'Interesting' Hand vs Mr. Wood and Another

[Moozh]

BB's name leads me to believe he's our very own Chairman Wood. I doubt he knows who I am. We've had some fun tangles over the past few orbits, so I hope at this point he respects me as a good player.

CO is a fairly tight passive guy. Haven't played many hands with him though.

What do you think of my play, and what could Mr. Wood have?

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with A/images/graemlins/club.gif, 4/images/graemlins/club.gif.
UTG calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+2 calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP2 calls, Hero calls, CO calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, BB checks.

Flop: (6.33 SB) 2/images/graemlins/club.gif, 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(6 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, UTG calls, UTG+2 folds, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 raises</font>, Hero calls, CO folds, BB calls, UTG folds.

Turn: (6.66 BB) K/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, BB calls, MP2 calls.

River: (12.66 BB) 4/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
BB checks, MP2 checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BB raises</font>, MP2 folds, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 16.66 BB

[damaniac]

I need more hand-reading exercises...

His flop bet and subsequent call could be a flush draw, no 3-bet to induce calls behind him? If he had a raggedy two pair or something, I'd expect he'd 3-bet to protect his hand. Same thing with any kind of made hand like a straight or set.

Turn is strange, I don't think there are many draws he is calling with at those odds (9:2) with the flush out there, unless he has A /images/graemlins/heart.gif. Could be a set although I'd really expect him to 3-bet that on the flop.

Him waking up on the river suggests he either has a flush or a boat. Either way I don't think he's raising this board with a worse 4, and there's only 1 left in the deck anyway. So either a flush (probably the nut flush) where he didn't want to scare anyone on the turn, or a set where he held off the flop 3-bet to raise a blank turn and trap more people.

As for your play, I'm kind of apt to fold the flop at 5:1 with the bettor still to act. Only outs I love are the 4, may be splitting (or losing) a 5, and those hearts taint our outs and give off redraws.

I dunno about the turn semi-bluff/hand protection, I suspect given the pot size it's not +EV but I'm not good with these.

I don't mind the river bet as while I suspect BB isn't going to call with many worse hands, MP2 will most of the time, so that makes up for those times that you get check-raised.

[JacksonTens]

Im interested in the raise on the turn. Where you hunting for information or using the flush as a bluff?, If you were hunting 3-betting the flop with top pair may have been a better option. Then when you were raised (a common indicatior of better than top pair), I would have looked to fold. You were against a good opponent, with flush and straight draws out and you had neither.

JT /images/graemlins/spade.gif

[Petteri]

Why did you raise turn?

BB can be in wide range of hands, but I think two pair is most likely holding in the river. But Mr. Wood can have virtually anything.

[jgorham]

Assuming MR. Wood is a good player (I don't know who that is), then I think it is pretty safe to say he most likely has a weaker 4 than yours. There would be no reason for him not to raise the flop or turn with a set or a flush. (The only reason would be to not face MP2 with two bets, yet that is what he did with his checkraise on the river). I go ahead and 3bet here.

As far as the turn, I don't particularly like the raise, since you can't safely fold to a 3bet. Would be better to just 3bet the flop.

[Chairman Wood]

Don't know if it will help but
[ QUOTE ]
Turn: (6.66 BB) K (3 players)
BB checks, MP2 bets, Hero raises, BB thinks for a long time and calls, MP2 calls.


[/ QUOTE ]

[Chairman Wood]

I also swear I didn't call two there, either that or the pot was bigger I thought for sure if I remember correctly I was getting nearly 8 or 9 to 1.

[damaniac]

Sweet, I go to all that trouble to dissect your hand and give you credit for something good, and instead you screwed up and made a marginal or bad call on the turn with something weaker?

[Moozh]

Good replies so far. Let me go in to some of my thinking.

First off, I felt my biggest decision was on the flop. I actually paused for a while here thinking. I think an argument can be made for all 3 actions here. My first instinct was to fold for two more. I decided not to for a few reasons. First off, it's very likely I'm ahead here. The only hands I'm really worried about is a small pair. Couple that with the fact that it's a draw heavy board with which I have a gutshot, a slight shot at a pair of aces, and a backdoor flush draw, along with my top pair and I felt that folding would be pretty bad in this situation.

So, once I decided not to fold, I felt the real decision of the hand was to raise or call the flop. By this point my time was running a bit low so I didn't take too much time deciding. I decided to call because I felt raising wouldn't really protect my hand any more. Also, considering my hand was prone to being outdrawn, it seemed like a good idea to try and raise a turn blank.

Well, the turn wasn't really a blank, so maybe I shouldn't have raised. I did raise because I still felt there was a decent chance I was still ahead along with the possibility of using the king and the flush to fold a higher pocket pair.

BB's call on the turn was scary, but the river gave me almost the best card possible and at that point I was betting for pure value.

I should make it clear that I consider none of my decisions 'correct' and am definitely looking for advice on how else to play this.

[Chairman Wood]

[ QUOTE ]
Sweet, I go to all that trouble to dissect your hand and give you credit for something good, and instead you screwed up and made a marginal or bad call on the turn with something weaker?

[/ QUOTE ]
Give me a break I was 6 tabling. FWIW, I now know that I did have the best hand at the time, but during the hand I din't know that. I was giving Hero credit for the flush

[damaniac]

55/66?

[Moozh]

Hey! Glad you showed up. Just wanted to say that I was having a lot of fun playing with you at that table. You definitely had me thinking a few times there.

[Chairman Wood]

I don't raise the river with those hands

[Chairman Wood]

or call the turn

[damaniac]

Yeah that makes sense if you're giving villain credit for a flush. Two pair that filled up? Calling the turn with a set isn't much of a decision. Why no 3-bet on the flop, going to raise a safe turn card?

[Chairman Wood]

Also given that I gave him credit for the flush I shouldn't have called with the hand I had anyway but I did think I was getting about 8:1 IIRC (I am a dumbass

[Chairman Wood]

The might K4

[Moozh]

Oh, and when I was talking about my read on CO, I actually meant MP2.

[Moozh]

I'm going to bump this once for the day crowd because I'd really like some more opinions on how I played this.

[bakku]

I'd 3-bet the flop. Mr. Wood should have checked the flop.

[sk_man]

If 3-betting the flop gave you a free card on the turn, would you take it or bet again?

[Moozh]

If I were to 3-bet the flop, it would be with the definite intention of betting the turn and potentially betting the river as well.