A stop and go I liked

[citanul]

Opponent stunk, and was trying to do lots of cheap stealing for a long while now. He even went to the wonderful extent of raising big when he had a real hand. So I felt confident that I likely had the best hand to start with here. He was weak tight post flop. This is ITM from a Party 109.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t400 (3 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Button (t4310)
SB (t3480)
Hero (t2210)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 5/images/graemlins/club.gif, K/images/graemlins/club.gif.
<font color="#CC3333">Button raises to t1000</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, Hero calls t600.

Flop: (t2200) A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 6/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 2/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero is all in

Final Pot: t2200

[curtains]

Whoa a stop+go on this forum that actually IS a stop+go!!! /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[citanul]

[ QUOTE ]

Whoa a stop+go on this forum that actually IS a stop+go!!! /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

That's cuz I'm mad cool like that.

[MrX]

[ QUOTE ]

Whoa a stop+go on this forum that actually IS a stop+go!!! /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[/ QUOTE ]


you beat me!!!

[MrX]

With your feel of the player and the game i like it.

Really in this case you have a much better feeling about the villain than anyone here, and it sounds like you had a pretty good handle on his style of play. If he happened to hit the flop so be it, but i like the play given your read.

You just posted this b/c a "real" stop n go needs to be seen every now and then... right?

MrX

[citanul]

[ QUOTE ]
You just posted this b/c a "real" stop n go needs to be seen every now and then... right?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes.

Rather than keep posting the definition everywhere, I thought I'd just post a hand.

citanul

[Bigwig]

[ QUOTE ]

Whoa a stop+go on this forum that actually IS a stop+go!!! /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Heh. Seriously.

[Scuba Chuck]

Villain's raise here often makes me think that it should be discussed how I think it can often be a mistake to make anything but an allin raise against a crafty opponent. My point is that it's often a mistake to do anything but push.

[NYCNative]

Not only that but a true Stop-N-Go is when you have no/little fold equity, I thought. If the OP's read was correct, no way he calls a pre-flop push.

[citanul]

[ QUOTE ]
Not only that but a true Stop-N-Go is when you have no/little fold equity, I thought. If the OP's read was correct, no way he calls a pre-flop push.

[/ QUOTE ]

i'm making an exception to ignoring you for this post. because your post here again makes it apparent you're stupid.

scuba is saying that it was a mistake for MY OPPONENT to have done anything but push if he knows that i'm tricky. or at least wants to open a discussion about whether it is true that if you raise at a crafty opponent in the late game, you should do nothing besides push.

you took that somehow as justification to think that i should have pushed over my opponent's opening raise. that is wrong. entirely wrong. and on top of that, my description of my opponent didn't include "would make an attrocious fold preflop." without the assumption that my opponent is a truly special type of donkey, pushing preflop can only really be a good option if you can see his cards and know you have him dominated.

in this hand, i had little to no folding equity preflop, as per the definition of a stop and go. as i didn't want to go into defining a stop and go in this thread, i will not now.

citanul

[gumpzilla]

[ QUOTE ]

in this hand, i had little to no folding equity preflop, as per the definition of a stop and go. as i didn't want to go into defining a stop and go in this thread, i will not now.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'll nitpick: is it really part of the definition of a stop and go that you have to have minimal PF folding equity, or is it just that that's when it is a good idea to employ one?

[citanul]

[ QUOTE ]
I'll nitpick: is it really part of the definition of a stop and go that you have to have minimal PF folding equity, or is it just that that's when it is a good idea to employ one?

[/ QUOTE ]

because of how many chips you're supposed to have, yes.

citanul

(at least i think so, we can go back and look at greg's post and see how he defines it i guess, but in practice, yes)

[Bigwig]

It looks to me as if the preflop raise is saying, "I want no part of you, SB, but I'll take on Hero."

Perfect time for a stop n' go, since Button is unlikely to be married to this hand.

[Bigwig]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I'll nitpick: is it really part of the definition of a stop and go that you have to have minimal PF folding equity, or is it just that that's when it is a good idea to employ one?

[/ QUOTE ]

because of how many chips you're supposed to have, yes.

citanul

(at least i think so, we can go back and look at greg's post and see how he defines it i guess, but in practice, yes)

[/ QUOTE ]

I could be wrong, but I don't think it's 'minimal' preflop fold equity, but ZERO. Unless of course, the raiser is such a JOPKE that they'd fold getting almost 4-1.

[MrX]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

in this hand, i had little to no folding equity preflop, as per the definition of a stop and go. as i didn't want to go into defining a stop and go in this thread, i will not now.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'll nitpick: is it really part of the definition of a stop and go that you have to have minimal PF folding equity, or is it just that that's when it is a good idea to employ one?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, for SNG purposes (at least to me, the term has yet to appear in Webster's).

[DonButtons]

he has A3o, you lose!

[NYCNative]

[ QUOTE ]
i'm making an exception to ignoring you for this post. because your post here again makes it apparent you're stupid.

[/ QUOTE ]Gee, make insults and then put me back on ignore. All that bluster and you're really just a coward. Shock.[ QUOTE ]
scuba is saying that it was a mistake for MY OPPONENT to have done anything but push if he knows that i'm tricky.

[/ QUOTE ]You said and I quote that villain "stunk." You expect such a bad player to a) realize that you're anything (I realize that you're a flaming windbag who likes the sound of his own overly insultive and verbally challenged posts) let alone "tricky" and b) be smart enough to make that call when in his head he feels he is beat here? You must play with a particularly savy, stinky villain, which seems oxymoronic.[ QUOTE ]
you took that somehow as justification to think that i should have pushed over my opponent's opening raise.

[/ QUOTE ]No I didn't. Instead of foaming, try reading for comprehension. I merely said that a standard part of the definition of a Stop-N-Go that I've seen here is that folding equity is at zero or quite minimal. Sorry, but if villain is as terrible and pushing everything like you said, he (in my experiences) is just smart enough to "know" he's beat but too stupid to make the correct call despite that.

[Degen]

[ QUOTE ]
Opponent stunk, and was trying to do lots of cheap stealing for a long while now. He even went to the wonderful extent of raising big when he had a real hand

[/ QUOTE ]

hey doood...thats my whole game right there. lol


Andre

[jcm4ccc]

I like this play a lot, but only because you are ITM. This is "fancy play" Stop and Go. You shouldn't have posted it, though. You're just going to confuse people more. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[chopchoi]

Children, behave!

[durron597]

If this opponent likes to do a lot of cheap stealing, this line is (dare I say it?) standard?

[NYCNative]

Aw, but he started it...

[AJo Go All In]

stop and go is a term used outside of tournament situations, so i would disagree

[durron597]

[ QUOTE ]
stop and go is a term used outside of tournament situations, so i would disagree

[/ QUOTE ]

Welcome to STT AJo, I hope you post here more often /images/graemlins/grin.gif