Making a living off One Tables

[MrShawn2U]

I am just curious, as I know there are lots of people who make thier living of online poker on these boards. Do you think playing tournaments, mostly 1-2 table formats, can allow you to make money? Or do you think playin cash games is better?

[indiegumby]

I've found that the easiest way to win at poker is to put your entire bankroll on to one table and go all in every hand preflop.

[MrShawn2U]

Yeah, id bet you do very well that way. Any real players have anything to say here?

[kyro]

Yes, you can make money.

I suggest using the search function near the top of the page. You should be able to find some decent threads on ROI, expected rate, and such.

[HoldingFolding]

One tables by a mile. Spend one hour every two years winning a higher step, spend the remaining time on a beach in Thailand.

[indiegumby]

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, id bet you do very well that way. Any real players have anything to say here?

[/ QUOTE ]

/sarcasm

[gumpzilla]

[ QUOTE ]

/sarcasm

[/ QUOTE ]

You think the OP wasn't able to figure that out? You think that makes your post any less worthless as an answer to his question?

I don't think the right way to start out here is as a tool, but that's just me.

[mosdef]

i think this is a terrible, terrible post.

most players who make a living do so by grinding out regular winnings day-by-day, not by going for the big win.

[mosdef]

you can make a living either way. hunt for ROI threads for SNGs and go over to the cash-game forums and look for win rate threads to get a feel for how much you can expect to win per hour played IF you study and get good.

are you thinking of going pro? concerned about whether it's a realistic idea?

[Moonsugar]

Sample bias. Most people here are gonna say STT. Find your own way or poll a larger audience.

Oh, and go all in every hand with your whole BR. I like that strategy too.

[citanul]

no one in their right minds should answer that one table tournaments are the best way to make the most money. the unavailability of masses of higher limit games on demand is what currently makes this impossible.

in a world where you can 8 table 30/60, 8 table 100/200, or play 50/100 nl, play heads up 300/600, etc, it's not very arguable that the sngs are a great path to the most possible money. the ring games just have too much presence at high stakes, and are for the most part, too beatable.

citanul

[Amything]

According to a recent post a 19,5% ROI on $22 - 4 tabling - gets you about $25 per hour which is a modest living if you do it 5 hours a week, 22 days of the month. Anyone ever tempted to move to a country with a low cost of living and do such a thing? Anyone doing it? Or just staying put and living a modest life?

[Moonsugar]

[ QUOTE ]
no one in their right minds should answer that one table tournaments are the best way to make the most money.

[/ QUOTE ]

You assume way too much about the members of our forum.

[Bigwig]

[ QUOTE ]
no one in their right minds should answer that one table tournaments are the best way to make the most money. the unavailability of masses of higher limit games on demand is what currently makes this impossible.

in a world where you can 8 table 30/60, 8 table 100/200, or play 50/100 nl, play heads up 300/600, etc, it's not very arguable that the sngs are a great path to the most possible money. the ring games just have too much presence at high stakes, and are for the most part, too beatable.

citanul

[/ QUOTE ]

Of course you're going to get much higher variance in those games, no?

[citanul]

i didn't say that i thought anyone was in their right minds, i simply said that you could immediately tell who wasn't by reading answers to questions like this.

[citanul]

yes, of course, but the op made no qualifiers about variance, bankroll, etc.

citanul

[Big Limpin']

[ QUOTE ]
...$25 per hour,modest living. Anyone ever tempted to move to a country with a low cost of living and do such a thing? Anyone doing it? Or just staying put and living a modest life?

[/ QUOTE ]

I am moving to Buenos Aires in September. Expect my "modest living" will go pretty far there, what with recent currency devaluation.

Dos cervesa, por favor?

[Amything]

I may have overstated the "modest" part, my country is famous for how everything is expensive and the dollar being as low as it is my perception of it might be screwed.

I was expecting more "playing professionsal poker at $22 SNGs level is out of the question" posts. But I guess its really possible if you are good enough.

[pergesu]

[ QUOTE ]
I may have overstated the "modest" part, my country is famous for how everything is expensive and the dollar being as low as it is my perception of it might be screwed.

I was expecting more "playing professionsal poker at $22 SNGs level is out of the question" posts. But I guess its really possible if you are good enough.

[/ QUOTE ]
My monthly living expenses are $450. Being a pro at $22 is easy.

[Sponger15SB]

[ QUOTE ]
one tables

[/ QUOTE ]

wait a second, you can't pluralize this! bahhhhhh

[kyro]

[ QUOTE ]
i think this is a terrible, terrible post.

most players who make a living do so by grinding out regular winnings day-by-day, not by going for the big win.

[/ QUOTE ]

meh, he was trying to be funny. he failed, miserably.

[Big Limpin']

where do you live? Monaco?

[mosdef]

i guess he did fail.

[Amything]

[ QUOTE ]
where do you live? Monaco?

[/ QUOTE ]

Iceland /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[mosdef]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
where do you live? Monaco?

