All you lifters out there, general discussion

[vulturesrow]

Its pretty obvious from some recent threads that there is a decent sized group of 2+2ers that lift regularly. Just curious about your routines, your training approach, etc, basically anything you want to talk about. Anyway, here goes for me.

My routine is a 3 day a week total body routine. I cycle through the routine twice, with about 30 seconds or so between sets, with the exception being when I hit the end of the first cycle I rest for two. Monday is mostly barbell exercises, wednesday mostly dumbbell, and friday being a high rep day. I do a short ab routine each day too. On the off days, I do some moderate cardio. Saturday is hard abs routine with windsprint type cardio training. My strongest exercises right now are probably lats/back, my weakest being anything that targets my biceps directly. The thing I need to improve most is my diet. I tend to use my workout as an excuse to not eat as well as I can. But I am getting better with this. Anyhow, looking forward to hearing from others.

[nbake]

I throw javelin so I work on core strength a lot more than anything else. Mondays and thursday consist of cleans or snatches followed by squat (one leg or light jump squats for me as my knees suck ass). After this we always do ham curls and good mornings. On tuesday and friday we do bench, usually with the barbell, but I get better results from dumbells. Pull ups or lat pulls are always good. Pull overs are fun too. We also do some tri ext or push downs and DB shoulder press. This is followed by lots of lateral raises. Finally we finish with curls for the girls.

We supplement lifting with sprinting, running stadiums, and various bounding exercises.

[climber]

is it bad that i thought you meant shoplift until at least 3 lines into your post?

[vulturesrow]

[ QUOTE ]
is it bad that i thought you meant shoplift until at least 3 lines into your post?

[/ QUOTE ]

No, just really funny. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[augie00]

Nice thread.

My routine is 3 days as well, Monday Wednesday and Friday. I do my biceps, back, pecs, obliques, and forearms on Monday and Friday, and my lower body on Tuesday. I also do abs nearly every day (body by jake, tae bo abs, "the firm" abs exercise. I do very little cardio, however I do run on a treadmill Tuesdays and Thursdays.

I am also on the "abs diet" (www.absdiet.com) so my health habits of about the last month have been pretty decent. Ton of protein and low fat food = big muscles.

[vulturesrow]

Augie,

I have been doing the absdiet thing as well though I havent been too faithful to the "diet" portion of it /images/graemlins/smile.gif As I said, getting better though. Its hard when you are living out of a hotel room. The workout I described is theirs, with some modifications I threw in. I really like it though.

[Edge34]

My routine:

M/W/F: Upper body consisting of almost entirely free weights. Overhead dumbell raises, front dumbbell raises, side dumbbell raises, pullovers, back dumbbell raises, butterflies, bicep curls. Treadmill running for 30-45 minutes. Ab workout consisting of bicycles, side bridges, and VKRs (vertical knee raises).

T/Th: Lower body lifting with leg extensions/curls (quads and hammy), calf raises, hip flexor adduction and abduction. Running 30-45 minutes, same ab routine.

Weekends: No lifting, light exercise like pickup football or basketball, something like that. Abs with bicycles and side bridges.

Seriously, the only thing holding me back is my total lack of patience with the proper diet... /images/graemlins/frown.gif

[Dan Rutter]

Mondays
Chest/Back (sometimes back on alt. day depending on how chest went)

Wed.
Legs

Fri
Shoulders, Bis, Tris

I run speed and agility training sessions for the football players at the High School I played. So those are three days a week on non-lifting days, and I run all the drills myself. I also do abs on 2 of these conditioning days.

[AZK]

It sounds like I have a bit more time than most being a student and transitioning between undergrad/grad, for the last two years I had a girlfriend and totally let myself slide, but this is the routine I used to use, and back to what I've been on for the last two weeks and hopefully the rest of my life:

I lift 5 days a week, normally take 2 days off either together or if one muscle group is particuarly sore, I start with Back and go all the way to biceps (Back>Chest>Shoulders>Tri>Bi ((Large muscles to small) doing 1 group each day. Each day is divided into 3 or 4 different exercises which I rotate every 2 weeks or so, 4 exercises for the big muscles, 3 for the small ones since by then I'm normally maxed out anyway. I change up every 2 weeks since your body is incredibly good at getting used to repititon. So 2 weeks I'll do flat/incline/decline bench, and the next two weeks I'll do free weight flat/incline/decline, things of this nature. This is a 4 - 6 week cycle, afterwards I take a rest for about 1 - 2 weeks where I just do cario and light training (maybe some legs), sort of giving my body time to chill out after also helped cause of finals. I try and do abs 2-3 times a week, depending on how sore they are from the previous time, working from general abs to lower abs. After lifting but before abs I normally do some cardio for about 20 minutes (biking/running in an effort to strengthen my lower body without actually lifting).

As far as the eating goes, if you can eat 6 small meals a day while lifting, it seems to work best from what I hear (and her for me) so that your body has a constant supply of energy. I'll normally do oatmeal for breakfast and a protein shake, then 2-3 hours later I'll eat a small lunch, afternoon snack, dinner, and a protein shake before I go to bed. If I go to the gym in the morning I just have a shake... The eating thing is key. A lot of people plateau after a while and it's because they aren't eating enough. I'm currently way overweight from my two year slide so I'm not eating as much and doing more cardio than lifting in an effort to cut some weight.

[edfurlong]

Train bi's and tri's together and put in a motherfucking leg day!

[AZK]

I know I know...you're right. I have such difficulty lifting two muscles the same day since I've been exposed to this training technique. I never feel like I'm doing both fully when I know I have to do 2. I'm either spent from doing 1 first and the other gets neglected or I work both equally, but not as much if I had done them each on one day...

