TT against off-tempo river bet

[shant]

This is my first orbit at the table, so the players are unknown.

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is CO with T/images/graemlins/club.gif, T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP calls, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, SB calls, BB calls, MP calls.

Flop: (8 SB) 3/images/graemlins/club.gif, A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 5/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, BB folds, MP folds, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, SB calls.

Turn: (6 BB) 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, SB calls.

River: (8 BB) 5/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero?

[Cactus Cactus]

At the River I would probably fold. But I don't understand why you would raise the flop. I see many players do this and I do not understand. I believe in that type of unknown situation, I believe it is best to call all the way down. This way, if he is bluffing you let him continue it.

[shant]

[ QUOTE ]
At the River I would probably fold. But I don't understand why you would raise the flop. I see many players do this and I do not understand. I believe in that type of unknown situation, I believe it is best to call all the way down. This way, if he is bluffing you let him continue it.

[/ QUOTE ]
I agree with this if I have KK or QQ, but there are overcards to my TT that I need to protect against.

[tongni]

I think the river is a fold.

[milesdyson]

Just wondering - what overcards do you need to protect against that SB would actually bet on this flop?

[Stu Pidasso]

[ QUOTE ]
I agree with this if I have KK or QQ, but there are overcards to my TT that I need to protect against.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you raise SB is getting 11-1 on the call. SB can correctly call with a very wide range of hands so your flop raise offers you very little protection at all. Waiting until the turn affords more protection for your hand and can buy you a free showdown. If your goal is to protect your hand, wait until the turn to raise.

That being said, there are other reasons why you may want to raise on the flop, but they depend upon the skill of your opponent. For instance you may want to raise the flop to make your opponents bluffing frequency incorrect.

Stu

[shant]

[ QUOTE ]
Just wondering - what overcards do you need to protect against that SB would actually bet on this flop?

[/ QUOTE ]
He may be betting second or third pair with an overcard kicker. Also, I've noticed a lot of betting into the PFR regardless of hands, so I'm not ruling out some wierd broadway cards.

[shant]

[ QUOTE ]
Waiting until the turn affords more protection for your hand and can buy you a free showdown. If your goal is to protect your hand, wait until the turn to raise.

[/ QUOTE ]
Stu, this makes a lot more sense. Also, you are saying for this situation where it is heads up, right? What if I had people left behind me to act on the flop, does that make the flop a raise?

[uw_madtown]

[ QUOTE ]
What if I had people left behind me to act on the flop, does that make the flop a raise?

[/ QUOTE ]

That was my first thought when you said it was to protect against overcards -- that that would only be the case if there were other players behind you to act.

[shant]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
What if I had people left behind me to act on the flop, does that make the flop a raise?

[/ QUOTE ]

That was my first thought when you said it was to protect against overcards -- that that would only be the case if there were other players behind you to act.

[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah, chalk it up to one of those 4-tabling moments where you look away and realize afterwards that the flop is already heads-up. I actually didn't even realize fully until I posted it here and was explaining my raise.