*****rubber game***** moose vs. fatty

[sublime]

late start tonight, it will be interesting to see how the NYY respond to thier worst embarressment since last october.

http://www.newsday.com/includes/esg/lspt.jpg

[Voltron87]

the yankees have a big advantage in this game.

[Jakesta]

[ QUOTE ]
the yankees have a big advantage in this game.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, I took the Yanks on Pinny at -178 last night. The line has since gone to -206. Should be a very interesting first two innings.

[tbach24]

I want a brawl.

[Jakesta]

[ QUOTE ]
I want a brawl.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not going to happen.

Wells does not hit people, and Mussina has never done it in his career.

[Dead]

The Yankees bats will hit Wells early and often, and the Yankees will triumph by the score of 5 to 2.

[Jakesta]

[ QUOTE ]
The Yankees bats will hit Wells early and often, and the Yankees will triumph by the score of 5 to 2.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think you are giving enough credit to the Boston offense. They just scored 17 runs off the Yankees yesterday. And I am a Yankees fan.

[Jack of Arcades]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I want a brawl.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not going to happen.

Wells does not hit people, and Mussina has never done it in his career.

[/ QUOTE ]

Um, what? They've hit over 100 batters combined.

[Jakesta]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I want a brawl.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not going to happen.

Wells does not hit people, and Mussina has never done it in his career.

[/ QUOTE ]

Um, what? They've hit over 100 batters combined.

[/ QUOTE ]

What I meant is that they don't do it intentionally. I thought that was obvious. They don't throw at people like Pedro or Clemens do.

If you could point out an instance of either Wells or Mussina hitting someone intentionally, please point it out.

[tbach24]

In white so those who have you blocked won't have to see it:

[ QUOTE ]
<font color="white">The Yankees bats will hit Wells early and often, and the Yankees will triumph by the score of 5 to 2. </font>

[/ QUOTE ]

lol, I love these posts. Insert any pitcher for Wells, and some score where the Yankees win, and this is every prediction ever made by you.

[Clarkmeister]

It's a couple of non playoff teams, who cares?

[Jakesta]

[ QUOTE ]
It's a couple of non playoff teams, who cares?

[/ QUOTE ]

If you think that, then you should look at the divisional odds on Pinnacle, and make a bet on Baltimore.

[Voltron87]

[ QUOTE ]
In white so those who have you blocked won't have to see it:

[ QUOTE ]
<font color="white">The Yankees bats will hit Wells early and often, and the Yankees will triumph by the score of 5 to 2. </font>

[/ QUOTE ]

lol, I love these posts. Insert any pitcher for Wells, and some score where the Yankees win, and this is every prediction ever made by you.

[/ QUOTE ]

seriously. Dead, why don't you do what I do, when the Yankees have a favorable matchup just say "We have an advantage" and when we don't say "it will be a good game".

[tbach24]

Because he's irrational about the Yankees. I love how he says "The Yankees bats will hit Wells early and often" and "will triumph to a score of 5 to 2."

Early and often usually results in a score greater than 5. Especially when pertaining to the Sox/Yankees.

[Voltron87]

[ QUOTE ]
Because he's irrational about the Yankees.

[/ QUOTE ]

ahhhhhh... you really think so?

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It's a couple of non playoff teams, who cares?

[/ QUOTE ]

If you think that, then blah blah blah.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think that because I looked at the standings and right now neither team is a playoff team.

[Voltron87]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It's a couple of non playoff teams, who cares?

[/ QUOTE ]

If you think that, then blah blah blah.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think that because I looked at the standings and right now neither team is a playoff team.

[/ QUOTE ]

your joke was not funny.

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It's a couple of non playoff teams, who cares?

[/ QUOTE ]

If you think that, then blah blah blah.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think that because I looked at the standings and right now neither team is a playoff team.

[/ QUOTE ]

your joke was not funny.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's no joke. Really. Neither team would be in the playoffs right now.

[Voltron87]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It's a couple of non playoff teams, who cares?

[/ QUOTE ]

If you think that, then blah blah blah.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think that because I looked at the standings and right now neither team is a playoff team.

[/ QUOTE ]

your joke was not funny.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's no joke. Really. Neither team would be in the playoffs right now.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's may.

