HU: Defense against min-raise every hand

[minwoo]

In a HU tourney, what is your approach/defense against an opponent who min-raises every hand on the button?

[smcannon]

Wait for a decent hand, then push. Also, pick up an aggressive pace yourself. If you just let him beat you out of all your blinds you might as well just call it quits. Every one of his hands can't be good.

If you pick up an aggressive pace, you might just get a chance to see the flop. Odds are though, from my experience, aggression vs aggression = all in fest.

[Newt_Buggs]

unless he's super loose he's shooting himself in the foot. You don't need a good hand, just reraise all in once you realize what he is doing and steal 3BB with no showdown.

[Moonsugar]

Waiting for a big hand and pushing is really bad. You need to play almost every hand. Whether you call or raise depends on lots of things.

Edit: Sklansky goes into this situation a lot in his books.

[Rolen]

I use that tactic (min raise every button) heads up in cash games + SNGs and do well out of it, and i'll tell you this much : If you call at all, you're playing right into my hands.

[minwoo]

[ QUOTE ]
I use that tactic (min raise every button) heads up in cash games + SNGs and do well out of it, and i'll tell you this much : If you call at all, you're playing right into my hands.

[/ QUOTE ]

So what move would I need to make to offset your strategy? Re-raise every hand? (not re-raise all-in)

[JC21]

Bump.

I am interested in both the effectiveness and the defense against this strategy.

[minwoo]

[ QUOTE ]
Bump.

I am interested in both the effectiveness and the defense against this strategy.

[/ QUOTE ]

[hummusx]

This is really not that hard, especially early on. If he really is raising 100% of the time, and it's only a minraise, all he's done is doubled the stakes for each hand. You still have all the power in this situation.

[flyby4553]

He's done more than raise the stakes. He puts you in a situation where if you call your on the defensive every hand. In a cash game you can just move in with a halfway decent hand and most of the time you'll take it down. In a tournament/SNG I think you need to tighten up a bit more but still just take the aggression away from him by pushing and eventually he'll be forced to let up or he's going to fold away his entire stack.

[45suited]

If I'm playing heads-up and a guy is mini-raising virtually every hand, I just push a couple times with anything that is over 50% versus a random hand. That'll slow him down, plus you've picked up some extra chips.

If he calls and you lose, thems the breaks. Sometimes you'll push and he'll actually have something. You can't let him just run you over though.

[Dorez]

[ QUOTE ]
This is really not that hard, especially early on. If he really is raising 100% of the time, and it's only a minraise, all he's done is doubled the stakes for each hand. You still have all the power in this situation.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is what I do as well. I'm just betting for value given my position. I'm more likely to win given my position heads up. You're in a favourable position and know you're going to win most of the time if you can read your opponent well.

I would also do this if I had bigger stack than my opponent. It's kind of saying, "This means more to you, than it does to me".

In my opinion, if you're waiting for that one big hand to push, you're going to lose most of the time. If you let me take your blinds, then all of a sudden you push all in, it doesn't take a genius to know you've finally caught something and are making a stand. I'll fold and min-raise you again next hand.


What you can do is, min-raise yourself, be a bit more aggressive. You're letting him take control of the pace of the game. Call and see the flop with any 2 cards. Be a bit more aggressive after the flop. You're a big man and "you're not going to be pushed around".

[45suited]

[ QUOTE ]
Call and see the flop with any 2 cards. Be a bit more aggressive after the flop. You're a big man and "you're not going to be pushed around".

[/ QUOTE ]

I really don't like calling. Pushing any two is better than just calling IMO. The vast majority of the time, an any two push is causing this guy to fold and you've sent the message to him to slow down. Calling is really bad IMO, especially at the high blinds you're usually at.

[minwoo]

I've tried pushing over the top of a min-raise many times and what usually happens is:

1. the opponent just folds
2. he finally calls and holds a monster

I don't think a re-raise push is the greatest strategy to use early in a HU tourney. The blinds are just too small. It's not worth playing "big man" over the miniscule blinds and risking your whole chip stack.

The great thing about the min-raise every hand strategy is that the person using it can have any two, ranging from 72 to AA and there's no way to tell.

What do you guys think about a min re-raise every hand as a counter?

[45suited]

I thought that you were referring to the last two in a 10 man SNG, in which case the mini-raiser folding to your push is a great result.