[jakethebake]

I'm convinced a full-body routine is the way to go. I also think too many people do way too many exercises. I think sticking with the big three (Deads, Squat, Bench) is all most people need (5x5). Maybe substitute Cleans for Deads on occasion or Military Presses for the Bench occasionally. Frankly I think 99% of the bodybuilding books should be burned, along with the magazines. People don't need all these little isolation exercises unless you're competing for Mr. Olympia or something. Lately I haven't had much time so I've been just doing the clean & press. It's a great exercise that works you top to bottom. I'm also a big fan of these silly little things...
http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B0001A3HA4.01-A12J7Z25BKBAUQ._SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg

[MikeL05]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm convinced a full-body routine is the way to go. I also think too many people do way too many exercises. I think sticking with the big three (Deads, Squat, Bench) is all most people need (5x5). Maybe substitute Cleans for Deads on occasion or Military Presses for the Bench occasionally. Frankly I think 99% of the bodybuilding books should be burned, along with the magazines. People don't need all these little isolation exercises unless you're competing for Mr. Olympia or something. Lately I haven't had much time so I've been just doing the clean & press. It's a great exercise that works you top to bottom. I'm also a big fan of these silly little things...
http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B0001A3HA4.01-A12J7Z25BKBAUQ._SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]

Those things are difficult, and overpriced. I made one for $7 in Home Depot parts.

I do a 2-day cycle. Day 1 is pull exercises (mainly back and biceps) and Day 2 is push exercises (mainly chest and triceps). Abs are done on both days. Add in a day 3 of legs and heavy trunk work if you want a complete workout, but I like to let running and biking take care of my legs.

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
Those things are difficult, and overpriced. I made one for $7 in Home Depot parts.

[/ QUOTE ]

Try doing the wheel from a standing position w/o knees touching. Pretty tough. I got mine for <$3 on sale at Sports Authority. It's a great core trunk exercise.

[Stuey]

[ QUOTE ]
I think sticking with the big three (Deads, Squat, Bench) is all most people need (5x5).

[/ QUOTE ]

I read this advice on here before and have tried it. It seems to be good advice.

I think there are 2 things that I think are the most important which have yet to be mentioned.

1. Time

People will make most of their gains in the first year of lifting. Then the gains are smaller and people seem to quit. Sticking to it for the long-term is key. Certain times of the year must be easier so you can rest and avoid injury but never stop for more than 2 weeks or a month. The biggest mistake I have made in the past is stopping for too long. Normally to focus on cario.

2. Intensity

Hard to explain but you control the intensity of any lift or exercise movement. That's why jake gets so much out of the little wheel thing and others think they are junk. He does the movements with good form and they work the muscles thoroughly.

To increase intensity it is often required to lower the weight. The speed of the movement is important also. Never use the momentum of the movement to help move the weight. The positive and the negative parts of the movement should require effort. At no point in-between reps should you have a rest period.

Intensity is hard to explain but it is a form of self-torture in my mind. I think of ways I can make each rep harder. You don't even need weights I am currently doing pushups, pull-ups, chins, dips, weightless squats. I have done squats with over 300 pounds before but doing them with better form without weight can be just as hard.

[ptmusic]

[ QUOTE ]
Nice thread.

My routine is 3 days as well, Monday Wednesday and Friday. I do my biceps, back, pecs, obliques, and forearms on Monday and Friday, and my lower body on Tuesday. I also do abs nearly every day (body by jake, tae bo abs, "the firm" abs exercise. I do very little cardio, however I do run on a treadmill Tuesdays and Thursdays.

I am also on the "abs diet" (www.absdiet.com) so my health habits of about the last month have been pretty decent. Ton of protein and low fat food = big muscles.

[/ QUOTE ]

I went to the absdiet website and it looks interesting. But I'm skeptical, especially when I see the typical hype like "Get Abs like these in JUST 6 WEEKS!" (points to a male model's chiseled 6 pack).

To anyone familiar with the absdiet program:

Why do you like it?

Which products did you buy?

How would you compare it to other options?

Thanks,

-ptmusic, a formerly athletic thin guy

[SmileyEH]

[ QUOTE ]

I do a 2-day cycle. Day 1 is pull exercises (mainly back and biceps) and Day 2 is push exercises (mainly chest and triceps). Abs are done on both days. Add in a day 3 of legs and heavy trunk work if you want a complete workout, but I like to let running and biking take care of my legs.

[/ QUOTE ]

I have the same upper body cycle. I work legs in on one of the days just doing back squats. Squats are definitely my favorite excercise. I'd like to do twice my body weight with good form, within the next 6 months or so.

-SmileyEH

[-Skeme-]

I just do some cardio, eat properly and do curls/presses. I lost 10 lbs with this, seems to be working.

[Roy Munson]

Stuey is on to something regarding not needing weights. I lifted weights religiously for 20 years. I made significant size and strength gains immediately. Over time I developed nagging injuries to my shoulders and lower back. The shoulder injury progressed to full blown arthritis.

For the last 4 months I have performed only bodyweight calisthenics and the results have been amazing. Exercises such as pushups, handstands, neck bridging, hill sprints and rope jumping have helped me drop 3 inches from my waist size while improving balance and flexibility dramatically.

For those that feel that you can not maintain strength without lifting weights I recently hit a new maximum in chinups that I never achieved while lifting weights. Handstands and handstand pushups work the back, shoulders, arms and hands like no other exercise I have done in the past.

As far as aerobic exercise goes, jumping rope blows away any stationary bike, elliptical machine or stairclimber in a fraction of the time.

For anyone who feels stale from weight lifting give these exercises a try for a few weeks and see if you don't see remarkable progress.

[augie00]

I have only been on it for two weeks so far. I have not seen much visible result, but the logic in the book makes a ton of sense and I am pretty confident that in the end I will be happy with the result. A lot can happen in 4 weeks.

