Do you like this play? Yes or no?

[Bigwig]

Party $50

My thoughts are that AK should certainly reraise here. But to what? A solid raise here is to t300. That's exactly 1/3 of the raisers stack (before his initial raise), and just over 30% of mine. Considering that AK often needs the turn and river to win if called, why not push? So, I pushed. Thoughts?


Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t30 (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

UTG (t1330)
UTG+1 (t770)
MP1 (t980)
MP2 (t2345)
MP3 (t900)
CO (t1775)
Hero (t975)
SB (t690)
BB (t235)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A/images/graemlins/spade.gif, K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
<font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 raises to t100</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to t975 (All-In)</font>

[Newt_Buggs]

I don't see any shame in calling, especially since you have position and people left to act after you

[pergesu]

If you just call and miss the flop, you're not in bad shape at all. Any reads on this guy?

I really think either calling or pushing here is fine. Certainly if you're going to raise, you have to push. It would depend on how I feel, but most of the time I'm not gonna put in over 10% of my stack with AK and not pop it. I push here too.

[treeofwisdom7]

i really wanted to say no.. that your a big joke but i cant disagree with your play.

2-1 against catching the flop so if you bet T100 when you hit and get called you will have a break even bet. but you can steal here too.

[lehighguy]

I either smooth call or raise to 200. Going all in scares of AQ, which will undoubtly give you his whole stack if you both hit the ace. If he has a pair your behind, and if he has AA or KK your behind alot.

I'm much more likely to go all in with QQ then AK. You are way more likely to dominate someone and if AK calls you are a favorite.

[Freudian]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't see any shame in calling, especially since you have position and people left to act after you

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly what I was going to write. Use position here.

[FatBoyPete]

call, you go all in you still have a low stack BB (that may very well call for the pot odds on a decent hand) and a mid sized SB stack to deal with - not to mention if you get called by the raiser with anything but AQ you're putting your tournament on the line too early in a coinflip situation

[tigerite]

It'd be nice if there was a third option. I don't think it's a joke play but not one I would make personally. If the blinds were 25/50 I like this play a lot more as then it's 175 in the pot instead of just 145, and 175 is in the magic "20-50% of your stack" bracket with which you should push AK. Give or take a few chips, anyway. But because it's so early in the tournament and you can easily recoup those 100 chips I would just call here.

[curtains]

My normal play here is to go allin, a large part due to the position in which the villian open raised. Hands like A6s or even worse are going to be open raised to 100 here by some opponents. btw I am the master of folding AK to a single raise in sit and go's (not sure if this is a good thing) however I don't think this is a proper time to do so.

If the raise was something like 80, and me and the villian both had 1000-1200 in chips, then I'd be more apt to call. Also I'd be more apt to call in round 1 sometimes.

[Bigwig]

[ QUOTE ]

My normal play here is to go allin,

[/ QUOTE ]

For what reasons? Primarily the hourly rate/fold equity considersations?

I've only heard from one person (Curtains) who voted 'yes.' The slight majority has said yes. I'd like to hear from more of those people.

[Phil Van Sexton]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

My normal play here is to go allin,

[/ QUOTE ]

For what reasons? Primarily the hourly rate/fold equity considersations?

I've only heard from one person (Curtains) who voted 'yes.' The slight majority has said yes. I'd like to hear from more of those people.

[/ QUOTE ]

I voted yes earlier but didn't respond because I couldn't really say why. I just read Curtains's explanations, and I like his explanation.

An open raise to 100 on level 2 from MP really doesn't mean anything. A couple times I've done push AK like this and the other guy folded and said "good bet, I had 99" or something.

I doubt it has anything to do with hourly rate since Curtains plays in sets (as do I).

[microbet]

[ QUOTE ]
Party $50

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t100 (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

UTG (t1330)
UTG+1 (t770)
MP1 (t980)
MP2 (t2345)
MP3 (t900)
CO (t1775)
Hero (t975)
SB (t690)
BB (t235)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A/images/graemlins/spade.gif, K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
<font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 CALLS t100</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to t975 (All-In)</font>

[/ QUOTE ]

Compare and contrast. [note the changes to the hand]

[Bigwig]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Party $50

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t100 (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

UTG (t1330)
UTG+1 (t770)
MP1 (t980)
MP2 (t2345)
MP3 (t900)
CO (t1775)
Hero (t975)
SB (t690)
BB (t235)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A/images/graemlins/spade.gif, K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
<font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 CALLS t100</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to t975 (All-In)</font>

[/ QUOTE ]

Compare and contrast. [note the changes to the hand]

[/ QUOTE ]

You're going to have to expand on that one. That situation is an easy all-in.

