AJ in MP with a lot of callers. [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

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sx3_turbo

06-02-2005, 07:14 PM

I felt really lost on this hand. This table had seen 5+ on the flop a fe times. I wanted to muck this preflop in my position, but instead I call and then wished I had raised. Again, I was just kind of lost because my atention was at a second table I was playing. Any help is appreciated. Even I should have mucked preflop, advice on the other streets is great.

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with J/images/graemlins/club.gif, A/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 calls, Hero calls, 1 fold, MP3 calls, CO calls, 1 fold, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (8 SB) 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif, J/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (8 players)
SB checks, BB bets, UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 calls, Hero raises, MP3 calls, CO folds, SB folds, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+2 calls.

Turn: (9 BB) Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (5 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, UTG+2 checks, Hero bets, MP3 raises, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+2 calls, Hero calls.

River: (19 BB) A/images/graemlins/club.gif (5 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, UTG+2 bets, Hero raises, MP3 3-bets, BB folds, UTG folds, UTG+2 caps, Hero calls, MP3 calls.

Final Pot: 31 BB

Jaran

06-02-2005, 07:21 PM

You really should raise this pf. The hand plays differently then.

-Jaran

sx3_turbo

06-02-2005, 07:43 PM

[ QUOTE ]
You really should raise this pf. The hand plays differently then.

-Jaran

[/ QUOTE ]

As soon as I hit the call button, I wished I had raised. When I glanced back a the table I thought I was MP3 and two extra callers. Once I realized I had goofed that up, I just kind of fell apart on this hand.

VBM

06-02-2005, 07:52 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
You really should raise this pf. The hand plays differently then.

-Jaran

[/ QUOTE ]

As soon as I hit the call button, I wished I had raised. When I glanced back a the table I thought I was MP3 and two extra callers. Once I realized I had goofed that up, I just kind of fell apart on this hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

notice that MP3 cold-calls your flop raise then raises you on the turn.

notice also that UTG+2 check/cold-called MP3's turn raise and caps the river.

even having improved the river, i dump this to the river cap, pot odds be damned; you're just not good here enough w/ your 2 pair.

edit: i said i think one has a set the other has KT, but a set is too narrow; you may have a better 2 pair than one of them, dunno if u beat them both though & i still think not enough to call this river cap.

--oj.

sx3_turbo

06-02-2005, 08:05 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
You really should raise this pf. The hand plays differently then.

-Jaran

[/ QUOTE ]

As soon as I hit the call button, I wished I had raised. When I glanced back a the table I thought I was MP3 and two extra callers. Once I realized I had goofed that up, I just kind of fell apart on this hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

notice that MP3 cold-calls your flop raise then raises you on the turn.

notice also that UTG+2 check/cold-called MP3's turn raise and caps the river.

even having improved the river, i dump this to the river cap, pot odds be damned; you're just not good here enough w/ your 2 pair.

edit: i said i think one has a set the other has KT, but a set is too narrow; you may have a better 2 pair than one of them, dunno if u beat them both though & i still think not enough to call this river cap.

--oj.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is there a good place to get out before the river comes to me capped?

Disconnected

06-02-2005, 08:09 PM

Well as far as the pre-flop goes, I'd rather raise it with your position than muck it, but you're right -- calling sucks. Looks a lot like MP3 has KT, which you could have folded out with a raise.

UTG+2 coming alive isn't as scary as MP3, since if the river gave him two pair, you'll still probably beat him (unless he called with AJ, too /images/graemlins/tongue.gif ). MP3 could have been raising the turn with a pair (or even 2 pair), in addition to the straight. The fact that he 3-bet sure makes it look like a straight. If he was raising the turn with a queen or two pair, the river hurts him, but if he was raising it with a straight, your raise will take you out of the hand.

I think the play is to call the river bet. If MP3 raises, but it's only one bet back to you, I would call the raise, closing the action. If it's 2 back to you with a probable cap behind, I would fold.

teajay

06-02-2005, 08:30 PM

Muck hand before the flop?!? I think a raise is better. The hand probably would have played out a lot differently.

Given that you didn't....
Flop raise is fine. Calling the raise on the turn really commits you to a showdown, but I think calling the riverwould be best. There are a few straights that can be made on that board. I'm not advocating playing scared, your two pair is a nice hand, but I wouldn't raise the river there.

Travis

teajay

06-02-2005, 08:33 PM

When the cold calling SOB known as MP3 wakes up on the turn?

I am subborn and would try to show this down for as cheap as possible, but its food for thought.

Travis

Bodhi

06-03-2005, 12:10 AM

Ummm, don't fold preflop. Start with that and we'll go from there.

sx3_turbo

06-03-2005, 12:20 AM

Okay, so I raise PF and maybe avoid a lot of this trouble.

Since I didn't, my river raise was probably a bad decision. There I should call a bet and if comes back with a cap or likely cap I fold.