Aside from having no visible results, I feel great, always have plenty of energy, and have gained about 6 lbs w/ a weight increase across the board at the gym.

[cookie]

My powerlifting program:

Monday:
CMS Sheiko squat routine
+ abs + a row variation + triceps

Wednesday:
TJ single cyclus in deadlift
Hatfield CAT day
+ abs + a row variation + triceps

Friday:
CMS Sheiko squat routine
+ abs + a row variation + triceps

Saturday:
Heavy Hatfield Bench press day
Dynamic Effort Deadlift
+ abs + a row variation + triceps

[Blarg]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm convinced a full-body routine is the way to go. I also think too many people do way too many exercises. I think sticking with the big three (Deads, Squat, Bench) is all most people need (5x5). Maybe substitute Cleans for Deads on occasion or Military Presses for the Bench occasionally. Frankly I think 99% of the bodybuilding books should be burned, along with the magazines. People don't need all these little isolation exercises unless you're competing for Mr. Olympia or something. Lately I haven't had much time so I've been just doing the clean & press. It's a great exercise that works you top to bottom. I'm also a big fan of these silly little things...
http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B0001A3HA4.01-A12J7Z25BKBAUQ._SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm a monster fan of those wheels, though I don't like the ones where the wheel is too skinny.

I used to do them from a standing position, too, but I'm not strong enough any more. That's the only specific fitness goal I have at this time -- to be able to do those from a standing position again.

[Blarg]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think sticking with the big three (Deads, Squat, Bench) is all most people need (5x5).

[/ QUOTE ]

I read this advice on here before and have tried it. It seems to be good advice.

I think there are 2 things that I think are the most important which have yet to be mentioned.

1. Time

People will make most of their gains in the first year of lifting. Then the gains are smaller and people seem to quit. Sticking to it for the long-term is key. Certain times of the year must be easier so you can rest and avoid injury but never stop for more than 2 weeks or a month. The biggest mistake I have made in the past is stopping for too long. Normally to focus on cario.

2. Intensity

Hard to explain but you control the intensity of any lift or exercise movement. That's why jake gets so much out of the little wheel thing and others think they are junk. He does the movements with good form and they work the muscles thoroughly.

To increase intensity it is often required to lower the weight. The speed of the movement is important also. Never use the momentum of the movement to help move the weight. The positive and the negative parts of the movement should require effort. At no point in-between reps should you have a rest period.

Intensity is hard to explain but it is a form of self-torture in my mind. I think of ways I can make each rep harder. You don't even need weights I am currently doing pushups, pull-ups, chins, dips, weightless squats. I have done squats with over 300 pounds before but doing them with better form without weight can be just as hard.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hard to imagine not getting much out of the wheel. Most people who can do sit-ups all day and night quickly tire on the wheel.

You're right that form makes a huge difference on it, too. Using momentum, or your back muscles and hip flexors to do much of the pulling completely changes the load placed on your abs.

[IronDragon1]

Current split-

Day 1 (whenever that is):Chest/Shoulers/Back/Cardio
Day 2:Arms/Abs/Cardio
Day 3:Legs/Cardio/Abs
Day 4:Repeat day 1
Day 5:Repeat day 2
Day 6:Repeat Day 3
Day 7:Repeat Day 4

Upon first glance I realize that my split seems like overkill but you have to realize
1)It's summer and I have no job so I don't have anything else to do
2)I'm incredibly out of shape

As to the actual bodyparts themselves I perform 3 sets for each bodypart on Day 1/4 with rep ranges from 8-10 for power movements (heavy rows/shoulder presses/chest presses) and 10-12 for pulldown/flyes/lateral raises and the like.

I only rest about 30-45 seconds between sets for all weight training and this keeps your heart rate up and goes a long way towards burning extra calories/keeping you in condition.
It's because of this I was able to keep the same training volume and add cardio while keeping my workout time to only 1 hour; which is actually 10-15 minutes less than what it was years ago.

As for arms I apply the same method of three sets though I usually bump up the reps for biceps to 10-12 in order to force more blood in their as that is my worst bodypart. Towards this end I like to finish up biceps with a burnout set of 20-25 reps of a cable movement.

Abs training is divided between "heavier" training (e.g using some of the more difficult moves where I can't get many reps such as decline-bench situps and swiss-ball movements) whereas I emphasize (proper) reps on other days

As for legs, since they grow so fast I do not need to use squats or the like so I simply do 3-5 (depending on how i feel) sets of 20 bodyweight squats and 1-2 sets of 20 lunges. Hamstrings and calves training is done whenever I feel those parts are lagging.

The real secret to training my lower body is cardio. This is because my cardio workout utilizes more sprinting and plyometrics (jumps and the like). This has the dual benefits of quickly increasing heart rate while utilizing type 1 muscle fibers which, combined with "traditional" cardio and my bodyweight work provides a total leg workout.

A good idea of the type of workout I prefer can be found Here (http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/phil3.htm)

Nutrition-as it always has been- is the key to success. Right now I'm eating 6 small meals (half are protein shakes/bars though I'm trying to change this) emphasizing lean protein/fresh produce/whole grains and healthy fats.
Right now I'm eating about 2,000 calories a day with the following macronutrient breakdown:
30%-Protein
20%-Fat
50%-Carbs

Supplement wise (beyond protein shakes/bars) I use Branched Chain Amino Acids (5 grams after exercise)/Glutamine (3 grams twice daily) and a Thermogenic (http://www.cytodyne.com/products.html?product_id=65&site=xenadrine)

I suppose the last thing I can say is have a good source to turn to for more info. My favorite is Bodybuilding.com (http://www.bodybuilding.com) which not only is packed with info but also runs the best supplement shop on the net.

