Are these the kind of pre-flop calls I need to make due to pot-odds?

[Karak567]

***** Hand History for Game 2131125841 *****
NL Hold'em $20 Buy-in + $2 Entry Fee Trny:12675293 Level:1 Blinds(10/15) - Monday, May 30, 21:15:37 EDT 2005
Table Table 13802 (Real Money)
Seat 4 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 1: RedSoxWS04 ( $695 )
Seat 6: sepher28 ( $800 )
Seat 5: jcan3 ( $850 )
Seat 4: KingDevo ( $505 )
Seat 8: Amy5thSt ( $755 )
Seat 3: ephs4 ( $1005 )
Seat 9: holeplug22 ( $1030 )
Seat 2: DingleBurry ( $700 )
Seat 10: Homestar1981 ( $685 )
Seat 7: ciivil111 ( $975 )
Trny:12675293 Level:1
Blinds(10/15)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to sepher28 [ Td Jc ]
>You have options at Table 13805 Table!.
ciivil111 calls [15].
Amy5thSt raises [45].
holeplug22 folds.
Homestar1981 folds.
RedSoxWS04 folds.
DingleBurry calls [45].
ephs4 folds.
KingDevo folds.
jcan3 calls [35].
sepher28 calls [30].

[splashpot]

I'd fold it.

[Bigwig]

I'd fold.

Calling is not 'horrible,' because yes, you have good pot odds.

However, this is a SNG, where the Top 3 pay out. And it's fast. This kind of call is better in a MTT, where you're hoping to flop a monster and build a stack, for it's the only way to realistically reach a final table and make real $$$. Doubling up early in a SNG is great, but not vital in terms of $EV.

So, I'd fold.

[Karak567]

[ QUOTE ]
I'd fold it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I would too but today I read in HoH that when you are getting 4 or 5-1 on your money pre-flop, you need to call.

[Eric Draven]

Not really, but I don't think it's horrible either...

[splashpot]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I'd fold it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I would too but today I read in HoH that when you are getting 4 or 5-1 on your money pre-flop, you need to call.

[/ QUOTE ]
You'd have to flop 2 pair or better to feel comfortable about your hand after the flop. You definately don't want to put any more chips into the pot with anything less than 2 pair. I don't like this preflop call even with 5-1 odds. Pick a spot where you have a real edge and milk it for all you can.

[Bigwig]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I'd fold it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I would too but today I read in HoH that when you are getting 4 or 5-1 on your money pre-flop, you need to call.

[/ QUOTE ]

HoH centers around MTTs. As I said in my post--it's a different strategy.

[barycentric]

Do you need this pot?

[Bigwig]

[ QUOTE ]
Do you need this pot?

[/ QUOTE ]

Er, wrong type of hand for this line.

[Ryendal]

All in aLL, pot odds are not so important in sit$go

[adanthar]

In a $109 I would call very quickly, but you might not have sufficient chips to get away with it in a 22. OTOH, they pay off more, so I probably play it anyway. I like playing, it's fun.

(hands like these are probably pretty neutral one way or the other, so if you want to get better postflop, this is the time)

[adanthar]

[ QUOTE ]
All in aLL, pot odds are not so important in sit$go

[/ QUOTE ]

Stop playing SNG's now; they're the wrong game for you. I recommend Parcheesi.

[Bigwig]

[ QUOTE ]
All in aLL, pot odds are not so important in sit$go

[/ QUOTE ]

Where did this terrible, terrible, awful, awful, terrible, horrible, terrible, awful, bad, terrible 'pot odds don't matter' business start? I must've seen it 10 times this month in this forum.

[SlackerMcFly]

What is your goal here? You are getting 5:1 pot odds to call. However, it raises the pot odds for those that may have a real hand as well this early.

If you get a miracle board and flop 2 pair, how would those cards (think of suits) improve the other hands?

Too early to get involved IMHO with a raise and a call in front of you.

Keep in mind that this comes from a Noob, so take it for what it's worth.

SlackerMcFlyByNightLost$45Today.........

[jgunnip]

[ QUOTE ]
HoH centers around MTTs. As I said in my post--it's a different strategy.

[/ QUOTE ]

There are also a lot of SNG examples but most, if not all, center around 1,000-1,500 starting stack games.

[BradleyT]

[ QUOTE ]
What is your goal here? You are getting 5:1 pot odds to call. However, it raises the pot odds for those that may have a real hand as well this early.

If you get a miracle board and flop 2 pair, how would those cards (think of suits) improve the other hands?

Too early to get involved IMHO with a raise and a call in front of you.

Keep in mind that this comes from a Noob, so take it for what it's worth.

SlackerMcFlyByNightLost$45Today.........

[/ QUOTE ]

If we flop two pair who cares what anyone else has, they're a dog unless they have a set.

Even if they flop a flush draw and gutshot straight draw with a pair we're still ahead.

A/images/graemlins/heart.gif J/images/graemlins/heart.gif
J/images/graemlins/spade.gif T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif

Flop:
T/images/graemlins/heart.gif J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif

pokenum -h ah jh - td js -- th 3h jd
Holdem Hi: 990 enumerated boards containing Jd Th 3h
cards win %win lose %lose tie %tie EV
Ah Jh 444 44.85 541 54.65 5 0.51 0.451
Js Td 541 54.65 444 44.85 5 0.51 0.549

[SlackerMcFly]

[ QUOTE ]
pokenum -h ah jh - td js -- th 3h jd
Holdem Hi: 990 enumerated boards containing Jd Th 3h
cards win %win lose %lose tie %tie EV
Ah Jh 444 44.85 541 54.65 5 0.51 0.451
Js Td 541 54.65 444 44.85 5 0.51 0.549

[/ QUOTE ]

Great response! He had J /images/graemlins/club.gif (not that it matters here)
Thanks for running the numbers on this hand.

Still, I think the margin is too small to gambooool it up with this hand this early in the tournament. Perhaps the small edge demonstrated would and should be exploited at a later time is my only (weak-ass) point.

Slacker - Who is still really bad at math and has no avatar.

[johnnybeef]

[ QUOTE ]
In a $109 I would call very quickly, but you might not have sufficient chips to get away with it in a 22. OTOH, they pay off more, so I probably play it anyway. I like playing, it's fun.

(hands like these are probably pretty neutral one way or the other, so if you want to get better postflop, this is the time)

[/ QUOTE ]

i dont know if i like this advice....if you want to get better post flop, clear a bonus playing the $25 nl at party.