Opening Requirements for 1/2 vs. .50/1

[Sasnak]

My .50/1 WR is around 3BB/100 and this is my second 'serious' run at 1/2. I had a 150BB losing streak at 1/2 previously after hitting my $300+ mark of winnings at .50/1. Being shell-shocked and getting weak/tight, I returned to .50/1 and again was averaging 3BB/100.

On the second .50/1 run I again hit my $300 mark and moved to 1/2 once again with new confidence. But after 3k hands I'm -.20BB/100. Not really bad enough to be overly concerned, and not whining either.

Over the past two months I'm up $600 in true winnings+Bonus+Rakeback at .50/1. On top of that I also have a $1,000 cushion so this isn't an "I'm going bust" post and panic has set in! /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

Here are my thoughts... 1/2 is generally tighter than .50/1 but I still find tables even at midday with a 28-30%+ VP. But I have also quit limping in EP with Axs and small pocket pairs like I did habitually at .50/1. Hence my VP is dropping.

I do know I've been running cold-decked and I've had some suckouts which are normal (set of Aces losing to gutshots, etc), which aren't tilting me. At 3k hands I'm around 13.5/6.6/2.3 at 1/2. At .50/1 I was 17/7.5/2.4 something, but also got a big share of playable hands in position.

At one point I tried to loosen up with Axs, etc. in EP but not only got raised, but reraised. That doesn't happen often at the .50/1 tables. Or at least in not my experience so far.

How many of you changed your opening requirements at 1/2 from .50/1. Did you tighten up in EP? Play 1/2 the same as .50/1? Or get looser?

My bankroll is good and I can stay at 1/2 for quite some time. I'm in no problem now and am riding out the variance stuff, but feel as if I'm folding too much. Fact is, most of the EP folds have been good since no flush draws or sets have flopped.

In one sense, I'm saving bets by not overplaying early, in the other I don't want to get away from some of the +EV hands for fear of multiple raises behind me.

I'll raise PP's in MP and take down the pot with a lead bet after the flop. I'm not playing timid, just trying to play better and smarter. Am I overthinking 1/2?

Any advice?

[MrWookie47]

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Fact is, most of the EP folds have been good since no flush draws or sets have flopped.

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Somebody call the results-oriented police.

I've been playing 1/2 at Stars clearing their last two bonuses, and play their is really tight, much worse than what you're describing. I've stopped limping Axs, but PP's are still quite resiliant to being raised, and even reraised, as long as you have enough sense to play fit-or-fold poker in such a situation.

Make sure you're loosening up your preflop raising requirements when you're opening. 77 is a good limp UTG, but it's an easy open-raise MP2+.

[Sasnak]

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Fact is, most of the EP folds have been good since no flush draws or sets have flopped.

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Somebody call the results-oriented police.

I've been playing 1/2 at Stars clearing their last two bonuses, and play their is really tight, much worse than what you're describing. I've stopped limping Axs, but PP's are still quite resiliant to being raised, and even reraised, as long as you have enough sense to play fit-or-fold poker in such a situation.

Make sure you're loosening up your preflop raising requirements when you're opening. 77 is a good limp UTG, but it's an easy open-raise MP2+.

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Consider them called! LOL

Actually I was trying to keep a running +/- BB tally over the first few thousand hands to gauge overall table play by. Not the "$&#@! I should have played that hand!" and "Man good thing I didn't limp that one!"

77 is always at least a limp UTG and a raise first in at MP.

I have bonuses a PS as well and played there a few hours the other night whgen the skins went down and.... DAMN was it ever tight!

[Rah]

Limping with Axs from EP is meant for really loose/passive games. Actually, It's been a while since I saw such a game on Party. Even if you flop a draw, you are out of position which is extremely bad when playing a draw.
Limping with PPs is also meant for pots when you are sure there will be at least 4-5 people seeing the flop.

Cut all of those "value moves" out of your game when playing 1/2. Start with a really tight and aggressive game, don't squeeze in marginal hand from bad positions. And stop being results oriented - the flop doesn't affect the value of preflop decisions.

[waynethetrain]

I agree with everything he said.

Taking some of the advice geared towards .50 - 1.00 to the $1 - $2 games proved very costly to me. The games are tighter and the implied odds on some early position opening hands that have been touted for the looser .50 - 1.00 games just don't apply to $1-$2.