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It's a couple of non playoff teams, who cares?

[/ QUOTE ]

If you think that, then blah blah blah.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think that because I looked at the standings and right now neither team is a playoff team.

[/ QUOTE ]

your joke was not funny.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's no joke. Really. Neither team would be in the playoffs right now.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's may.

[/ QUOTE ]

In two day's you'll be able to say "It's June". Is that early enough to worry? Both teams have broken down rotations among other issues. Best case is that just one of these two makes the playoffs, and neither is likely to be a serious contender even when they do. This is really a meaningless series to those who aren't Yankee or Red Sox fans.

[sublime]

In two day's you'll be able to say "It's June". Is that early enough to worry? Both teams have broken down rotations among other issues. Best case is that just one of these two makes the playoffs, and neither is likely to be a serious contender even when they do. This is really a meaningless series to those who aren't Yankee or Red Sox fans.

and all of those people have the abilty to not click on this thread.

[Voltron87]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It's a couple of non playoff teams, who cares?

[/ QUOTE ]

If you think that, then blah blah blah.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think that because I looked at the standings and right now neither team is a playoff team.

[/ QUOTE ]

your joke was not funny.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's no joke. Really. Neither team would be in the playoffs right now.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's may.

[/ QUOTE ]

In two day's you'll be able to say "It's June". Is that early enough to worry? Both teams have broken down rotations among other issues. Best case is that just one of these two makes the playoffs, and neither is likely to be a serious contender even when they do. This is really a meaningless series to those who aren't Yankee or Red Sox fans.

[/ QUOTE ]

Neither is likely to be a serious contender? Ok. Both are &gt;&gt; the orioles, especially with the orioles all getting injured now. It's not a very meaningful series for other people sure, but... what does that have to do with it.

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
In two day's you'll be able to say "It's June". Is that early enough to worry? Both teams have broken down rotations among other issues. Best case is that just one of these two makes the playoffs, and neither is likely to be a serious contender even when they do. This is really a meaningless series to those who aren't Yankee or Red Sox fans.

and all of those people have the abilty to not click on this thread.

[/ QUOTE ]

True. We also have the ability to point out how crappy both teams look this year. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[sublime]

True. We also have the ability to point out how crappy both teams look this year

must be a joy to play in the NL central /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
True. We also have the ability to point out how crappy both teams look this year

must be a joy to play in the NL central /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Of course it is. But then again, what's the Yankees' record against teams above and below .500 this year?

[Jack of Arcades]

Yeah, man. 5 and 4 games above .500. So bad.

[sublime]

Of course it is. But then again, what's the Yankees' record against teams above and below .500 this year?

wow, your asking me to piss on the NYY? /images/graemlins/grin.gif

i cant (and wont) defend the NYY, but the sox have had just about everything go wrong for them that can possibly be imagined yet are still above water. they have also played the most road games in the AL and the least amount of home games. that stuff matters. talk to me in july. yawn.

[Voltron87]

yeah, the yankees have been doing awful recently too. we really need to turn it around and go on a nice run for 18 games or so. plus, 3.5 games back from an injured and in over their heads baltimore with only 100 games left? Insurmountable.

[sublime]

Yeah, man. 5 and 4 games above .500. So bad.

i understand where he is coming from, as NE baseball fans ignore the rest of baseball for the most part and the fact that otehr teams are doing great almost always gets overlooked. makes ya want to piss on the underachieving giants.

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
yeah, the yankees have been doing awful recently too. we really need to turn it around and go on a nice run for 18 games or so. plus, 3.5 games back from an injured and in over their heads baltimore with only 100 games left? Insurmountable.

[/ QUOTE ]

For a team that has only gotten healthy because it's been playing against the dregs of their league, it's pretty amazing that Yankee fans could be so cocky against a team with such obvious and difficult to fix problems.

I'll bet any Yankee fan any amount of money that the Cardinals go further than the Yankees this year.

[Voltron87]

its like every yankee hater gets memos from espn on what to say... i don't even have to counter that its such a bad argument.

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
its like every yankee hater gets memos from espn on what to say... i don't even have to counter that its such a bad argument.

