Ribbo PLO/8 hand - Optimal play discussion

[otctrader]

http://www.pokerhand.org/index.php?page=view&hand=74054

Flop play

a) Is this a mandatory flop to pot OOP versus two opponents with the flush draw on the board, or is it better to check (planning on getting aggressive on a safe turn)? Two things I hate here are the flush draw showing and check from the preflop aggressor. Too weak/tight to suggest checking?

b) If an average Party opponent (no specific reads) comes over the top on the flop after your pot sized bet, are you ever laying this down? You're obviously only a big dog to a straight with better redraws, top set w/flush draw, or flush draw/backdoor low/piece of board.

Turn play (assume heads up, ignore the disconnect guy)

c) Put yourself in the opponent's shoes with top set and low draw facing Ribbo's pot sized bet. If you know he's got the straight, you are a 43/56 dog, potentially much worse if he also has a draw to low and/or flush. Obviously you're committed on a call so it's all in or fold. What's the correct play here, and what's the percentage likelihood you put him on the straight?

Thx for the hand post Ribbo - you learn a lot by retroactively tweaking hand combos at that site.

[Wintermute]

http://www.pokerhand.org/index.php?page=view&hand=74054

you know you've "arrived" when someone ELSE is sharing your HH's...

Flop play

a) Is this a mandatory flop to pot OOP versus two opponents with the flush draw on the board, or is it better to check (planning on getting aggressive on a safe turn)? Two things I hate here are the flush draw showing and check from the preflop aggressor. Too weak/tight to suggest checking?


If you don't get as much money in on the flop as possible, you don't like money.


b) If an average Party opponent (no specific reads) comes over the top on the flop after your pot sized bet, are you ever laying this down? You're obviously only a big dog to a straight with better redraws, top set w/flush draw, or flush draw/backdoor low/piece of board.


lay it down? hell no, I'm reraising



Turn play (assume heads up, ignore the disconnect guy)

c) Put yourself in the opponent's shoes with top set and low draw facing Ribbo's pot sized bet. If you know he's got the straight, you are a 43/56 dog, potentially much worse if he also has a draw to low and/or flush. Obviously you're committed on a call so it's all in or fold. What's the correct play here, and what's the percentage likelihood you put him on the straight?

I think I just call. prob fold a river if the board doesn't pair

Thx for the hand post Ribbo - you learn a lot by retroactively tweaking hand combos at that site.

[Big Dave D]

I suspect,although I havent done the math in detail, that against a moderately sane opponent, this would be a neutral to slightly -ev push on the flop. Which means that you could easily pass it, or not really care either way.

The reason for this is that high only hands are much more vulnerable in plo8b, just because the draw picks up some equity from some kind of backdoor low draw.

I have a more extreme example at my blog here (http://internetpokerpro.blogspot.com/2005/01/radar-down.html) where it was clear I should have passed the made hand against a draw.

gl

Dave D

[Jorge10]

Hey thats me, but anyway, this is what I was thinking. Ribbo kept stealing pots, he knew the guy had aces because of the obvious raise preflop, he could have been pushing two pair on the flop or even a smaller set so the flop bet meant nothing to me. The turn bet basically meant he indeed had the straight so thats bad, but I had a low draw and a shot at the full house, if you run it in the calculator you will know that he will scoop me about 38% of the time, I had already commited about 40% of my chips, I figured its still Ribbo so I got a shot, and worse case I am only getting scooped about 40% of the time, worth a shot with the amount of chips ive already commited. The fact that a low draw was possible made this call possible on the turn, had another face card come on the turn I would have layed it down probably.