Folding a PP to overcards - weak or just right? [Archive]

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7ontheline

06-10-2005, 03:09 AM

I folded both of these hands, where both an A and K fell on the flop over my pocket pair. Does anyone call or raise instead?

In hand 1, the button is a typical bad 5/10 player (40/10/~1) and UTG is just a loose idiot.

Hand 1

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is CO with J/images/graemlins/heart.gif, J/images/graemlins/club.gif.
UTG calls, 1 fold, Hero raises, Button calls, SB calls, 1 fold, UTG calls.

Flop: (9 SB) 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif, K/images/graemlins/heart.gif, A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (4 players)
SB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets, Button raises, SB folds, UTG calls, Hero folds.

For Hand 2, BB is kinda passive (29/6/1) over not many hands. Hadn't seen him do anything crazy yet. SB another loose-passive type.

Hand 2

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 4 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with T/images/graemlins/heart.gif, T/images/graemlins/club.gif.
Hero raises, 1 fold, SB calls, BB calls.

Flop: (6 SB) 2/images/graemlins/club.gif, K/images/graemlins/heart.gif, A/images/graemlins/club.gif (3 players)
SB checks, BB bets, Hero folds, SB calls.

In both hands, the Ace and King scared me off. Hand 1 was especially worrying with the UTG cold-calling on the flop. In any case, just checking to see if people think these folds are weak.

Dov

06-10-2005, 03:15 AM

You can't go too far wrong folding these hands here, especially without reads.

That said, developing your reads will allow you to exploit these situations to the max.

By the way, do you monitor what they think of you when you play your hands?

7ontheline

06-10-2005, 03:29 AM

Yeah, reads would have been nice. I have to admit to some auto-pilot multitabling here, but I definitely had not seen any of these players get too frisky or tricky yet. As for my image. . .well. . .I like to raise. I'm on the LAGy end of TAG play for 5/10, I think. I had been raising my normal amount - nothing huge though, especially in the previous few hands before these 2 happened.

wheelz

06-10-2005, 03:34 AM

I think both hands are fine. Can't win em all.

Jeff W

06-10-2005, 03:42 AM

I think that these are both fine.

mack848

06-10-2005, 03:52 AM

What would you do if the Kings were replaced by 2s in both hands? Is the presence of an Ace sufficient for these to both still be folds?

Jeff W

06-10-2005, 03:56 AM

In hand 1 I would definitely still fold--there was a cold call after the raise.

In hand 2 Pretty tough, but I'd still fold because that opponent is relatively passive. Not confident in that one though.

7ontheline

06-10-2005, 04:02 AM

With only an ace and no king on board, I probably fold the first hand still because of the raise/coldcall, but not the 2nd hand because people like to represent the ace.

bobbyi

06-10-2005, 04:08 AM

I think you have to play these this way.

7ontheline

06-10-2005, 11:03 AM

Thanks for the replies everybody - the only reason I asked was because in hand 1 the raiser showed 77 and the idiot coldcaller showed Q8o for the winning pair of eights. The second hand the guy who led into me had a flush draw and the guy who called and won had 55. Unbelievable. I made plenty of notes after these two hands. I just wanted to make sure that I wasn't being bluffed too easily.

I Play 2 Ski

06-10-2005, 11:41 AM

depending on the opponent, i usually raise here. If the BB is passive I probably fold to the donkbet.

SomethingClever

06-10-2005, 12:46 PM

I think hand 1 is a pretty easy fold, but hand 2 not as much.

A flush draw is very likely... I probably at least peel the flop and see what comes on the turn. Might be a good time for a free showdown turn raise?