[/ QUOTE ]

I haven't watched ESPN in a month. Been too busy. Besides, the only counter needed is "OK Clarky, I wager XXXX".

[Jakesta]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
its like every yankee hater gets memos from espn on what to say... i don't even have to counter that its such a bad argument.

[/ QUOTE ]

I haven't watched ESPN in a month. Been too busy. Besides, the only counter needed is "OK Clarky, I wager XXXX".

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you not think that the Cardinals have been helped by playing in the easiest division in baseball? No one else has a shot at winning the Central, while the NL East, NL West, and AL East are all wide open right now.


It is clear to me that the NL East and AL East are the two toughest divisions in baseball, with 4 teams contending in the AL East, and all 5 contending in the NL East.
Milwaukee is the only other decent team in the Central right now. And the Cardinals do have a great offense, but Mulder is now an incredibly overrated pitcher without big game stuff. I think he cracked last year.

Look how Boston crushed your Cardinals last year, with minimal effort.

I think that St. Louis will get hammered by both Boston and New York when they meet in June. I don't think that the Cards will win more than 2 games out of the 6.

[Voltron87]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
its like every yankee hater gets memos from espn on what to say... i don't even have to counter that its such a bad argument.

[/ QUOTE ]

I haven't watched ESPN in a month. Been too busy. Besides, the only counter needed is "OK Clarky, I wager XXXX".

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't follow the Cardinals closely enough to make a wager. I know enough to talk [censored] about them though. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Clarkmeister]

All that matters is who goes further in the postseason. I've got money that says the Cardinals do.

[Jack of Arcades]

[ QUOTE ]
And the Cardinals do have a great offense, but Mulder is now an incredibly overrated pitcher without big game stuff.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, that overrated [censored] only has a 2.25 ERA in the playoffs.

[Voltron87]

[ QUOTE ]
All that matters is who goes further in the postseason. I've got money that says the Cardinals do.

[/ QUOTE ]

thats not a very good bet for any AL team against the cardinals, even if they are better than the cardinals. do you see why.

[Jakesta]

[ QUOTE ]
All that matters is who goes further in the postseason. I've got money that says the Cardinals do.

[/ QUOTE ]

No offense, but this is a really unfair proposition. The AL playoffs will be much more difficult than the NL ones, because the top 4 AL teams will undoubtedly be better than the 4 NL teams. The NL is weak. If you're offering whether NY goes farther than the Cards or whether Boston goes farther, then it's not a very fair bet, because chances are these two teams(NY and Boston) will end up meeting in the ALCS.

[Jakesta]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
All that matters is who goes further in the postseason. I've got money that says the Cardinals do.

[/ QUOTE ]

thats not a very good bet for any AL team against the cardinals, even if they are better than the cardinals. do you see why.

[/ QUOTE ]

I just explained why it is not a good bet to him above.

Jakesta.

Basically, it's unfair because the NL is so weak. The Cards will only have one real tough opponent(Florida or Atlanta) on their way to the World Series, while NY/Boston will have two(and they will end up facing each other most likely)

[Jack of Arcades]

[ QUOTE ]
All that matters is who goes further in the postseason. I've got money that says the Cardinals do.

[/ QUOTE ]

"Who goes further in the postseason" is a pretty shitty way to rank teams...

[sublime]

because chances are these two teams(NY and Boston) will end up meeting in the ALCS

i dont think both of these teams make it this year (playoffs i mean). i could be wrong, but i think the gap between them and the rest of the league is mush shorter now. also the divisional games are gonan wear down the AL east teams.

[Jakesta]

Regardless, Mr. Sublime, Clarkmeister's argument is flawed, and I believe that he knows this.

Boston crushed St Louis last year, and I believe that Boston and New York will have their way with the Cardinals this June as well.

You are 100% right about the divisional games, and that was my main point. St Louis will have one easy series, no matter what, while the Yankees or Red Sox will have two difficult series.

[Voltron87]

yeah, we're saying the same thing. i was responding to clark, did i reply to you by accident?

[sublime]

Boston crushed St Louis last year, and I believe that Boston and New York will have their way with the Cardinals this June as well.

i disagree. the advantage the NYY and Sox have over StL in playoff baseball is the shortening of the pithcing staffs. that advantage is lessened in the regular season, for obvious reasons.

