Pushes!

[imported_machine]

I have just moved up from 20s to 30s and was told apart from the roll there is very little difference between the 2. the last few weeks i have become very aggressive when there is 5 left and blinds are high, i will push 2 cards higher than 10,suited k any ace any pair,obviously i take note of position an stacks etc,this was working very well at 20s, i know this is my first night at 30s but i am 10 buy ins down alot of 4ths and 5ths not many in money, do the pushes change with such a small increase in limit? maybe just a bad downswing but 10 buy ins down in 3 hours is not good, sorry for going on.

ben

[skipperbob]

[ QUOTE ]
5 left and blinds are high

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you sure that you are following BOTH of these criteria?

The purpose of this post is to deal with all the "Skipper-Bashers" out there (& they are legion) /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[imported_machine]

yep to the button, but dunno what happening

[Freudian]

My crystal ball tells me that if you push any ace on the bubble, there are a lot more 4th and 5th places in your future.

[imported_machine]

out of interest u decide all pushes by eastbays tool?

[Freudian]

Never used it.

What I do is pretty much based on conclusions of what I have observed happening on the tables when I play. And if there is one category of calls you see more often than others it is Ax. Which means pushing A2 is generally a bad idea.

[imported_machine]

thats true i guess a8 or better as its above average, and k8+ what else u push, you play cards or position. This is the only real area of my game which is weak.

[lastchance]

This is the wrong way to think about hands.

You need to get a list of hand ranges and figure out about how good hands are compared to each other.

There are some spots where I will happily push K8o 100% of the time, and there are other spots where I have no trouble laying it down.

99-AA, AK-AQ = 5%
66-AA, AK-AT = 10%
44+, A7+, KJ+ = 15%
A2+, 22+, K9+, QJ = 25%
22+, A2+, K8+, QT+ = 30%
22+, A2+, K2+, Q7+, JT = 40%
22+, A2+, K2+, Q2+, J7+, T9 = 50%
22+, A2+, K2+, Q2+, J2+, T5+, 96+, 86+, T2s+, 94s+, 84s+, 74s+, 64s+, 53s+, 43s+ = 70%

This is what I think hand ranges should look like for pushing. The less stack you have, the more hands you push. The less active players around, the more hands you push. The more tight players are, the more you push.

There are probably suited hands you can throw into the mix there, but I think that above chart is a great starting point.

[Freudian]

Depends on a lot of things.

How often I have pushed
How often they have called/the likelyhood of them calling now
Stacksizes
Position
Cards

[imported_machine]

those percentages how often u push them?

[dmmikkel]

Since when did pushing A2 become a bad idea?

your ace reduces the chance of someone calling with another ace.

I'd push A2 against a loose caller because my ace will almost always be infront and in the bubble there's usually not time for waiting for a better ace or a high pair.

I'd also push A2 against a tight opponent because he's going to fold anyway.

In the bubble you shouldn't worry too much about being called, because the caller will almost always have you beat anyway. It doesn't matter if you push AT or A2 if he calls with JJ

[lastchance]

They're the percentage of hands those ranges are in.

Out of 100% of hands, AQ is in the best 5%. AT is in the best 10%, etc.

And A2 is often a push, but also often a fold, IMHO. Again, depends on stack sizes, position, and likelihood of getting called.

[Freudian]

[ QUOTE ]

In the bubble you shouldn't worry too much about being called, because the caller will almost always have you beat anyway. It doesn't matter if you push AT or A2 if he calls with JJ

[/ QUOTE ]

I think that is the wrong attitude. Since an Ace is by far the most common card in your opponents calling range, pushing marginal aces is worse than pushing 98s.

It is possible that opponents that love to call with any ace are rare at some buyin, but at the lower limits you see it all the time. And it certainly matter if you push AT or A2 if he calls with A6.