[Rolen]

The idea behind it (or at least, the idea behind me doing it) is not that you're raising the stakes (almost) or that you're putting your opponent on the defensive, it's that you're raising the stakes WHEN YOU'RE IN POSITION..The effect of which cannot be overstated. Imagine playing a HU match where the blinds are 2/4 when you're on the button and 1/2 when you're not. You'd have to suck big time to be a loser in that game.

Min raising back every hand is counter-productive, it's playing into the original raisers hand..Now we're playing 3/6 when he's on the button!

[durron597]

[ QUOTE ]
In a HU tourney, what is your approach/defense against an opponent who min-raises every hand on the button?

[/ QUOTE ]

How many blinds are in play? What are the relative stack sizes? What is the blind structure?

[Dorez]

[ QUOTE ]

I really don't like calling. Pushing any two is better than just calling IMO. The vast majority of the time, an any two push is causing this guy to fold and you've sent the message to him to slow down. Calling is really bad IMO, especially at the high blinds you're usually at.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't like the push. This is easy to overcome if you're the raiser. If this was me, I'd continue raise, but not as often, but I'd still do it. If my opponent starts pushing all in every other hand, that's a favourable position. I'm risking 1 BB for any 2 cards, he's risking his whole stack with any 2 cards. All ins will work everytime but once.

[45suited]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't like the push. This is easy to overcome if you're the raiser. If this was me, I'd continue raise, but not as often, but I'd still do it. If my opponent starts pushing all in every other hand, that's a favourable position. I'm risking 1 BB for any 2 cards, he's risking his whole stack with any 2 cards. All ins will work everytime but once.

[/ QUOTE ]

Say we're heads up in level 6. We start with t4000 each. You raise my blind to t600. I push, you fold. Now, I'm at t4600 and you're at t3400. I push the next hand, you fold. I'm at t4900, you're at t3100. You say you'll continue mini-raising. Okay, now you mini-raise again, I push, you fold. Now I'm at t5500 and you're at t2500.

Mini-raising with the idea that you'll fold to a push without premium cards is a losing strategy IMO. You'd be better off just pushing every hand from the button (which really is not that bad a strategy at high blind levels). Now when I have over 2:1 on you, I might be more selective and not let you double up easily. But I'm still pushing into you very often when I'm on the button. Mini-raising just twice in level 6 and then folding to an all-in leaks huge amounts of chips.

[minwoo]

[ QUOTE ]

Min raising back every hand is counter-productive, it's playing into the original raisers hand..Now we're playing 3/6 when he's on the button!

[/ QUOTE ]

Very good point!

[wuwei]

Well, it depends on the stack size/blinds. If the blinds are smaller and you have some room to play, seeing a flop once in a while isn't that bad. One thing to note is that being out of position can actually benefit you. You have the right of first bluff at the pot on the flop. If your opponent is the type to fold when he misses and you bet into him, this is a winning proposition. Another thing to consider is a c/r all in when you catch a nice piece of the flop. In addition to picking up the 4 bets that go in preflop, you can also pick up his continuation bet unless he has a hand.

When the your stack:blind ratio is smaller, calling isn't as appealing. I recommend coming over the top enough to maintain/build your stack. The amount I come over the top depends on my estimation of his calling standards. Also, waiting for a real hand to come over the top is not a good idea. You'll get blinded away too often.

[Dorez]

[ QUOTE ]


Say we're heads up in level 6. We start with t4000 each. You raise my blind to t600. I push, you fold. Now, I'm at t4600 and you're at t3400. I push the next hand, you fold. I'm at t4900, you're at t3100. You say you'll continue mini-raising. Okay, now you mini-raise again, I push, you fold. Now I'm at t5500 and you're at t2500.

Mini-raising with the idea that you'll fold to a push without premium cards is a losing strategy IMO. You'd be better off just pushing every hand from the button (which really is not that bad a strategy at high blind levels). Now when I have over 2:1 on you, I might be more selective and not let you double up easily. But I'm still pushing into you very often when I'm on the button. Mini-raising just twice in level 6 and then folding to an all-in leaks huge amounts of chips.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good point, but I believe I'd widen my calling range in this situation to be ace/king/possibly q or jack high and any PP. I also just realized we're talking about Heads Up tourny's, I've been thinking about how I play in SNG's heads up where I haven't faced much opposition using the min-raise strategy.