[SmileyEH]

I think you need to eat a lot more. I'm sure I've averaged over 5000 calories per day and I'm only 160lbs. Maybe if you are trying to lose weight, but still - 2k cals isnt much at all.

-SmileyEH

[IronDragon1]

[ QUOTE ]
I think you need to eat a lot more. I'm sure I've averaged over 5000 calories per day and I'm only 160lbs. Maybe if you are trying to lose weight, but still - 2k cals isnt much at all.

-SmileyEH

[/ QUOTE ]

I have arrived at my figure after 22 years of experimentation on my body and figuring out that I don't handle to many calories all that well.

[vulturesrow]

Thanks for the great replies, couple of things Id like to respond to.

1. I agree with Jake in that I think people in general get too elaborate with their routines. Im not really referring to people that have responded here, because it seems to me that the folks that have responded know enough about what they want out of their routine and how it all fits together to be more elaborate.

2. Bodyweight exercises-Big big fan of this. No question there. Before I started my current lifting routine, I had gone to exclusively doing bodyweight exercises. Why did I stop doing them? I find lifting to be much more psychologically satisfying for me. Simple as that. I was starting to dread going out and doing my bodyweight routines because I found them becoming very boring.

3. The wheel thing- To be honest, I consider myself pretty knowledgeable about this topic and I have never seen anyone use this thing before. The function of it is pretty obvious from the picture, but I sure would appreciate any more details on the thing, including what parts you used to build it with if you built your own.

4. Two things I meant to put in my OP.
a) If you have ever have a woman complain to you about not being able to lose weight, get on your soapbox about lifting. Lifting has a generally negative image among many women because of some myths out there.
b) Dave Draper's website (http://www.davedraper.com) is the cat's meow in my opinion. I dont post there, but I do read the boards and his email newsletter is great.

Thanks everyone again for all the great replies, much appreciated.

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
3. The wheel thing- To be honest, I consider myself pretty knowledgeable about this topic and I have never seen anyone use this thing before. The function of it is pretty obvious from the picture, but I sure would appreciate any more details on the thing, including what parts you used to build it with if you built your own.

[/ QUOTE ]

They've been around since at least the 1970s, but have never gotten the recognition they deserve. Too simple. A lot of people think they're kind of gimmicky. If you search THIS FORUM (http://forum.dragondoor.com/training/) for "evil wheel" a lot of stuff comes up. They're great for strengthening your "core" and give your shoulders and traps a decent workout too. Even if you're in very good shape, don't be surprised if you get sore the first couple of times you use one of these because they work muscles a little differently.

Also THIS GUY (http://mattfurey.com/powerwheel.html) pushes a more expensive version. I've heard good & bad things about this guy. Let's just say he's very "marketing-oriented" and leave it at that.

[vulturesrow]

Jake,

You said you built your own, mind providing me with a parts list? /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
Jake,

You said you built your own, mind providing me with a parts list? /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

no. that was someone else. i bought mine for like $3 on sale at sports authority.

[Blarg]

Most people don't use the wheel partly because it just looks like a toy and/or they don't know anything about it, and partly because it's really friggin' hard. And weightlifters are often real die-hard traditionalists who don't want to try much that's new. There's an element of religion to working out. /images/graemlins/wink.gif

The worry about buying an expensive one isn't much of a worry. They usually go for ten to 20 bucks. The main thing is, if the wheel is too skinny in the middle, it's harder to balance, and you don't want one that's obviously flimsy, since almost your whole body weight can get put on it, in motion. I've seen them go from 10 bucks to like 60 bucks, but the expensive ones aren't any better than most of the cheap ones.

As far as more details, I can just say that you start out on your knees, and let the thing slowly roll out till you're flat on the ground. Then you roll back up, but concentrate on keeping your abs doing the pulling. Keep your elbows straight or close to it, and try not to come up by doing a pull-up(pulling your arms under you) and then tucking back, but by keeping your arms stretched out over your head as much as possible so the arms do almost no work and the abs do it. Keeping your back as flat as possible and your arms stretched out helps keep the load on your abs. Try to make the pull start from your gut and stay there as much as possible, involving all the muscles of your midsection.

When you get started, it may be hard or it may not be. If it's hard to do, cheat a little, but be careful to stay stable and not do jerky movements -- you don't want to plow face first into the ground, or just make things too easy. Like most strength exercises, it's not a deal where you want to cheat yourself out of the benefits by using momentum.

Start slow, and see how you feel. Do less than you think you can for at least a few days, to get your body used to it.

As you get better, you can add variation, like doing the beginning of the movement more, or twisting your body just slightly as you move up. You can also get some value and flexibility training by concentrating on a controlled descent, aside from the usual concentration on just coming up. When you get good enough to knock out lots of smooth, controlled reps using mostly your abs and hardly anything else, you can try getting off your knees and starting from the familiar standing up and touching your toes position. Go all the way out till you're flat on the ground, relax, and come all the way back up. Be careful! It takes a little flexibility to be comfortable doing this, too.

Watch out that jerky movements don't throw you off the wheel!

You get a lot of stabilizer muscle support while working the abs here, which is another benefit. To me, just a couple minutes of using one of these wheels is harder than hundreds of sit-ups. Nice benefit: this stomach work-out gets every inch of your stomach muscles, and does it in almost no time at all. Sit-ups and crunches, etc., take a good chunk of time. If you can start this exercise standing up, get flat to the ground, and wind up standing up again, hands at your feet, you won't need any other abdominal exercise.

[Uston]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Those things are difficult, and overpriced. I made one for $7 in Home Depot parts.

[/ QUOTE ]

Try doing the wheel from a standing position w/o knees touching. Pretty tough. I got mine for <$3 on sale at Sports Authority. It's a great core trunk exercise.

