Tens of thousands of hands and I'm still lost with AQ UI/rag flop.

[A_C_Slater]

Opponents are loose and passive.


Paradise Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: AC is UTG+1 with Q/images/graemlins/club.gif, A/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">AC raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP2 calls, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, BB calls.

Flop: (6.50 SB) 9/images/graemlins/club.gif, 5/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 7/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">AC bets</font>, MP2 calls, BB calls.

Turn: (4.75 BB) 3/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">AC bets</font>, MP2 calls, BB calls.

River: (7.75 BB) K/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
BB checks, AC checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 bets</font>, BB folds, AC folds.

Final Pot: 8.75 BB


Do you just shut down on the turn in these situations? The flop is still standard right?

[aK13]

I might call the river. Button might be bluffing a busted flush draw.

The rest is pretty standard.

[stillbr]

id call the river.

[A_C_Slater]

Call the river?

Wow. I would never consider that. I posted this mostly to get input on the turn bet. I need more consenus on this, should I really be calling the river after a loose passive bet with Ace high?

[SmileyEH]

If I had no read on the player I'd call the river. Turn bet is standard IMO.

-SmileyEH

[SmileyEH]

Peeling on the flop and folding the turn is a very advanced play used often at 2/4.

-SmileyEH

[A_C_Slater]

[ QUOTE ]
Peeling on the flop and folding the turn is a very advanced play used often at 2/4.

-SmileyEH

[/ QUOTE ]

^^This is sarcasm.

Right?

I've been running so bad that I'm losing my sense of humor and doubting everything so I have to ask.

[jskills]

Against one opponent, I bet the turn. Two opponents makes it read dependant on how to proceed. More people in the pot than that probably means you're not going to accomplish anything by betting.

I believe there is lots of money to be lost in over card situations like this. There is also a lot to be won. You really can't mess with the style on how to play them ...

[SmileyEH]

Heh, I meant the players calling you on the flop will fold the turn often enough for a bet to be profitable - remember if you check you'll call a bet anyway.

-SmileyEH

[A_C_Slater]

[ QUOTE ]
Heh, I meant the players calling you on the flop will fold the turn often enough for a bet to be profitable - remember if you check you'll call a bet anyway.

-SmileyEH

[/ QUOTE ]

If I did decide to check and MP2 bet and BB folded I certainly would not call. Maybe this is a leak, but I sometimes do it.

6 outs at 7 to 1 and getting 5.75 to call?

[SmileyEH]

I didn't look at the size of the pot, but because calling and folding are so close based just on pot odds makes a bet still look good. If the EV of calling is almost 0, then the EV of betting is certainly positive because you will pick up the pot a very small percentage of the time. I doubt you are raised here more than 5 or 10% of the time, and you'll pick this pot up probably 15% of the time, and be called by draws and hands you will draw out on a decent percentage of the time.

Against opponents that don't push edges hard enough the easiest strategy is just bet bet bet.

-SmileyEH

[A_C_Slater]

SmileyEH,

If raised on the turn by MP2 and BB folds do you call?

[SmileyEH]

[ QUOTE ]
SmileyEH,

If raised on the turn by MP2 and BB folds do you call?

[/ QUOTE ]

It depends /images/graemlins/smile.gif. If he's loose passive no, but if he is capable of raising one pair or semi bluffing, yes.

-SmileyEH

[chesspain]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
SmileyEH,

If raised on the turn by MP2 and BB folds do you call?

[/ QUOTE ]

It depends /images/graemlins/smile.gif. If he's loose passive no, but if he is capable of raising one pair or semi bluffing, yes.


[/ QUOTE ]

Even if he's a floater that seems like a risky proposition, getting just over 7:1 and with unclear outs. And this assumes that you're not calling a final bet on the river UI, right?

[joker122]

[ QUOTE ]
Call the river?

Wow. I would never consider that. I posted this mostly to get input on the turn bet. I need more consenus on this, should I really be calling the river after a loose passive bet with Ace high?

[/ QUOTE ]

well you've checked it to him on the river. what do most players do in that spot, regardless of thier holding?

he only needs to be bluffing 1 in 8 times...

[A_C_Slater]

I know he only needs to be bluffing 1 in 8 times. But after calling preflop the flop and turn I don't think it's even 1 in 20 times he's betting with a worse hand.

[joker122]

[ QUOTE ]
I know he only needs to be bluffing 1 in 8 times. But after calling preflop the flop and turn I don't think it's even 1 in 20 times he's betting with a worse hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

this is like way off. he'll have a missed flush draw at least 1 in 10.