[curtains]

[ QUOTE ]
I have just moved up from 20s to 30s and was told apart from the roll there is very little difference between the 2. the last few weeks i have become very aggressive when there is 5 left and blinds are high, i will push 2 cards higher than 10,suited k any ace any pair,obviously i take note of position an stacks etc,this was working very well at 20s, i know this is my first night at 30s but i am 10 buy ins down alot of 4ths and 5ths not many in money, do the pushes change with such a small increase in limit? maybe just a bad downswing but 10 buy ins down in 3 hours is not good, sorry for going on.

ben

[/ QUOTE ]

I believe that every level is stronger than the one below it, regardless of what you might hear. The level of difference is generally magnified the higher up you go, however the 33s are definitely somewhat tougher than the 22s.

[lastchance]

98s?! I mean, A2 isn't a great hand, especially compared to the awesomeness that is AT, but I think it's a very big leak to push 98s over A2, and a leak to push JTs over A2.

[imported_machine]

obviously relevant to position and stack size, but like top 15% if ur chip leader, 25% if ur middle and like top 30% plus if ur short stacked?

[Freudian]

I'm sure someone with more patience can run simulations of how well 98s and A2 do against different calling ranges.

I think you will find that A2 is not particularly strong when people call you down with A5/A6. Of course one could argue that you shouldn't steal blinds from players like that, I guess.

[lastchance]

Actually, the wider the range your opponents are, the better 98s is, and the worse A2o is. If you're opponents aren't calling A7 or A8, you should be pushing them both anyway, and as ranges get wider, 98s goes up in value quite a bit less than other things.

I actually push a lot more when I'm lower and middle than big stack. Big stack bullying doesn't work, therefore I don't do it much. Blinds mean more when you've got a smaller stack.

[imported_machine]

when you steal do u move all in as well or just min raise? if u miss flop you check or bet?

[curtains]

Most of the time it's better to have A2, because pepole will be less likely to call because one ace is dead. Against a lot of ranges this difference is very signifigant and makes it better than 98s even though 98s tends to do slightly better against some ranges. I don't even know the hand in question, didnt even read it, but just giving overall view of the concept.

[lastchance]

Wow, this is all hard. It's all situational.

When I steal, I generally either raise 3x BB or push. I wouldn't raise 3x BB at a table where people will push over me and rely on the bubble, but it works at the low-levels. I think pushing gives you maximum FE.

If I miss flop OOP, I generally bet rag boards and check boards with aces, kings, etc. If I miss flop in position, I'm raising pretty much any hand I raised with preflop.

[imported_machine]

thanks for help guys, think ill tighten up a bit when i chip leader or biggish stack, not overpush in general. What i said prob top 15 if im big stack,top 25 if im middle and top 30 if short stacked. and dont wanna be pushin more than twice in row unless i want a call. think thats any better than before?

[lastchance]

If you pick up AK and AQ back to back, you're pushing both. If you pick up a series of good hands, you want to push most of them, if not all of them.

And I tend to push a lot more when I'm shortstacked. With 5x BB on the button, I'll push a K7s that I'm normally not pushing with 10-12x BB.

[Jeoke]

[ QUOTE ]
thanks for help guys, think ill tighten up a bit when i chip leader or biggish stack, not overpush in general. What i said prob top 15 if im big stack,top 25 if im middle and top 30 if short stacked. and dont wanna be pushin more than twice in row unless i want a call. think thats any better than before?

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think you should be playing like that. Assuming you play at party there are many times when you have to push with worse than the 30% when your short stacked. Your plan might be the best in an ideal situation but when you have a small stack, the blinds are increasing, your in position, and everyone has folded to you, you should consider stealing while you can. Even if you dont have that great a hand. If you don't the blinds might eat you, or you wont get a good enough hand(the worse your position the better hand you need)/chance to steal(people not folding to you) again before the blind comes.

And of course if the blind gets to you after it just went up you probably just lost quite a bit of FE which is never good.