Good float?

[ShawnHoo]

I'm in a pretty good 40/80 at Commerce. It's not super-loose (I saw someone in another game put in 6 bets preflop with J7 suited), but there's enough action to keep me happy.

I'm UTG in a 7-handed game with red 99 and raise. My image, IMHO, is pretty tight. Folded to the button, an older gentleman who tends to chase with any pair or draw, who calls. SB folds. BB, a young guy who's trying to "play good" but seems way too weak to be a winner in this game, calls as well.

Flop: Jh 6h 7h

BB bets, I call, button calls.

Turn: 8c

BB bets, I raise.

My thought process was that I probably have the button beat and that BB is one of the few who could very well fold a J here. Even if I get called in both spots, I still have outs.

[JihadOnTheRiver]

Am I missing something here or is this an extremely easy raise? I'm more curious about the rest of the hand. Please post...

[PokerBob]

I like it, but I fail to see how this is a float. /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[tighterr]

Wouldnt you normally reraise the flop? Is the sb known to only bet top pair or something? You describe him as being weak, wouldnt you want to at least isolate him?

[PokerBob]

[ QUOTE ]
Wouldnt you normally reraise the flop? Is the sb known to only bet top pair or something? You describe him as being weak, wouldnt you want to at least isolate him?

[/ QUOTE ]

A flop raise is unlikely to isolate, as anyone behind that can call for one on this board can likely call for 2. Waiting for a safe turn is the right play here IMO.

[tighterr]

I see your point. I just thought that the reraise may help to persuade the late position to not call and get you a free card on the turn from the sb. I guess I like the idea of gathering information with the small bet rather the big.

[ShawnHoo]

You're right -- a "float", as I understand it, is playing passively until the later rounds, then raising to take the pot away. Since I had raised pre-flop, that doesn't apply here.

I used it simply because I probably don't have the best hand right now, but would like to fold a marginal hand that's better than mine.

[ShawnHoo]

Well, I was wondering if it was an easy raise or FPS. The pot's not that big on the flop -- does a flop fold make more sense? Do we think we can keep the button in the hand on the turn, but get the BB to fold for one bet when he's closing the action?

[Chris Piekarski]

I don't see how you can fold the flop. You're beating more than half of the hands he can bet with there, and if he has a J your flush draw will usually be good. If the guy behind you is a chaser, you won't get him out with a raise on the flop, so I like the call. I also like raising the turn since it might get the button off a flush draw. You have outs no matter what unless somebody's got a flush already. Pretty standard stuff here, I think.

[bernie]

[ QUOTE ]
You're right -- a "float", as I understand it, is playing passively until the later rounds, then raising to take the pot away. Since I had raised pre-flop, that doesn't apply here.

I used it simply because I probably don't have the best hand right now, but would like to fold a marginal hand that's better than mine.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's called a semi bluff.

Floating is primarily referring to preflop play.

b

[ShawnHoo]

It was my "plan" (or perhaps just wishful thinking) to make BB fold the best hand and see the button call with a draw.

So I raised and button started looking at me all confused. He eventually decided to call and BB sighed and folded.

The river was a black Q. I fired out again (looking back, I'm not sure there was any potential value to be gained here by doing so) and button called. I turned over my 99 to the cry of "Noo!" from the BB. Button, still looking at me all confused, turned over KhQd and took it down.

BB told me that he had folded a J with a weak kicker, but said he would have called me down for sure if the button had folded.

[Chris Piekarski]

Probably not too much value, but if you're going to call his bet anyway you might as well fire. He could call with Ah8d or something similar.

[Subfallen]

I think OP should have raised the flop to try to fold possible overcards from the button/free card, could be wrong.

However, I'm mostly interested in looking at this hand from BB's perspective.

So UTG raises, button CC's, and BB calls with something like JTo, pot is 6.5 SB. Flop comes J high monotone. So BB bets (is this correct?)

Now PFR smoothcalls. How to read this? I have to think that overcards + A/K-high flush draw would be an easy raise here, if only to give button's {88/99 with a heart, gutshot draw, A7s, etc.} a chance to fold. Especially when BB could be semi-bluffing some draw, and the raise could easily get a free card when button folds.

Also, a AA/KK with a heart (or JJ) will likely raise trying to get lots of bets in with great equity against probable drawing hands.

But say PFR has black AA (or AJs), for example. Now button is not folding a good draw getting 4.25:1 on a flop raise, so PFR should wait for the turn and get in lots more money when it comes down good.

So after the PFR's smoothcall I think BB is looking at:
x the flopped flush
x an overpair, no heart
x AJs
x 99/TT with a heart

Now what to do on the turn?? All of these hands should raise BB, right?! Of course check-folding seems impossibly weak, but what the hell is going on here?