[/ QUOTE ]

Bastard. I paid $5 for mine at Walmart. Not exactly overpriced.

[ptmusic]

[ QUOTE ]
I have only been on it for two weeks so far. I have not seen much visible result, but the logic in the book makes a ton of sense and I am pretty confident that in the end I will be happy with the result. A lot can happen in 4 weeks.

Aside from having no visible results, I feel great, always have plenty of energy, and have gained about 6 lbs w/ a weight increase across the board at the gym.

[/ QUOTE ]

You bought the main "Abs Diet Book", not the "Eat Right Guide", right?

And did you buy directly from their website?

Thanks,

-ptmusic

[vulturesrow]

PT,

I know the question wasnt addressed to me but I dont have the book. I signed up for the online program, where you get the diet and workout tailored to you. The book can be found at retail booksellers, so no need to buy direct if you can find it for a better price.

[AZK]

Side question, how many of you that have a regular gym lifting routine carry around a book to record everything. I used to rely on my memory and then punch it into an excel spread sheet to keep track of my lifting, but I've been lazy.

[vulturesrow]

[ QUOTE ]
Side question, how many of you that have a regular gym lifting routine carry around a book to record everything. I used to rely on my memory and then punch it into an excel spread sheet to keep track of my lifting, but I've been lazy.

[/ QUOTE ]

I do.a

[augie00]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I have only been on it for two weeks so far. I have not seen much visible result, but the logic in the book makes a ton of sense and I am pretty confident that in the end I will be happy with the result. A lot can happen in 4 weeks.

Aside from having no visible results, I feel great, always have plenty of energy, and have gained about 6 lbs w/ a weight increase across the board at the gym.

[/ QUOTE ]

You bought the main "Abs Diet Book", not the "Eat Right Guide", right?

And did you buy directly from their website?

Thanks,

-ptmusic

[/ QUOTE ]

Same book. I bought it at the bookstore on my campus.

[AEKDBet]

Lift 2-4 times / week. No set routine. Every session is based on either

1) Squats
2) Deadlifts
3) Bench Press

Out of gym in 30 mins. Went from 130 lbs freshman year to 190 lbs senior year, still lean.

[IronDragon1]

[ QUOTE ]
Lift 2-4 times / week. No set routine. Every session is based on either

1) Squats
2) Deadlifts
3) Bench Press

Out of gym in 30 mins. Went from 130 lbs freshman year to 190 lbs senior year, still lean.

[/ QUOTE ]

Can you say good genetics?

[Blarg]

Also called just growing up. I got six inches taller in six months when I was a teenager. Spent most of it asleep. We all wondered why I seemed to need so much sleep -- it was cuz my body was going berserk on the growth.

[vulturesrow]

[ QUOTE ]
Also called just growing up. I got six inches taller in six months when I was a teenager. Spent most of it asleep. We all wondered why I seemed to need so much sleep -- it was cuz my body was going berserk on the growth.

[/ QUOTE ]

I put on 30 pounds in about 1 year of college without any noticeable gain in body fat. Basically I finally stopped growing taller and finally started growing out. And it was the good type of growing out. The growing out that happened after I graduated and got married had more noticeable effects. There is definitely a downside to having a wife that can cook g00t. /images/graemlins/grin.gif Luckily I managed to fight it off successfully.

[IronDragon1]

Way to make short, pudgy endomorphs feel bad

[Blarg]

And guys who don't have wives that are good cooks!

[Reef]

I don't really set my days, just the order that I do it in. I typically do 1 muscle group a day. Max 2.

1) Chest:
rotate about each 2 months between dumbells and bar bench press.
seated chess press
either incline or decline bench press (rotate dumbells and bar)
standing cable press

2) Back:
straight leg deadlift or regular deadlift
basic rows (seated and leaning forward)

3) Shoulders:
military press (prefer dumbells, often use bar)
side and forward dumbell raises
other excercise I don't know the name of

4) Bi/Tri:
standing curl (bar)
seated incline curl (dumbells)
weighted tri arm extension (?)
skull crushers

5) legs:
leg press
squat (I slack on this)
quad/ham excercises
calf raise
--------
repeat

[vulturesrow]

[ QUOTE ]
And guys who don't have wives that are good cooks!

[/ QUOTE ]

Blarg,

If you are ever in the Virginia Beach area let me know and I'll have my wife cook us a good southern meal to make it up to ya /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[Blarg]

heheh sounds good!

[Edge34]

[ QUOTE ]
Current split-

Day 1 (whenever that is):Chest/Shoulers/Back/Cardio
Day 2:Arms/Abs/Cardio
Day 3:Legs/Cardio/Abs
Day 4:Repeat day 1
Day 5:Repeat day 2
Day 6:Repeat Day 3
Day 7:Repeat Day 4

Upon first glance I realize that my split seems like overkill but you have to realize
1)It's summer and I have no job so I don't have anything else to do
2)I'm incredibly out of shape

[/ QUOTE ]

Take Day 7 and make it a rest day. Enjoy life, find something active to do, maybe like a pickup basketball game or something. Or sit on your ass if you choose. Whatever you do, you don't need to train 7 days a week because muscle growth is built on breaking it down and letting the body regenerate. While you may not be working the same muscles all the time, rest time is important if only as a break for your body and mind from the training routine you put yourself into.

[vulturesrow]

Good post Edge. This is something I meant to bring up. Overtraining can be very detrimental. Youve got to give your body time to rest and repair itself. Which brings me to a pet peeve of mine. Guys who come in the gym, practically coughing their lungs up, but they cant miss their workout! Not only is it counterproductive for them most likely, its a great way to get a lot of other people sick. This really ticks me off.

