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View Full Version : I really hate that turn card

PokerBob
06-24-2005, 07:55 PM
villain here is 54/10/1.8. IMO his pf raise range is AA-TT, AK-AJs. What's your play here?
Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is CO with T/images/graemlins/spade.gif, T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
<font color="#CC3333">UTG raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, UTG calls.

Flop: (7.40 SB) 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 2/images/graemlins/club.gif, 5/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
UTG checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG calls.

Turn: (4.70 BB) K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
UTG checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero .....</font>
7ontheline
06-24-2005, 08:02 PM
Easy bet. And I think your standards for his pfr are probably too tight.
Nick C
06-24-2005, 08:04 PM
I'd bet again, planning to fold to a raise. Unfortunately, I don't think Villain will fold any of the 10-outers you're currently beating, and there is a good chance you're behind.

Would Villain just check-call a hand like QQ or JJ on the flop, in fear of being up against a better hand or overcards plus a wheel draw? If so, is it possible he'd release one of those hands now?

Just a thought.

Okay. Now I'll get out of the way and let people who have actually played 5/10 6-max respond.
Klepton
06-24-2005, 08:23 PM
this is a bet/fold to c/r

AQ-AJ 66-99 are the only hands you beat, and villain would c/r none of these with an aggression of 1.8.

if he called and bet out the river, say "nice hand" to yourself and call.
me454555
06-24-2005, 08:24 PM
Easy turn bet. He could have overs or he could have a K. My standard line in these situations is bet the turn and check behind on the river
Surfbullet
06-24-2005, 08:30 PM
Your hand range for villain is too tight I imagine. How many hands are those statistics over? if it's less than 200 his pfr # could be off by as much as 5-10%.

I bet the turn, and fold to a raise. Whether I bet the river or not depends on how tenacious I think he is...many players will call with AT or 66-99 etc.

Surf
Surfbullet
06-24-2005, 08:33 PM
[ QUOTE ]

AQ-AJ 66-99 are the only hands you beat, and villain would c/r none of these with an aggression of 1.8.


[/ QUOTE ]

Again, I think we are being a little too tight with the hand range we are assigning to the villain here.

That aside, even if we accept these hand ranges and these statistics an aggression factor of 1.8 is very very high for someone who is seeing 50% of his flops. This in no way precludes him from being capable of bluff-raising the turn. I got bluff-raised on the turn today by a guy with an AF of .8 over 250 hands. Reads from watching him play are far more valuable in determining when to call.

Surf
Nate tha' Great
06-24-2005, 08:42 PM
Bet, we don't want to give a free card to a 10-out hand like AQ. The reason to check behind here is if somehow we faced a tough decision when check-raised, but unless opponent is playing tilty or something then folding to a c/raise is very straightforward.
7ontheline
06-24-2005, 09:58 PM
Agreed, you can't take stats as the only consideration. People with lower aggression often take complete bs shots at the pot with checkraises and stuff - their lower AF is often due to their chasing and calling too much, but it doesn't necessarily say anything about how tricky they try to be.
wheelz
06-24-2005, 10:09 PM
Why don't you think it's an easy river bet if he checks to you on a blank?
Surfbullet
06-24-2005, 10:56 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Why don't you think it's an easy river bet if he checks to you on a blank?

[/ QUOTE ]

Sorry. Easy river bet on a blank.

[ QUOTE ]
Whether I bet the river or not depends on how tenacious I think he is...many players will call with AT or 66-99 etc.

[/ QUOTE ]

Was a mish-mashed sentence, after typing and deleting parts of 3 different sentences. They were(roughly):

Whether I bet the river or not depends on the card and the opponent, but it's usually an easy bet.

I bet the turn because many players will call with AT or 66-99-type hands.

Depending on how tenacious the opponent will be a factor in whether or not I decide to value-bet...those that will take AT to showdown etc will be value-bet more relentlessly /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Surf
PokerBob
06-25-2005, 02:48 AM
villain here is 54/10/1.8. IMO his pf raise range is AA-TT, AK-AJs. What's your play here?
Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is CO with T/images/graemlins/spade.gif, T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
<font color="#CC3333">UTG raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, UTG calls.

Flop: (7.40 SB) 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 2/images/graemlins/club.gif, 5/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
UTG checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG calls.

Turn: (4.70 BB) K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
UTG checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero .....</font> I bet, he raised, I folded. Meh.