[/ QUOTE ]

Iceland /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

same difference

[Big Limpin']

also, $25/hr is plenty to live on if you dont have wife/kids/mortgage.
In a 40hr/week setting, thats $50k/yr, and those of us who play SnG as sole source of income find no problems in greatly surpassing 40hr/wk. Not saying everyone does, but if you needed a few extra hundred bucks a week, it would be no great strain to put in a 50hr week, or even 60hr week. Its no great strain sitting on your ass in front of a computer.

Edit: I dunno about iceland. Maybe you need more $ even without big finanical obligations, maybe you *should* move to one of those "cheaper" countries.
Wanna come to Argentina with me?

[Sponger15SB]

[ QUOTE ]
and those of us who play SnG as sole source of income find no problems in greatly surpassing 40hr/wk. Not saying everyone does, but if you needed a few extra hundred bucks a week, it would be no great strain to put in a 50hr week, or even 60hr week. Its no great strain sitting on your ass in front of a computer.

[/ QUOTE ]

Speak for yourself lunatic.

[MrShawn2U]

I would be the first to admit I am not ready to go pro, but in the future maybe. But yes I am wondering how realistic it might be. I dont know if online poker is a viable way to make a living?

[pergesu]

[ QUOTE ]
I would be the first to admit I am not ready to go pro, but in the future maybe. But yes I am wondering how realistic it might be. I dont know if online poker is a viable way to make a living?

[/ QUOTE ]
It's pretty simple really.

lEV = h * hr - expenses

h is hours/mo you're willing to play (like 20 for me...yes, 20 per month). hr is hourly rate, expenses are...expenses. And lEV is your EV of living for the month. If it's positive, go pro. If it's negative, get a job.

[lacky]

It's all poker, if you play it better than the others you make money. Personally I get bored, so I go through phases. Sometimes I will play only sng's for a month, or only limit, only nl ring, etc. Sometimes I mix it up and change constantly. Once a year or so I will decide to learn a new game, omaha h/l was the last one, pot limit omaha may be the next one.

Lately all I've wanted to do is play MTT's, which I've been doing 2 to 4 at a time, 5 to 10 hours a day. The last few days have been really frustrating, with lots of chip lead then just miss the final table's happening. So, I'll probably play some sng's for a couple day's, or clear that party bonus at 5/10 limit.

The point is, you can make a living at any of it, you just have to put in the hours and play well. Saying I could make 10% more at limit (true) is pointless, because after a while I'm so bored with it my hours a week drop a ton. There's always something else I'd rather do once it gets too boring.

I play whatever interests me at the time and try to get 30 to 40 hours a week, playing when I'm reasonable fresh and interested. If i do that the money takes care of itself.

Steve

[mosdef]

it is definitely the case that one CAN make a living on line (not me, by the way - i have a "regular" job).

are you in college? or out of college and unhappy with your job?

[MrShawn2U]

I am out of college, I just love poker. I dont love my job by any means. But I wouldnt say I am "unhappy". I make decent money, I likely wouldnt try to make a living online anyway, the only way I would do it was with live games. If I can just win my seat to teh WSOP /images/graemlins/wink.gif haha

[schwza]

[ QUOTE ]
It's all poker, if you play it better than the others you make money. Personally I get bored, so I go through phases. Sometimes I will play only sng's for a month, or only limit, only nl ring, etc. Sometimes I mix it up and change constantly. Once a year or so I will decide to learn a new game, omaha h/l was the last one, pot limit omaha may be the next one.

Lately all I've wanted to do is play MTT's, which I've been doing 2 to 4 at a time, 5 to 10 hours a day. The last few days have been really frustrating, with lots of chip lead then just miss the final table's happening. So, I'll probably play some sng's for a couple day's, or clear that party bonus at 5/10 limit.

The point is, you can make a living at any of it, you just have to put in the hours and play well. Saying I could make 10% more at limit (true) is pointless, because after a while I'm so bored with it my hours a week drop a ton. There's always something else I'd rather do once it gets too boring.

I play whatever interests me at the time and try to get 30 to 40 hours a week, playing when I'm reasonable fresh and interested. If i do that the money takes care of itself.

Steve

[/ QUOTE ]

nice post.

[mosdef]

sounds like your in a good situation. keep your 9-5 (or 8-7, if you're like me) and develop your poker as a money making hobby. unless you're a very, very good player you're unlikely to be happier as a pro than as a person with a good regular job. but that's just my 2 cents, you'll know what's really best for you.

good luck out there.

[FatalError]

I 8 table 109's due to the incredible low variance and high profit potential, 8 tabling i hardly ever lose for a day because i usually get 50 SnG's or more in, generally enough to ride out any bad luck and post a win of some sort and generally one in the general ballpark of my ROI, something that never seemed to happen playing limit hold'em when i did that for the rent money

[chisness]

I think, yes, it is possible to do quite well playing SNGs, especially if you do 8 or 12 tables at a time. Examples above are only discussing playing 4 tables of $22 SNGs! Imagine if you play 12 tables of $55 SNGs -- of course your ROI will go down as you play more tables and as your stakes go up, my belief is that the optimal playing level for a medium bankroll and one who doesn't want huge variance to play 12 tables of the $55s!

