Muck AK for one bet preflop?

[Clarkmeister]

Loose game. You raise UTG with AKo and are 3-bet on your immediate left by your girlfriend who will ONLY do this with AA or KK, and maybe only 75% of the time that she has KK. There are 2 cold callers and the BB calls.

Do you call the one more bet?

[Vehn]

no

[Ed Miller]

You know... I just might muck here. Even if you know you are against AA or KK... I think you still have odds to call. But if mucking will make other (maybe LAG-types) take notice and try to isolate you with weak hands...

[Clarkmeister]

Its a table full of clueless and I had good control over the one LAG at the table. I'm not worried about image considerations for future hands. Just about the correct play on this one hand.

And there is zero doubt that she has either AA or KK, with AA somewhat more likely since she will not 3 bet with KK more than about 75% of the time.

[Ed Miller]

Well... if you knew 100% she had AA, I think you muck. If you knew 100% she had KK, you call. I think the answer depends on how she would behave if an A hits the flop and she does indeed have AA... if she would, say, raise your flop bet with AA but just call with KK... then I think you can call and see the flop. If she is going to be tricky and you risk losing lots of bets when she has AA... then probably just muck it and move on.

[Mangatang]

Depends, do ya'll share a bank account?

[Clarkmeister]

No

[Clarkmeister]

I wouldn't describer her postflop play as tricky....just as different. She looks at the game differently than you or I do, which means that if I flop an ace, it could be difficult for me to tell. If she raises, I can fold, but she may very well wait to raise, or even call down if the board gets flushed but not paired. But she would also call with the KK at least til the river usually.

So yes, it could be difficult for me to tell where I am postflop.

[bernie]

isolating a weak player is a fine 3 bet move...lololol kidding...JUST KIDDING
/forums/images/icons/wink.gif
your fold may tell other players what she has...if theyre observant at all....its not a common move to see...

suited, id call easy...

offsuit? against a player of this description...hmmm...

she doesnt 3 bet with anything else? id may fold. but you could, since you 'know' her, call and fold the flop to a bet therefore not telegraphing her hand as much...but again, this depends on the opponents. against an unknown with this description, i may fold. itd be tough, but id consider it.

however...here's the hedge..that justifies the call...

say you call and you catch....compared to the others at the table, you should lose less with this hand against this player than they would...right? because you know her 3 bet possibilities....many players will probably play this hand too far against her. so even just calling preflop and folding the flop, youre gaining money from the table from the play..make sense?

so in THAT respect, i may even see the flop against this type of player if she was an unknown. it's almost part of the give a little take alot deal...youre giving a little preflop because you know youll make more, longrunwise, postflop against the rest of the players based on the above...all the while protecting your read/knowledge of the player. raising and folding preflop, many fish may notice that. it's not that common a sight to see. so it may make an impact more than you may think...whether on how they see youre play, or if they catch on to your read of her, therefore on how she plays...

arent you teaching her to 3bet with other hands against us loose raisers? /forums/images/icons/grin.gif

btw...if this was a tougher table, id be more inclined to fold...

so....the morning after, in the afterglow did she tell ya she 3 bet ya with AQ? hahaha

b

[Jim Easton]

What hands will those players call 3 cold with? Is it likely one of them has AK with you? If so, you are drawing rather thin to half the pot. You are getting 14-1 on your call, but your only clean win is a flush with your ace (depending on whether the ace in your king's suit is out). A king does nothing for you on the flop and (from your follow-up), you really won't know where you are if an ace comes. It sounds like a fold.

[PokerPrince]

First of all, teach your girlfriend not to be so predictable with her raising standards. LOL! I would toss here for sure. I play with a ridiculously tight player in my game and when he raises or reraises me preflop I toss A LOT of stuff. It hurts tossing those pretty Q's or that long awaited AK but it's in your best interest.

PokerPrince

[Bob T.]

Yes, because she is your girlfriend, and if you don't, a) it looks like you might have raised for her, and b) you should let her outplay you occasionally, and if she does when she three bets, she might three bet more often.

You don't have to call any bets after the flop.
Good Luck,
Play Well,

Bob T.