[DeathDonkey]

If you listen to some of these people you're gonna have a VPIP of 12. Raise more in position and isolate the bad players and steal blinds mercilessly. Punish the weak tighties and pick on the loosies in position. Tighten up a little in EP but 1/2 is not the TAGgy rock garden its made out to be so don't take that too far.

-DeathDonkey

[shadow29]

I tightened up considerably when I moved to 1/2. A lot of the hands lik Axs and low PP pairs just cannot be played profitably from EP. That said, however, I think that your Att to Steal Blinds (and thus PFR) should actually go up, despite your VPIP dropping. Look for more marginal hands to raise in LP and to isolate the bad players.

Also 3k hands is nothing.

[Catt]

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If you listen to some of these people you're gonna have a VPIP of 12. Raise more in position and isolate the bad players and steal blinds mercilessly. Punish the weak tighties and pick on the loosies in position. Tighten up a little in EP but 1/2 is not the TAGgy rock garden its made out to be so don't take that too far.

-DeathDonkey

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I agree with this. I also think limping in EP with hands like small PPs and Axs is fine at 1/2. I think a VPIP of 13.5 could be increased by 50%. Concentrate on your game post-flop and learn to play difficult situations. It doesn't get easier as you move up further (which I presume you may want to do eventually). Seriously, a VPIP of 13 is dangerously close to nut-peddling and is not a habit to which you want to grow accustomed.

[gvibes]

[ QUOTE ]
I tightened up considerably when I moved to 1/2. A lot of the hands lik Axs and low PP pairs just cannot be played profitably from EP. That said, however, I think that your Att to Steal Blinds (and thus PFR) should actually go up, despite your VPIP dropping.

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I think this is corret. However, I still limped all pocket pairs.

[bottomset]

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If you listen to some of these people you're gonna have a VPIP of 12. Raise more in position and isolate the bad players and steal blinds mercilessly. Punish the weak tighties and pick on the loosies in position. Tighten up a little in EP but 1/2 is not the TAGgy rock garden its made out to be so don't take that too far.

-DeathDonkey

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exactly I think its likely you'll be a little tighter in EP, but prob 2-3pts higher MP3-Button, since you will be in steal/isolate situations more often

your VPIP shouldn't really drop off much at all, 19-20 is very reasonable at this level

[Sasnak]

[ QUOTE ]
If you listen to some of these people you're gonna have a VPIP of 12. Raise more in position and isolate the bad players and steal blinds mercilessly. Punish the weak tighties and pick on the loosies in position. Tighten up a little in EP but 1/2 is not the TAGgy rock garden its made out to be so don't take that too far.

-DeathDonkey

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No it isn't the rock garden at all as a lot of people claim.

Had two tables running last night in the 30's and could never capitalize on it. One of those raise with KK UTG and all fold to win the blinds type of sessions. Did hit a couple of sets to offset paying the blinds for a number of orbits on two tables.

AKs in position gets capped preflop and flop the nut flush with 4 others. Jam it to the river only to have Ace high in a 30BB pot. That one would have made the evening. Had another AK lose to an A8o, he went to the top of my buddy list so it was worth it.

There are great tables out there still.

[deception5]

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AKs in position gets capped preflop and flop the nut flush with 4 others. Jam it to the river only to have Ace high in a 30BB pot.

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You didn't jam on the turn did you?

[diebitter]

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No it isn't the rock garden at all as a lot of people claim.


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Agreed. I 4-tabled 1/2 last night, and easily found 4 tables that were VPIP 30%+

I was surprised, as on the previous bonus cycle, the site seemed stuffed with rocks working off their bonuses, but not this time!

But the cards were cold, so only made about $15 in about 75 minutes of pretty fast play - mostly from 1 maniac who sent the table tight, who I then consistently isolated and beat with stuff like 99 at showdown (I knew he was on an ace high whenever he didn't re-re-raise /images/graemlins/laugh.gif)! He was only there for 10 minutes though (I took all his money).

I'd give you his handle, but then I'd have to kill you.

[Isura]

Play looser in late position (especially raising), tighten up (especially with limping) in early position. PFR of 7% is really too rockish.

As a rough guideline, this is what I use when I'm lagging up the 1/2 full game.

Open-raising requirements (very rough)
UTG - 88, ATs, AJ, KJs, KQ, QJs, JTs
MP - 55, A7s, AT, K9s, KJ, QTs, JTs
LP - really depends, big difference between MP3 and Button.
Basically any pair, Axs, A7, any broadway, sounds about right.