Live 3/6 in Nawlins...is my friend a nit?

[squeek12]

My friend and I debated this hand in which I think he needs to bet the river.

Button is pretty solid, but passive...will not bet his pretty good hands, but will bet big ones.

BB is a fish.

Guy is MP1 with J /images/graemlins/diamond.gif9 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif
I am MP2 with Q /images/graemlins/diamond.gifQ /images/graemlins/club.gif

Preflop: folds to Guy who open limps, I raise, button calls, BB calls.

Flop: 10 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif8 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif3 /images/graemlins/spade.gif
BB checks, Guy checks, I bet, button calls, BB calls, Guy raises, I 3-bet, button calls, BB calls, Guy calls.

Turn: 10 /images/graemlins/club.gif
checks around

River: 5 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

Checks around again...

I think Guy needs to bet this river. I don't think there's much of an argument for not betting, but he insisted it was the right play..and he wasn't check raising.

The only reason I am posting this semi-boring hand is to prove him wrong.

Comments on my play would be helpful too.

[private joker]

Horrible. He's check-raising the flop for value because he has a monster draw. He just made one of his draws, and despite it not being the nuts, he sure has enough value to bet this river. The decision is whether to 3-bet or just call a raise. I just call it. But there's no excuse for not betting this river. He'll get paid off by PLENTY of worse hands.

[Nick C]

It so happens that I've played plenty of live 3/6 in Nawlins.

If I were Guy, I would at least consider capping the flop. (And I'm pretty sure I actually would.)

On the turn, if I'd capped the flop, I'd consider betting. What might stop me is that I'd be worried you'd raise and drive out the other players.

On the river, I'm betting. If for some reason I decided not to bet, I'd checkraise.

For your part, on the turn, I'd bet.

[squeek12]

I didn't bet the turn thinking that there was an excellent chance I was being check/raised by posibbly more than one person. I think betting the turn is correct for a player who can fold to a raise, but I'm not sure I would have. It's bad I know, but I tend to play 3/6 live a bit results oriented since I'm playing above my bankroll.

[bakku]

[ QUOTE ]
I think Guy needs to bet this river. I don't think there's much of an argument for not betting, but he insisted it was the right play..and he wasn't check raising.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your friend isn't very good at poker. Or hand reading.

[Waloonga]

I agree. If the Villian has hit TTT, he will raise your bet on the turn. Thus, betting will provide you with more info, and hopefully more money.

[jskills]

An easy river bet.

[Octopus]

If you do not bet this river, then you should not open limp with this hand.

[brettbrettr]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think there's much of an argument for not betting,

[/ QUOTE ]

There isn't: No argument for him not betting the river; none for you not betting the turn.

[squeek12]

Shouldn't I expect to be check/raised or raised by the button a whole lot on the turn if I bet here? If I do bet and get raised, I have to fold. The button was a decent player, weak/tight best estimate(too loose preflop though), I put him directly on a hand like AT or KT. I'm not sure what else he could have played this way except two diamonds.

I'm not arguing that this isn't a bet with no reads, but I felt pretty confident that at least one person HAD to have a T with the way this hand played out.

[Octopus]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm not arguing that this isn't a bet with no reads, but I felt pretty confident that at least one person HAD to have a T with the way this hand played out.

[/ QUOTE ]

If so, then that person played pretty badly on the flop.

[squeek12]

This is 3/6 live in New Orleans....New Orleans for God's sake. If you've never played 3/6, 6/12, 10/20 in New Orleans, you must make it a point to do so. Almost no one plays their hands well here. It seems that no one at the table is capable of raising preflop, hardly ever postflop, and certainly no 3-betting without a Royal Flush.

My point is that I am about 60% sure that button has a T, and maybe 25% that BB has one. So I say I was about 85% sure that someone had a T. I knew my friend was holding a big draw.

[Octopus]

[ QUOTE ]
This is 3/6 live in New Orleans....New Orleans for God's sake. If you've never played 3/6, 6/12, 10/20 in New Orleans, you must make it a point to do so. Almost no one plays their hands well here. It seems that no one at the table is capable of raising preflop, hardly ever postflop, and certainly no 3-betting without a Royal Flush.

[/ QUOTE ]

Playing there was fun, the one time I was in, but the lighting is horrible. I had trouble reading cards on the other end of the table, much less seeing my opponents.

[damaniac]

If you are that certain fine. However, given my experience live 3/6 games, the other two players are just as likely to have: gutshots, flush draws, bd flush draws, lone A high overcards, little pocket pairs, an 8, a 3, etc. Absent reads, the likelihood they have one of these hands well outweighs the time someone has a T.

[bozlax]

[ QUOTE ]
My point is that I am about 60% sure that button has a T, and maybe 25% that BB has one. So I say I was about 85% sure that someone had a T. I knew my friend was holding a big draw.

[/ QUOTE ]

So, what was your plan on the turn? Why not just open-fold, figuring that SOMEBODY would bet one of the next 2 streets?

I'm fine with your bet/folding the turn, but I think you've gotta bet it. Among other things, is your buddy good enough to not fold to your bet when the board pairs (based on the way he finished the hand, I think the answer is "no")?

As for your friend, he's gotta bet this river. He'll get called by that T, and anybody that had the boat had it on the turn.

Edit: I just looked back at the hand. There's no boat, here. And the river certainly didn't make one for anybody.