[Tyler Durden]

If this happened to me, I'd look at my girlfriend and say "What the hell are you doing out of the kitchen?"

[Clarkmeister]

I'm sure that there are some here who will love this. I'm sure there is a lesson in here somewhere. I really out thought myself on this one:

So, I actually called 'time' at the table and thought before calling. I called with my AhKs.

Flop was Kh Jc 8h. I bet, she called, MP and LP called and BB called. We all saw the turn.

Thought process: She has me beat, I'll let her raise and narrow the field a bit since AA is her most likely holding and this flop has a lot of draws.

OK, she didn't raise. That certainly means AA rather than KK most of the time. She is pretty good about raising sets early on.

Turn: [Kh Jc 8h] 2d. I bet, she calls OK, definitely AA and scared of my bet , MP calls, LP (a slightly overaggressive player) raises, BB folds, I reraise I think I have LP beat, and I can probabaly get her to muck AA to 2-bet turn pressure, this might win me the pot, She cold calls, MP folds, LP 4-bets (a cap is a bet and 5 raises), I fold OK, can't get her out, time to leave this one she calls. Two to the river.

River: [Kh Jc 8h 2d] Ts. She bets, he calls, her set of kings beats his set of jacks.

I made her pay for dinner.

[Clarkmeister]

"you don't have to call any bets after the flop"

For the record, I didn't call a single bet postflop. /forums/images/icons/smirk.gif

[Clarkmeister]

Ummm, I happen to like sex.

[Clarkmeister]

"say you call and you catch....compared to the others at the table, you should lose less with this hand against this player than they would...right? "

uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh............ /forums/images/icons/blush.gif


lol..

As for her tightness, I have resigned myself to the idea that she simply isn't going to be a big winner. Therefore since we tend to play together only on weekends at juicy LL tables, I have her on a strict hyper weak tight gameplan that she is comfortable with. She is a very small winner in these games basically by simply playing the nuts.

Besides, why bet and raise with top set when there are two loonies at the table willing to do it for you? /forums/images/icons/smirk.gif

[Rich P.]

[Jim Easton]

Not sure whether it has been hit, but I think Clarkmeister said it was about 60k recently. I guess that does make it a call.

Sounds like Clarkmeister read the situation perfectly preflop, then made the wrong decision on the flop.

[Ed Miller]

On what board does AK vs. AA or AK vs. KK make a jackpot hand?

[Jim Easton]

I think I have LP beat
You post here a lot and I respect your thought processes. What makes you think you have him beat? What hand worse than yours would he call three cold with preflop, call the flop and then raise the turn after you raised UTG, led the flop and led the turn? Doesn't that scream set? Seems like QQ and JJ are reasonable hands for people that call 3 cold.

[Jim Easton]

AA vs. AK with board of AKKK. Aces full loses to four kings. The question is does the ace on board counterfeit his ace and would they say he is only playing one card in his hand.

KK vs. AK board of AAAxx. Aces full of kings loses to four aces.

[Vehn]

I like to post hands I think I played badly, or less than optimally. Occasionally, I'll play a hand so badly I don't even want to think about it, much less post it.

*cough*

/forums/images/icons/grin.gif

[Ed Miller]

Fair enough...

Though, the probability of AKKK is much too low to justify a call based on the jackpot...

[Ed Miller]

[Jim Easton]

Agreed, but I he said the jackpot was over 60k about a week ago. I imagine it hasn't been hit and that is why he is still playing there. $3 more for a shot at 30k + seems like a reasonable gamble to me.

[Ed Miller]

It probably is worth it. I forgot to factor in the "fringe benefits" of having a girlfriend who just hit the big end of a $60,000 jackpot.

[Louie Landale]

Yes. You need to protect your partnership in case an Ace hits. You also need to DISGUISE your partnership in case someone notices that YOU raised then folded for HER.

- Louie

[Dynasty]

It would be impossible to win the bad beat jackpot at the Stardust with AKo. Clarkmeister needs to use both his hole cards to qualify and must have a pocket pair if his hand is quads. Therefore, AK cannot make quads or better and qualify for the jackpot regardless of what his opponent holds.

The "use both hole cards/pocket pair" rule is the norm in Las Vegas.