I had fish for dinner 5-10 NL hand

[Ulysses]

I am CO $3761 .
Wild LAG is button $1484 .
BB (bad, but not too aggro) $3122 .50.

I open for $35 w/ 33. Button and BB call.

Flop 3h 4h Jc

BB bets $10. I raise to $75. Button has been attacking weak moves with huge overbets, so I'm hoping to get him to bite. He folds for once, though. BB calls.

Turn (3h 4h Jc) 6h

BB bets $95. I really don't want to face a big reraise here. I call.

River (3h 4h Jc 6h) Js

He checks. I bet pot $450.

I feel like I flubbed up this hand. Maybe I should have eaten meat instead.

(Edited to add my hand!)

[whitelime]

What's your hand?

[Garland]

You had 33 in this hand.

If you think there's a big chance that button will attack a weak move, then calling the $10 flop bet seems like a viable option as I don't think most people will put the move with air when there's a bet and a raise.

As it is, I think you played it fine as BB reeks of a flush draw on the flop. I could not see the hand history; did the opponent show a flush or a weak J? If BB had a flush, he failed to protect very well.

Garland

[BluffTHIS!]

You should have raised the flop a little more to like 95. And if he did have the flush he did a poor job of protecting it indeed. On the river you are supposed to bet as much as you think he will call, which makes 450 seems too much as I would have bet around 250. Hopefully he didn't checkraise you and show you J4s.

[Jason Strasser]

On the flop I'd be tempted to call if the flop was less coordinated to see if I could get the button to bite, but on this flop I think its in your best interest to take control of it and charge the bb for any type of flush draw/straight draw possibly mixed in with a pair type hand that is fairly typcial of this min bet.

On the turn your opponent donkbets. I really dont understand what you are scared of here. Red meat. Some ideas: 5(h?)6, 34, Ah5x, etc. That is my ballpark. A flush is generally going to c/r the turn or at least ck call turn lead river. I think you should put in a nice raise here for a few reasons:

1) Well you're probably ahead
2) If he has a flush and decides to reraise, well he's bad and will probably give you necessary odds to draw to a boat. The same donk who min bets the flop is the type to not charge you nearly enough for your draw. I dont understand why are you are scared about a reraise in this spot.

3) Very often the opponent who donkbets is protecting his weak 2 pair or is semibluffing. In all cases you want money going in the pot on the turn... Waiting till the river to get your value bet in seems wrong.

Im about 99% your opponent folded to your river pot because he was probably counterfitted or missed his semibluff. If he my analysis is way off and he had some flop overpair or baby flush, then I like a smaller bet. Maybe he'll be a hero even and call with a six. Regardless I think you need to extract value on the turn and then maybe get in a smaller bet on the river.

-Jason

[PassiveCaller]

The turn seems like a blocking bet with the Ah or Kh with some sort of a pair, or maybe a straight draw, which by the river we hope will be a jack. After he checks the river we know he doesn't have a flush.

So, Ah-4, Ah-3, Kh-4,Kh-3 those will only call smaller bets most likely. Ah-J, Kh-J will probably call a 450 bet, but... maybe raise a smaller bet? (player dependent and probably the key to the correct action)

Other route: Oversized bet. the 4,3 hands will fold... Is he good enough to get off here from the Jack? If he's poor and not aggro enough to reraise a small river bet I might go with this route.

Betting 450 if he has the jack I'm almost certain he'll just call. So I hope that's what he had.

[Ulysses]

I like a weak raise on the flop much better than a call because if the button doesn't bite, if I call it will be tough to build a big enough pot.

On the turn, I agree with your thoughts. I was playing three tables and overall there was so much over-re-raising going on across the three that I just got too worried here about him having a big flush and blowing me off my hand. I'm not positive, but I think I need to take that risk and build a bigger pot here.

On the river, I wasn't sure what he had, so I just went default and bet the pot. He called w/ KJ.

[soah]

Did he have the Kh?

[Ulysses]

Kd Jh

[Ray Zee]

you needed to play for alot more on the flop and if you lose them so be it. on the turn is not the place to put your dough in. on the river its good.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
you needed to play for alot more on the flop and if you lose them so be it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was thinking the small raise was the best way to induce a big play from one of these guys. Later action (I played a 3k pot all-in on the flop w/ button v. his one pair) proved this thought to be correct.

[ QUOTE ]
on the turn is not the place to put your dough in.

[/ QUOTE ]

OK, that was my main Q. With these stacks, I was thinking maybe I did want a little more on the turn. But I have been eating more fish and am more calm now.

[ QUOTE ]
on the river its good.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good.

[queenhigh]

did you consider overbetting the river?

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
did you consider overbetting the river?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes.

[Jason Strasser]

Ray,

Can you explain why you dont want $$ going in on the turn?

[Ray Zee]

because if $$$$ goes in on the turn you are a 3.4 to one dog to win and not likely to get a chance to see it happen.

[Tony.T]

Who cares?

[kagame]

do you usually check behind with a set in a big pot when the obvious draw hits? (when someones calling looks like a draw of course)

i do and have been criticized for it, in this forum for one.

i love calling the river and seeing people get upset they didnt make more with their straight! but i wonder how much value im losing...at least i dont ever have to fold sets...

[queenhigh]

cool. me too.