're doing.

[autobet]

In Omaha I will lose 4 bets. Holdem 6 against most.

[Wintermute]

prob not in a 6-12 full kill game...

[gergery]

Very opponent dependent.

99 is dealt 1 way as there are two out there.
J9 is dealt 2 ways
A9 is dealt 6 ways

You have to figure he would play that way with either 99 or J9, so its twice as likely you are beating him, and if he'd play that way with A9 then you are very likely ahead.

After you raise and he reraises, then you need to evaluate how likely it is he'd play that way with A9 - not very likely, or J9 still likely but somewhat less so.

So I'd have raised him at least once and more if he was bad.

-greg

[Cleveland Guy]

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[ QUOTE ]
not more than 4 bets though (head up is not capped); if he reraises, he's got quads

[/ QUOTE ]

Not really. There are plenty of players who will re-raise with just trips with a strong kicker (or weak kicker) because they don't know what they're doing.

[/ QUOTE ]

If it's not capped - I'm still stoppin at 4.

He very rarely will have trips here, and underfull is more likely, but quads is very likely.

I'll stop at 4, cause the times I am beat will outnumber the times I have him beat.

[Cleveland Guy]

[ QUOTE ]
Very opponent dependent.

99 is dealt 1 way as there are two out there.
J9 is dealt 2 ways
A9 is dealt 6 ways

You have to figure he would play that way with either 99 or J9, so its twice as likely you are beating him, and if he'd play that way with A9 then you are very likely ahead.

After you raise and he reraises, then you need to evaluate how likely it is he'd play that way with A9 - not very likely, or J9 still likely but somewhat less so.

So I'd have raised him at least once and more if he was bad.

-greg

[/ QUOTE ]

If he's willing to go to war with Trip 9s - then how much worse do they get?

[grandgnu]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Very opponent dependent.

99 is dealt 1 way as there are two out there.
J9 is dealt 2 ways
A9 is dealt 6 ways

You have to figure he would play that way with either 99 or J9, so its twice as likely you are beating him, and if he'd play that way with A9 then you are very likely ahead.

After you raise and he reraises, then you need to evaluate how likely it is he'd play that way with A9 - not very likely, or J9 still likely but somewhat less so.

So I'd have raised him at least once and more if he was bad.

-greg

[/ QUOTE ]

If he's willing to go to war with Trip 9s - then how much worse do they get?

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually, just playing 9/9 in your hand is pretty bad. I get people who call me with crap ALL the friggin time. They'll stick around pre-flop with 5/6/8/9 against my A/A/2/3 double suited raise, and hit a flop of 5/9/J/9/8 or something.

[Cleveland Guy]

[ QUOTE ]
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[ QUOTE ]
Very opponent dependent.

99 is dealt 1 way as there are two out there.
J9 is dealt 2 ways
A9 is dealt 6 ways

You have to figure he would play that way with either 99 or J9, so its twice as likely you are beating him, and if he'd play that way with A9 then you are very likely ahead.

After you raise and he reraises, then you need to evaluate how likely it is he'd play that way with A9 - not very likely, or J9 still likely but somewhat less so.

So I'd have raised him at least once and more if he was bad.

-greg

[/ QUOTE ]

If he's willing to go to war with Trip 9s - then how much worse do they get?

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually, just playing 9/9 in your hand is pretty bad. I get people who call me with crap ALL the friggin time. They'll stick around pre-flop with 5/6/8/9 against my A/A/2/3 double suited raise, and hit a flop of 5/9/J/9/8 or something.

[/ QUOTE ]

In general, I agree, that playing a 9 in your hand is marignal at best, But a hand like A239 - DS is still playable, and of course A299 or A399- regardless of suits is always playable.

[Xelent]

Also remember he had the kill button and got in for free so he could of had anything.

[PokerProdigy]

I would definitely think you should 3 bet here because there is only one hand to worry about, which is pocket nines which someone is very unlikely to have (because there are 2 nines on board, and many people (especially a "tight/solid player") wouldn't even play the pocket nines even if they were dealt them. Therefore, I am raising and if he 4 bets I would even 5 bet it (if that is allowed in your casino and it would probably also be the max/cap).

[Xelent]

unlimitted raises allowed heads up.

[PokerProdigy]

[ QUOTE ]
unlimitted raises allowed heads up.

[/ QUOTE ]

Oh, then I you might want to stop after 5 /images/graemlins/smirk.gif