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Lift 2-4 times / week. No set routine. Every session is based on either

1) Squats
2) Deadlifts
3) Bench Press

Out of gym in 30 mins. Went from 130 lbs freshman year to 190 lbs senior year, still lean.

[/ QUOTE ]

Can you say good genetics?

[/ QUOTE ]

Can you say puberty?

[MikeL05]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Jake,

You said you built your own, mind providing me with a parts list? /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

no. that was someone else. i bought mine for like $3 on sale at sports authority.

[/ QUOTE ]

Go to Home Depot, and buy a wheelbarrow wheel. Generally you can also purchase a metal rod that will fit in the middle like an axle (think rebar or something). A couple feet of plumbing pipe padding will go around your makeshift axle... and then just duct-tape it on.

Though for $3, I'd be tempted to go to Sports Authority. Mine is SOLID though... heavy duty :-)

[jakethebake]

Try this...

EXERCISE WHEELS (http://www.amazon.com/gp/search.html/102-4801478-6575347?me=&node=3375301&keywords=exercise%20wheel )

[xadrez]

I lift on M,W,F and do a simple workout each day where i pick from...

Deadlifts
Squats
Pullups
Bench Press
Dips
Rows

On T,Th I do cardio. One of the days it will be steady state and the other some kind of interval training, or sprints.

Ill alternate between dumbell and barbell for all the weight exercises. I also switch up the rep schemes. People tell me I should be on a set routine but I disagree. I think that variation is good for your body, which adjusts pretty fast. Of course, you need to be smart about balancing the workouts if you do it this way.

My problem is the same as the OP's, namely Diet. I used to be a lot more lean doing this routine but in the past year a combination of a crapload of work + grad classes have killed my will to eat healthy.

Also in agreement with Jake about keeping it simple with big, compound lifts. Curls and other simple isolation movements will only get you so far.

Another thing: Im usually flabbergasted when Im at the gym at how desolate the power rack is. There nothing funnier than seeing these jacked guys with shockingly skinny legs.

[Cyrus]

[ QUOTE ]
You've got to give your body time to rest and repair itself.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not a lifter, not even in supermarkets. I got into a conversation with a female that works as a temp somewhere, early 20s, ex-champion weight lifter in her class for her country. Good looking gal, btw. Like all top athletes, she has a lot to say about championship level sports. Her absolute credo is, All top sportsmen, and especially lifters, are on dope. No matter who it is, he or she is on top, he or she is on dope.

The immediate need for dope comes from training itself, and not competition. These guys and gals train three (3) times a day! She tells me a human muscle needs about 48 hours to rest and get back its elasticity after a weightlifter's heavy training - but the trainers want to compress that 48-hour perod into two or three hours. Hence, the drugs.

She won her last-ever game, but only appeared after accepting to take the drugs that her (national team) trainer gave her, under the ultimatum 'either you take them and lift, or dress and leave'. He was very warm and pleased when she won and reminded her that without the good stuff she would not have made it. She threw at his face the unopened dope and left champion weight lifting for ever.

Kept the gold, though.

[jakethebake]

I used to train 2-3 times a day and never touched dope. I was nowhere near any kind of championship level. But I can tell it's doable IF you keep your training sessions very short. That's key. It's still probably not the ideal, but at that time I was probably in the best shape of my life. And I actually had a very good friend accuse me of "juicing".

Anyway, this kind of frequency is common for power lifters. Some even up to 5 times a day. They do like 2-3 sets of 2-3 reps and that's a whole workout. They can recover because the whole workout is like 15 minutes.

[Allan]

Here is mine, it's a basic no frills 3 day split with a rest day or 2 between sessions. No matter which rep scheme I use I look to improve by a rep or a few pounds over my previous session. While bulking I don't do all that much cardio since I have a hell of a time putting on weight. If cutting I'll usually put in cardio sessions the day after lifting then a rest day after that. It streaches the whole split over a week but it works best for me to do it that way rather than training everyday with no rest days before lifiting, especially for the leg movements. I also do yoga, now and then, for flexibility.

Push:

Incline DB press
Wide grip dips
DB shoulder press
Close grip barbell bench pres

Pull:
Dead lifts
Wide grip chins
DB rows
shrugs
(static holds if I can be bothered)


Legs:
Squats
Ham curls (I was doing Straight leg deads here for a while but it was hitting my back more than hams due to inflexibility)
Calf raises
Ab curls or ab rolls


Allan

[gamblore99]

I just browsed this thread. But if any of you guys are seriously trying to get bigger/stronger/more cut, a periodization plan is the way to go.

[The Truth]

[ QUOTE ]
I just browsed this thread. But if any of you guys are seriously trying to get bigger/stronger/more cut, a periodization plan is the way to go.

[/ QUOTE ]

could you elaborate?

[AZK]

How many of you do this before lifting? I'm talking about something like 5 minutes for full body stretching and then another 5 minutes jogging before hitting the weights...thoughts?

[swolfe]

i run on the treadmill for 20 minutes, stretch, then do the weights for the day (rotates between pushing and pulling). after weights, i run through some abs, and i'm done.

the whole thing takes between 45 minutes and an hour. i do this 2-3 times per week, and sometimes mix in sprints/plyometrics instead of run/weights.

pushing day:
bench
leg press
dips
calf raises

pulling day:
lat pulls
dead lifts
upright row

usually do 3 sets of 8-10, except calf raises, which get a lot more reps.

[theghost]

[ QUOTE ]
i thought you meant shoplift until at least 3 lines into your post?

[/ QUOTE ]

...saw "training routines" and thought of a shoplifting bootcamp of some sort /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Blarg]

Most people I've known due extremely little or even no stretching. A high percentage of people I've known also injure themselves. I've always stretched thoroughly before work-outs and usually after them, too, and I've never hurt myself working out or exercising in any way, even though I at least used to be a pretty hard core work-out fanatic.