[microbet]

Ok. It is later in the game, so you will have fewer opportunities in the future, which would make you more inclined to push. But, you have the same hand, in the same position, facing the same bet and I think the later limp and the early raise are not much different as far as their implications about your opponent's hand strength.

I'm not really sure what one hand says about the other, but I think most people will think that the level four hand is an easy all-in and I wonder if comparing the two hands might make people who wouldn't normally do so, consider pushing the original hand.

[and I realize there is less money in the pot from the blinds too]

[Meatmaw]

For those of you who advocate pushing instead of raising to, say, 300, is a large factor the positioning, i.e. you might just raise from SB?

I'm trying to understand why it would be a mistake to simply raise since having to let it go if the flop or flop-turn misses me (if he checks the flop) doesn't seem terribly bad with 675 at this stage. I'm suspecting this is a moderate leak in my early play.

[adanthar]

On the button, with no dead money involved, I'm just calling this.

[J-Lo]

[ QUOTE ]
For those of you who advocate pushing instead of raising to, say, 300, is a large factor the positioning, i.e. you might just raise from SB?

I'm trying to understand why it would be a mistake to simply raise since having to let it go if the flop or flop-turn misses me (if he checks the flop) doesn't seem terribly bad with 675 at this stage. I'm suspecting this is a moderate leak in my early play.

[/ QUOTE ]

You do not want to be putting 1/3rd yoru stack in the middle and then fold preflop/flop. That's why you push-- get to see all 5 cards if called.

How much would you reraise w/ AA/kk/qq?

[curtains]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
For those of you who advocate pushing instead of raising to, say, 300, is a large factor the positioning, i.e. you might just raise from SB?

I'm trying to understand why it would be a mistake to simply raise since having to let it go if the flop or flop-turn misses me (if he checks the flop) doesn't seem terribly bad with 675 at this stage. I'm suspecting this is a moderate leak in my early play.

[/ QUOTE ]

You do not want to be putting 1/3rd yoru stack in the middle and then fold preflop/flop. That's why you push-- get to see all 5 cards if called.

How much would you reraise w/ AA/kk/qq?

[/ QUOTE ]


Against a player I play with a lot, I would either go allin with all of the hands, or raise to like 300-350 with all of the hands. If I'm playing a relative stranger, I'll do what I think is strategically best.

[Meatmaw]

How much is ok to put in the middle then? I had thought it was anything over 40% which you elect to push. Granted, 1/3 is close to 40% but the line needs to be drawn somewhere.

[Bigwig]

[ QUOTE ]
How much is ok to put in the middle then? I had thought it was anything over 40% which you elect to push. Granted, 1/3 is close to 40% but the line needs to be drawn somewhere.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think this largely depends on the stack sizes of your opponent, and the hand you hold. QQ is a made hand, AK is not. 40% of the time, your winning card comes on the turn or river with AK.

[nokona13]

I think the updated situation is much more clear cut. I mean, if the BB had a real stack, this could be a PVS situation with any two. With the BB likely to call anything but maybe 27o, you'd want a real hand here, but I think this is a very clear place to pick up ~400 chips with a push against a random hand.

I voted no on the original. On the button here, I really like to just call. If raiser is tight and will fold TT and maybe even JJ if you haven't played a hand yet, then I'm probably wrong, but I think it's too early to have that good a read and the raiser could easily call mid-pairs here, something I don't want to risk this early. I call and play with position.

[J-Lo]

Playing hard fast rules in poker is an easy way to go broke. I think putting your oponent on ranges of hands, and then finding the best way to play YOUR hand vs that range is obviously stronger, there is no reason to "draw the line" anywhere. Some people use the "40% rule" but still push 1300 chips at lvl 4 from the button w/ A9s. Playing the situation is more important.

In this situation, raising to 300 and then folding COULD be disastrous. IF you oponent decides to push w/ 99-QQ and you fold? Or they bluff you on the flop when you miss? Pushing takes all those possibilities out of the equation.

Let's look at the flip side, u reraise, they call and flop comes A or K high. Great-- but will you get their stack in the middle? So you win 200 MORE chips 1/3rd of the time.

I'm weak tight, and call and hope to hit the flop-- but i need to look for situations to take advantage of weak raisers.