rockrock
06-13-2005, 01:27 AM
Posting this here because the quality of posts are generally a higher quality than the tourney forum. I was hoping to hear from R. Zee, El Diablo, Fossilman, Paluka, Sklansky or other well respected posters about this hand.
My seat position at the final table was tough with 2 chip leaders to my left and a liberal blind defender in Devilfish with a smaller stack. This seat position was my first bad break of the tourney.
Blinds are 8k/16k with 2k ante. I had around 180k - 200k in chips. Everyone folds to me and I have TJ offsuit 1 off the button and raise to 50k. I considered going all-in here as Sklansky’s system recommends doing so with any two cards given my chip stack and the blinds. Allen Cunningham was in the BB, Devilfish in the SB and Fischman was right behind me.
My general feeling was that a 50k raise would either win the blinds or would be met with an all in re-raise (probably from Devilfish) at which point I would fold.
Naturally, Fischman cold called (very quickly). The flop came Queen high with 2 hearts. I bet 50k, he raised all in and I folded.
In retrospect, the 50k bet on the flop had to be weak. Another good tourney player agreed the bet was weak but another top player felt it was fine. Some suggested passing TJ pre-flop but I can't imagine this is correct. I was trying to win the tournament, not edge up in money. I'm guessing Scott had a hand like 77-TT or perhaps AQ. An Ace or King materializes on the flop and maybe he folds assuming he doesn’t have ace-big (and makes a pair). Perhaps an all-in preflop wins me the blinds as Fischman would be risking 1/3 of his stack to call.
As far as getting lucky to make the final table, I did make a set of Jacks versus Peter Alson's QQ (author of Confessions of an Ivy League BM and the new Stu Ungar book) on day 1 of the tournament when I had a medium to low stack.
I got lucky in different ways to make the final table. Every time I had AK I was against AQ or A9. I never had a certified tournament poker phenom at my table until we were down to 24. I won 2 coin flips the entire tournament to make the final table. I lost one coin flip at the final table after the Fischman debacle with AQ vs JJ and I was out.
I was unlucky at the final table to have the big chip stacks and best players directly to my left. I was convinced one of those three guys (Cunningham, Devilfish or Fischman) would win the bracelet because they were probably the best players and had what seemed to be the tigher players to their left.
For the entirety of the tournament, I was dealt AA once, KK once and QQ twice. Everyone (including me) had to get lucky to make the final table, but for me it wasn’t in busting big hands, winning coin flips for big pots or getting dealt a disproportion of big hands.
The WPT age has produced a poker populace that would sever their right arm off and throw it in the pot to call or raise all-in with AK. Many of the players are truly horrendous but there are many tough players as well.
I am left wondering about TJ off suit, and was curious what other posters with credentials here thought. Starting the final table with 12.75x the BB didn't leave much wiggle room with the big stacks to my left. In retrospect it would probably have been worth $500-$1000 to consult with a good poker theorist for an hour or so before the tournament. I considered this exact situation before the final table started and told myself I would shove with 8x the bb or less and raise around 3x BB in all other circumstances. I forgot to think about what I would do if cold-called by the button.
I have other comments on the ridiculousness that is televised poker if anyone is interested.
My seat position at the final table was tough with 2 chip leaders to my left and a liberal blind defender in Devilfish with a smaller stack. This seat position was my first bad break of the tourney.
Blinds are 8k/16k with 2k ante. I had around 180k - 200k in chips. Everyone folds to me and I have TJ offsuit 1 off the button and raise to 50k. I considered going all-in here as Sklansky’s system recommends doing so with any two cards given my chip stack and the blinds. Allen Cunningham was in the BB, Devilfish in the SB and Fischman was right behind me.
My general feeling was that a 50k raise would either win the blinds or would be met with an all in re-raise (probably from Devilfish) at which point I would fold.
Naturally, Fischman cold called (very quickly). The flop came Queen high with 2 hearts. I bet 50k, he raised all in and I folded.
In retrospect, the 50k bet on the flop had to be weak. Another good tourney player agreed the bet was weak but another top player felt it was fine. Some suggested passing TJ pre-flop but I can't imagine this is correct. I was trying to win the tournament, not edge up in money. I'm guessing Scott had a hand like 77-TT or perhaps AQ. An Ace or King materializes on the flop and maybe he folds assuming he doesn’t have ace-big (and makes a pair). Perhaps an all-in preflop wins me the blinds as Fischman would be risking 1/3 of his stack to call.
As far as getting lucky to make the final table, I did make a set of Jacks versus Peter Alson's QQ (author of Confessions of an Ivy League BM and the new Stu Ungar book) on day 1 of the tournament when I had a medium to low stack.
I got lucky in different ways to make the final table. Every time I had AK I was against AQ or A9. I never had a certified tournament poker phenom at my table until we were down to 24. I won 2 coin flips the entire tournament to make the final table. I lost one coin flip at the final table after the Fischman debacle with AQ vs JJ and I was out.
I was unlucky at the final table to have the big chip stacks and best players directly to my left. I was convinced one of those three guys (Cunningham, Devilfish or Fischman) would win the bracelet because they were probably the best players and had what seemed to be the tigher players to their left.
For the entirety of the tournament, I was dealt AA once, KK once and QQ twice. Everyone (including me) had to get lucky to make the final table, but for me it wasn’t in busting big hands, winning coin flips for big pots or getting dealt a disproportion of big hands.
The WPT age has produced a poker populace that would sever their right arm off and throw it in the pot to call or raise all-in with AK. Many of the players are truly horrendous but there are many tough players as well.
I am left wondering about TJ off suit, and was curious what other posters with credentials here thought. Starting the final table with 12.75x the BB didn't leave much wiggle room with the big stacks to my left. In retrospect it would probably have been worth $500-$1000 to consult with a good poker theorist for an hour or so before the tournament. I considered this exact situation before the final table started and told myself I would shove with 8x the bb or less and raise around 3x BB in all other circumstances. I forgot to think about what I would do if cold-called by the button.
I have other comments on the ridiculousness that is televised poker if anyone is interested.