The reasoning is that these always fill up instantly, can be beat for a good ROI (15%ish), and the $100s and $200s tend to have ROIs that are almost 1/2 for each level up. Ex.: Playing the $100s will probably only earn you about $1 more per game for double the risk. $200s may even be worse because an ABC-12 table strategy won't work very well in those.

Assuming a 15% ROI in the $50s, 12 tabling continuously , with rakeback, you're looking at ~16*(55*.15+1.25) = $152 an hour! Even with a 5% ROI, you're looking at over $50 an hour, and with a perhaps most likely 10% ROI, you're looking at over $100 an hour, quite a nice salary of over $200K per year if played 8 hours a day every day.

[Amything]

[ QUOTE ]
Assuming a 15% ROI in the $50s, 12 tabling continuously , with rakeback, you're looking at ~16*(55*.15+1.25) = $152 an hour! Even with a 5% ROI, you're looking at over $50 an hour, and with a perhaps most likely 10% ROI, you're looking at over $100 an hour, quite a nice salary of over $200K per year if played 8 hours a day every day.

[/ QUOTE ]

These numbers are truly droolworthy but seem far stretch for a player like me who is just starting to 3 table the 11$s.

The interesting thing about 4-tabling the $22s is that its seems within reach to give it a shot and see if its something that you can do and would like to do. Just get used to 1 more table and grind your bankroll up to $2k or so and use an extended summer vacation next year to get a decent sample size of the $22s to see if you stink or not and decide from there.

[tech]

12-tabling the 55s continuously for 8 hours a day would make me suicidal in less than a week. Besides that, maintaining 15%+ is quite difficult while 12-tabling. You make mistakes you wouldn't make otherwise.

[KingDan]

I think a living can be made off it.

I haven't been been playing one table tournaments all that long,and 4 tabling the 33s I am approximately a 10% ROI. Beats the hell out of working at Wawa /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Poolgod32]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Assuming a 15% ROI in the $50s, 12 tabling continuously , with rakeback, you're looking at ~16*(55*.15+1.25) = $152 an hour! Even with a 5% ROI, you're looking at over $50 an hour, and with a perhaps most likely 10% ROI, you're looking at over $100 an hour, quite a nice salary of over $200K per year if played 8 hours a day every day.

[/ QUOTE ]

These numbers are truly droolworthy but seem far stretch for a player like me who is just starting to 3 table the 11$s.

The interesting thing about 4-tabling the $22s is that its seems within reach to give it a shot and see if its something that you can do and would like to do. Just get used to 1 more table and grind your bankroll up to $2k or so and use an extended summer vacation next year to get a decent sample size of the $22s to see if you stink or not and decide from there.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hey Im in the same boat. How is it going for you three tabling? Do you find your results drop off a bit with one more table? just curious

We will now return to the thread

[DasLeben]

[ QUOTE ]
I 8 table 109's due to the incredible low variance and high profit potential, 8 tabling i hardly ever lose for a day because i usually get 50 SnG's or more in, generally enough to ride out any bad luck and post a win of some sort and generally one in the general ballpark of my ROI, something that never seemed to happen playing limit hold'em when i did that for the rent money

[/ QUOTE ]

You rarely have a losing streak of 50 SNGs? Man, I want whatever you're on. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[raptor517]

you can make a living playing ANY form of poker where the rake isnt too high. holla

[johnnybeef]

[ QUOTE ]
you can make a living playing ANY form of poker where the rake isnt too high. holla

[/ QUOTE ]

just as long as you stay away from the blackjack/roulette tables....

[raptor517]

hey, i was talking about poker. not table game leaks. so suck it beefcake. /images/graemlins/wink.gif holla

[Bigwig]

[ QUOTE ]
you can make a living playing ANY form of poker where the rake isnt too high. holla

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes.

Hell, I could make $100K/year playing the $50s right now, and I've been playing seriously for less than two years. Arguably, I've only been playing SERIOUSLY for six months. It's not hard. But the money can't be your only reason for 'playing professionally.' There are many, many factors to consider.

For example: Do you want to get your A's cracked by some 12 tabler who then types HOLLA! in the chat box?

[foxxxer]

This is probably a sad excuse for a first post, but here goes:

Is it possible to play pro, and even live well, without massively multi-tabling low buy-in SnGs? For instance, I've been playing about 1 $109 on Party per day, after work, for a few months now. I'm quitting my job at the end of June and might use poker to pay the bills for a while. Through about 100 SnGs, my ROI is an absurd 45%, which will no doubt go down, but my question is: by how much? Will my ROI suffer as much as people who 8-table 22s? Or can I expect to keep it up in the 20% range as long as I stick to one or two tables and consistently solid play?

The way I see it, this is my ideal situation: 50 SnGs a week * 20% ROI($21.80) ~= $57,000 a year. Not a bad amount to start off.

[freemoney]

I guess 1 tabling the SnG's an ROI like 20% is definitely possible at the 109s but what happens if you run into a slump, variance that could affect a multitabler lasting a week will last over a month for you, go a month losing 1500 instead of making anything see how that will effect you when you need to pay the bills, if this is something you want to do this is by no means the optimal way of going around doing it, learn to multitable or dont quit your job.