I'd say five minutes is too little time to stretch. Such a short time period might even encourage pushing yourself through stretches too quickly and actually straining yourself, making you more injury prone rather than less. Take a while to relax into your stretches, and to feel yourself really loosen up. Don't begrudge the time it takes; it's health insurance and very good for your body even if you don't work out! Go by feel, not by the clock. Don't bounce or strain, and try to feel comfortable moving in a wide range of motion, not just in line with the lifts or specific exercises you intend to do.

[Subfallen]

[ QUOTE ]
Try this...

EXERCISE WHEELS (http://www.amazon.com/gp/search.html/102-4801478-6575347?me=&node=3375301&keywords=exercise%20wheel )

[/ QUOTE ]

This is great advice...I would suggest if anyone is going to invest serious use in one of these, get the Power Wheel, it's the best model though a touch pricy at $59.95.

[gamblore99]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I just browsed this thread. But if any of you guys are seriously trying to get bigger/stronger/more cut, a periodization plan is the way to go.

[/ QUOTE ]

could you elaborate?

[/ QUOTE ]


In a periodization plan, you train with a specific goal for several months and your full program is a 6 months to a year, and possibly longer. It is broken down into
anatomical adaptation, hypertrophy, mixed, max strength, definition, and transition (transition is in between phases)

Anatomical adaptation -this phase is to prepare the body for heavier loads. The body's tendons do not grow as fast as the muscles, and this phase aims at strengthing them as well as the nervous system and a bunch of other things (I don't have my very credible book on me at the moment) It uses loads of about (65%?) max strength, and is done in circuits with (8-12?) reps. Usually the circuit is done 2-3 times per workout wiht about 7 excercises. For beginners about 3 times a week, and for people who have trained before, up to 5 times a week. I think the breathing time is supposed to be 30 seconds between excercises, and about 1-2 minutes after the workout.

The next phase is hypertrophy- this phase is where muscle mass is gained. Muscles are trained 3-4 sets using 6-12 reps with breathing time about 1 1/2 minutes. Depending on the experience and fitness, it should be done 3-6 times a week.

there is a 2-3 transition time for the body to recover some of the accumilated fatigue

Next phase is mixed training
this is a mixture of hypertrophy and max strenght training. I forget the details of this. But its something in between the two.

transition period

Max strengthing training - This phase aims to increase the maximum strength. 4-5 sets of 1-6 reps. Breathing time of about 4 minutes in between. 3-6? times per week.

transition

definition- this phase is where you get really cut. I forget the sets, but i think the reps are something ridiculous like 30-150, with short rest times. (Ya I know the reps sound ridiculous, I'm not there yet, but the book is very scientific and seems very credible)

This is all from the book serious weight training, as well as my trainer (he's a good trainer, head of university gym, degree in medical sciences and working on his PhD.) its very scientific. There is also a ton in there about training schedules (this is a large part of the book), as well as diet, most effective excercies, and stuff. It also explains things in more detail. I don't have it on me at the moment, some of my numbers may be wrong, and inaccurate. This is just an idea of the periodization stuff. I would look into it yourself if you decide to get into it.

Here is a link with a bit of info. book (http://www.exrx.net/Store/HK/SeriousStrengthTraining.html)

[thabadguy]

I am pretty serious lifter , i havent read all the posts on this thread yet, but AZK alerted my attention to this thread and I thought i might give my 2 cents.
Depending upon your goal(endurance, strength, muscle size)though these are not mutually exclusive,they each have a workout style to optimize one,hence you would need to tailor your workout and diet accordingly.
A) Endurance :-
For endurance your workout needs to consist of a lot of high rep medium weight sets, with a shortish rest span between sets with the intake of mroe carbs as compared to the other 2.
For example, a Chest endurance workout for a beginner would normally consist of
3 set of flat bench presses, each set comprising 15-20 reps(to failure)
3 set of incline dumbell/barbell(i would recommend dumbell to add variety) presses again 15-20 reps each done to failure
3 Sets of cable crossovers with over 25 reps in each set
3 sets of flat/incline flyes(alternating on each workout) of about 20 reps each set.
3 sets of chest pullovers of 20-25 reps to failure.
B) Strength
3 sets of Flat bench presses with 3-6 reps to failure
3 sets of Incline presses( i would recommend barbell over dumbells here) 3-6 reps to failure
3 sets of decline presses 3-6 reps to failure
3 sets on incline/flat flyes 6-10 reps to failure
C) Muscle Mass
4 sets of Flat bench presses 8-12 reps to failure
4 sets of Incline press 8-12 reps to failure
4 sets of Decline flyes 8-12 reps to failure
4 sets of either incline flyes or cable crossovers 10-12 reps to failure.
Building muscle mass and strength have mroe in common that endurance and the other 2, endurance will give you a more "toned" look, the kind you find sexy on girls.
If any1 is interested in asking more questions about this, feel free to pm me.

[jakethebake]

This whole post is pretty much absurd. AZK, please do not alert him to any more threads.

[Biloxi]

I stopped lifting about a year ago cuz, like most of my friends, I wasnt getting much results besides strength.
Almost all my friends starting using "the goods" to get larger and ripped, but I cant stand needles so I didnt start.
I mostly do push ups, pull ups, swim, run, bike, etc.. Triathlon style training. I may finally get the guts to do the good stuff, but till then Ill still be the same size.

[thabadguy]

[ QUOTE ]
This whole post is pretty much absurd. AZK, please do not alert him to any more threads.

[/ QUOTE ]
What exactly do u find absurd about it?

