Is there a different strategy between the $11 sngs and $22 sngs?

[CaptSensible]

I've been doing well on the $10 party poker sngs since getting advice on this forum. Are the strategies much different for the $20 games?

[hummusx]

No. They play almost identically. Same with the 33s, mostly.

[1C5]

A little.
I find the 33s significantly tougher than the 10s.

More FE in the 22s and 33s but more better players also. Better bubble play for the most part too.

[hummusx]

They may be tougher, but I don't believe there is any significant strategy change when moving up from 11 to 33.

[Voltron87]

There are slightly less wackos who dump their chips off with A10 in the first round as you go up, and slightly more people who know what the bubble is, but at the 22s they play is still usually abysmal, just less bad than the 11s. If you can beat the 11s take a shot at the 22s. They are very beatable.

edit: you basically use the same strategy at the 22s as in the 11s, which was your question.

[octaveshift]

[ QUOTE ]
I've been doing well on the $10 party poker sngs since getting advice on this forum. Are the strategies much different for the $20 games?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, you must play twice as good. This is a very well-known formula. (Just divide the buy-in by your "base" level of skill, and use it to determine how much better you should play.)

For instance, say you are crushing the 11s, but you want to play the 215s.

215/11 = 19.54

This means you should adjust your strategy by playing 19.54 times better than you usually play.

You can accomplish this easily by loosening up quite bit, raising with speculative hands, and bluffing into 4 or more players. (Try to incorporate some "trapping" hands into your skillset, like KJ and QT.)

[Voltron87]

I've been using the utg-limpreraise all in with QTs at the 109s, it's been excellent so far. You don't get quality broadway suited cards that much, you really have to get it all in when you do, you know?

[octaveshift]

[ QUOTE ]
I've been using the utg-limpreraise all in with QTs at the 109s, it's been excellent so far. You don't get quality broadway suited cards that much, you really have to get it all in when you do, you know?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, that's very similar to gigabet's approach. As we have seen from his hand histories, this is an excellent way to "play the players" and frankly, if you get called, you have 2 suited cards that will probably take it down.

I make plays like this a lot. Another one of my favorites is to limp from EP with low PPs, and then RERAISE if raised.

Pokar is easy.

[lorinda]

You never need different strategy, you need more strategy.

The strategy you use in the $11s underpins everything you'll ever do, even though by the time you reach the $15000s it will look very different to the casual observer.

Lori

[DeathbySuckout]

[quote
For instance, say you are crushing the 11s, but you want to play the 215s.

215/11 = 19.54

This means you should adjust your strategy by playing 19.54 times better than you usually play.



[/ QUOTE ]

Dude, thank you sooooo much for posting this. I have been using the fomula, BUT I FORGOT TO INCLUDE THE VIG. And I've been coming up just short of winning, with no clue what the problem was.
Wow, It's gonna feel good to start winning again this weekend.

[octaveshift]

[ QUOTE ]

Dude, thank you sooooo much for posting this. I have been using the fomula, BUT I FORGOT TO INCLUDE THE VIG. And I've been coming up just short of winning, with no clue what the problem was.
Wow, It's gonna feel good to start winning again this weekend.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hmmm. Now you have me wondering if I should have left the vig out of the equation.

I mean, think about this- the vig at 5s is 20%, while the vig at 10s is 10%. YET WE ALL KNOW THAT THE TENS ARE MUCH HARDER THAN THE FIVES!!!!!!

Can someone who is better at math chime in here?

Oh, and can someone make this a sticky?

[Big Limpin']

Octave, these post were truly hilarious. I'm not exactly sure why i find them so, they just are. The deadpan aproach to throwing math into witchdoctoring, solid.

I agree with using the 11s as a "base" skill level, upon which level based modification of required skillz are measured.

I'm not positive if i've been calculating it right either, but the formula i work with is:

S = B*(L2/L1)^(1/LB)

Where:
S = Skillz necessary
B = Base level of skillz required to pimp the 11s
L2 = $ buyin (incl. vig) at which you want to play
L1 = $11
BL = Current battery charge in your luckbox (expressed as a percentage of full charge, i.e. the luckiest youve ever been)

Luckboxing can never be a negative #, so 0.01 is nasty beat central, and 0.99 is when you stack off your AJ vs. AA, and know you are going to somehow win.