[Blarg]

Better to be healthy, anyway. Some guys use steroids for years and never suffer ill effects, and some guys get ruined livers or cancer in under a year. Ya never know.

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
What exactly do u find absurd about it?

[/ QUOTE ]

O.k. I'll just pick your strength workout as an example.

I assume this is part of some kind of split routine. One problem with these routines is that people assume their back gets rested between back workouts. Their chest gets rested between back days, etc. So they spend five days a week, working each bodypart once or twice. They do way too many sets per workout. The bodyparts get rest between days. But because of the total amount of work being done. There's no rest for the system as a whole.

Systemic overwork is what leaves people overtrained. If you want to do a split routine, that's fine, but you can't use it as an excuse to do three times as many sets per bodypart. Aside from that:

- No one working on strength needs to be doing flyes.
- No one except maybe some juiced up Mr. Olympia contender needs or should do three different kinds of bench press in a single workout.
- No one except maybe some juiced up Mr. Olympia contender needs or should do 12 sets for a single bodypart to failure.

Granted that's just my opinion, but I'll stick to it.

[vulturesrow]

[ QUOTE ]
This whole post is pretty much absurd. AZK, please do not alert him to any more threads.

[/ QUOTE ]

[thabadguy]

I am not a juiced up, Mr. Olympia, but i am pretty serious about weight training, and i use a lot more sets per bodypart than indicated here.
The systemic overwork ur talking of, only occurs if you do not get enough nutrients for ur muscle to recover and u do not get enough sleep/rest period.
i never said 5 days a week for a beginner, 4 would suffice.
For some1 who has been lifting seriously for over a year i would say 5(i work out 6 days a week).
How many sets per body part are u recommending?
2?
I would honestly love to see any1 with any decent amount of strength /muscle mass(read bench press over 275lbs, squat over 365 lbs Deadlift over 315 for at least a 5rm ) have a workout routine that doesnt comprise of at least 12 sets per body part.
No one needs to do flyes for strength.
Umm yes they do, i wish i could show u all the articles in Flex and Muscle& Fitness magazine about this(which have been written by M.D.s almost exclusively).
No1 but a juiced up Mr. Olympia needs to do 12 sets to failure?
Umm..how other than doing a set to failure to expect to increase muscle mass, or strength?
If you do not tax ur muscles they are not going to grow. Lemme give u an example...would lifting a pillow weighing a lot less than 1 lb as a bench press significantly increase strength. Why? Because you cannot go to failure with that, unless u do about 2000 reps.
Its your advice, ull stick to it...fine..
Its just incorrect, and im sure the users of 2+2(even oot) wouldnt mind a correct opinion from some1 who knows what theyre talking about once in a while.

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
Umm yes they do, i wish i could show u all the articles in Flex and Muscle& Fitness magazine about this(which have been written by M.D.s almost exclusively).

[/ QUOTE ]

HaHaHaHaHaHaHaHa! There went any shred of credibility you had.

[thabadguy]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Umm yes they do, i wish i could show u all the articles in Flex and Muscle& Fitness magazine about this(which have been written by M.D.s almost exclusively).

[/ QUOTE ]

HaHaHaHaHaHaHaHa! There went any shred of credibility you had.

[/ QUOTE ]
Huh??????????

[vulturesrow]

[ QUOTE ]
HaHaHaHaHaHaHaHa! There went any shred of credibility you had.

[/ QUOTE ]

You mean reading Flex wont give me cannonball like shoulders within 2 weeks if I just use their routine? /images/graemlins/grin.gif

And yeah, citing flex doesnt exactly make me think you actually know a damn thing. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Blarg]

Dude, powerlifters don't do twelve sets and more per body part. They tend to do few sets, few reps.

And do whole body movements, not isolate body parts all that much.

[AEKDBet]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Umm yes they do, i wish i could show u all the articles in Flex and Muscle& Fitness magazine about this (which have been written by M.D.s almost exclusively).

[/ QUOTE ]

HaHaHaHaHaHaHaHa! There went any shred of credibility you had.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yep. It's over, you lose.

[thabadguy]

No point arguing with you guys. I just thought some1 might like correct advice about something i know about, and i only did it cuz AZK asked me to, saying it would be appreciated.
Ill stick to MHNL.

[Blarg]

I don't know who "you guys" is supposed to be, but I made a simple and true statement. If that was against some sort of rules or something, you should have said so in the first place.

[IronDragon1]

While I don't agree with this kid's overly simplification of things (though honestly-how harmless can that be compared to being fat and lazy?) I think that not enough weightlifters give high(er) volume training systems a chance.

Aside from a good number of them lacking sorely in their nutrition and rest too many try to apply the same principles they do for HIT-type programs. Namely they take sets to failure and spend too much time emphasizing the eccentric (negative) portion of the lift. Both of these things place tremendous strees the Central Nervous system and doing them twice a week will inexorably lead one into a state of overtraining. However, once previous high volume lifters get over having to take every set to failure and lifting a bit faster (still controlled) then they can reap the benefits of high volume training if nothing more than a different stimulus.

Similarly, people do forget that genetics play a huge role in how we respond to training and dieting. While we are all human beings, and thus certain physiological laws remain, the simple fact is that some people can get by training each bodypart twice-and in certain rare cases three times-a week.

A very popular high volume protocol (the most popular being the Arnold training programs found in Arnold's encyclopedia of bodybuilding (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0684857219/qid=1120248940/sr=8-1/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i1_xgl14/103-6567285-1381459?v=glance&s=books&n=507846) is German Volume Training (http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/luis13.htm)
I recommend that all lifters give programs like these a try and see how they respond much like I tell volume freaks to try adding workouts which emphasize strength to their rotation.

The point is to constantly tinker with your weight training protocol to see how you respond to it but most importantly to keep your mind and body fresh