Ex: You want to play some 109s, and estimate your LB quotient @ 0.75.

S = (109/11)^(1/0.75)

You will be required to display 21.3 times the skills you showd at 11s to pull and equal ROI.

QED

[astarck]

[ QUOTE ]
A little.
I find the 33s significantly tougher than the 10s.

More FE in the 22s and 33s but more better players also. Better bubble play for the most part too.

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed. I have never had an 11 bubble where anyone knew what they were doing. I've had a few on the 22s where 1 other person might have known what they were doing. And on the 33s I find that about half of the bubbles have at least one other person who knows how to hold their own.

But at each of those 3 levels you will find people who play equally horibble at all aspects of the sng.

[Phill S]

[ QUOTE ]
You never need different strategy, you need more strategy.

The strategy you use in the $11s underpins everything you'll ever do, even though by the time you reach the $15000s it will look very different to the casual observer.

Lori

[/ QUOTE ]

There will be a time in people's play where strategy is unimportant. When you reach the level that you see situations in games, and look beyond the hand and players themselves, then you can no longer use broad brush strokes to cover your play, as it has become adaptive.

Edit: This is an adition to Lori's post, not an argument against it or a counter viewpoint as such.

Phill

[jeffraider]

Same strategy, but the $22s are noticeably tougher, but not tough, per se. I've recently dropped down to the $11s because I had to pull a lot of my bankroll to cover a big weird expense, and they're super easy comparatively.

[xLukex]

I play the 10s, which are really loose most of the time (in the afternoon) but tight in the morning (when I play at work).

So I tossed a 20 in today, and it seemed tighter than an average 11, which wasn't bad, but was still filled with idiots.

Shorthanded play was a lot more exciting to me in a 22 than an 11.

I don't know. Once the BR is big enough for 22s, I'll go there for good.

*goes back to reading GSIH* /images/graemlins/frown.gif

[tminus]

my strategy is to play the 10's until I get get tilty and then play a 30

[MrBrightside]

I've played a little of both (about 200 sngs on party, just recently switched from another site). Only thing I would say is that you are more liable to run into another player or two who knows how to play on the bubble, as others have said.

Personally, I now play the $20s because I do better playing one 20 than two 10s, but that's just me.

[dhende3]

People who truly understand the math behind the SnG structure will do better in the 22s than the 11s. More solid, conservative players do better at the 11s. The 22s are filled with these conservative players who beat the 'bad' maniacs at the 11s but are destroyed by the 'good' maniacs at the 22s.

[Tilt]

[ QUOTE ]
my strategy is to play the 10's until I get get tilty and then play a 30

[/ QUOTE ]

I find the more on tilt I am, the better I do in higher stakes. i.e. low stakes tilt play = good 109 sng strategy.

Its sort of like, when I get to the final table of an MTT, I find its always +EV at that point to have a beer at that point. Helps you play crazy enough to win.

[bigplaya69]

[ QUOTE ]
People who truly understand the math behind the SnG structure will do better in the 22s than the 11s. More solid, conservative players do better at the 11s. The 22s are filled with these conservative players who beat the 'bad' maniacs at the 11s but are destroyed by the 'good' maniacs at the 22s.

[/ QUOTE ]

What do you mean but understand the math of the sit and gos?? Also what is meant when you say EV?? Sorry i am new to the forum and fairly new to holdem.

[KingDan]

[ QUOTE ]
I've been using the utg-limpreraise all in with QTs at the 109s, it's been excellent so far. You don't get quality broadway suited cards that much, you really have to get it all in when you do, you know?

[/ QUOTE ]

What about when in doesn't get raised preflop? I hate folding that just because there is a scary board. Also, why let someone with pocket twos in cheaply to draw out on you?

[DasLeben]

[ QUOTE ]
What do you mean but understand the math of the sit and gos??

[/ QUOTE ]

Endgame play in SNGs is almost entirely decided by math. Whenever someone makes a steal attempt with a couple trashy cards for example, there's a mathematical reason behind it.

[tminus]

funny you should say that...i placed ITM when i did this
says alot about aggression