[Vince Young]

[ QUOTE ]
Regardless, Mr. Sublime, Clarkmeister's argument is flawed, and I believe that he knows this.

[/ QUOTE ]
He should've just gone with: STL beat KC, KC beat TB, and TB beat NYY.

[sublime]

i hope you are also aware that StL plays the NYY and red sox at home.......

[Jakesta]

Yes I am. I have confidence in the AL East teams, what can I say?

[sublime]

Yes I am. I have confidence in the AL East teams, what can I say?

i cant argue with your opinion on a matter, just disagree with it /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
because chances are these two teams(NY and Boston) will end up meeting in the ALCS

i dont think both of these teams make it this year (playoffs i mean).

[/ QUOTE ]

You are correct that it is unlikely both make the playoffs. I'll take that bet as well if anyone wants to wager that both the Yankees and Red Sox will make the playoffs.

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
All that matters is who goes further in the postseason. I've got money that says the Cardinals do.

[/ QUOTE ]

"Who goes further in the postseason" is a pretty shitty way to rank teams...

[/ QUOTE ]

Isn't it the ONLY way teams are ranked? The team that goes furthest was the best team that year. Period. There is no other viable ranking system. /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

[sublime]

You are correct that it is unlikely both make the playoffs. I'll take that bet as well if anyone wants to wager that both the Yankees and Red Sox will make the playoffs

i love how you dangle these huge +EV bets hoping somebody takes the other side /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
All that matters is who goes further in the postseason. I've got money that says the Cardinals do.

[/ QUOTE ]

No offense, but this is a really unfair proposition.

[/ QUOTE ]

Since when do I care if it's a fair proposition. I do enjoy seeing the Yankee fans backpedalling with their excuses in hand. At least we now know what those excuses will be in 4 months since we are hearing them now.

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
You are correct that it is unlikely both make the playoffs. I'll take that bet as well if anyone wants to wager that both the Yankees and Red Sox will make the playoffs

i love how you dangle these huge +EV bets hoping somebody takes the other side /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Yet time and time again someone takes me up on it. I had a lot of fun spending GoT's $1k from our Illini bet last year.

[Jakesta]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
All that matters is who goes further in the postseason. I've got money that says the Cardinals do.

[/ QUOTE ]

No offense, but this is a really unfair proposition.

[/ QUOTE ]

Since when do I care if it's a fair proposition. I do enjoy seeing the Yankee fans backpedalling with their excuses in hand. At least we now know what those excuses will be in 4 months since we are hearing them now.

[/ QUOTE ]

How the heck am I backpedaling? If you want me to take a stupid bet that is -EV for me then the answer is no. It doesn't make me a hypocrite, because your bet propsotiion wouldn't prove that the Cardinals are a better team than the Yankees or the Red Sox.

[Jack of Arcades]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
All that matters is who goes further in the postseason. I've got money that says the Cardinals do.

[/ QUOTE ]

"Who goes further in the postseason" is a pretty shitty way to rank teams...

[/ QUOTE ]

Isn't it the ONLY way teams are ranked? The team that goes furthest was the best team that year. Period. There is no other viable ranking system. /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Uh, from a "who's the champion" point of view, yes. Using that to figure out who the best team was, though, is pretty damn stupid.

[tbach24]

The starting lineups, a couple surprises (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/boxscore?gid=250529110)

[Jakesta]

[ QUOTE ]
The starting lineups, a couple surprises (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/boxscore?gid=250529110)

[/ QUOTE ]

Not surprising on the Yankee side. Doesn't Sanchez have great numbers against David Wells? I think Bernie has decent ones as well, plus Wells is a lefty, and Bernie bats well from the right side.

[sublime]

The starting lineups, a couple surprises

varitek needs the night off, and mussina owns him. if you think millar playing is a surprise, john olerud is no more than a spot starter/PH/def replacement.

[Jakesta]

The Red Sox should start Olerud at first base every game. His glove is superior and I think that he has a better bat at the moment.

[sublime]

The Red Sox should start Olerud at first base every game. His glove is superior and I think that he has a better bat at the moment.

if the start him everygame he will be on the DL within a month.

a better bat right now? he played ONE game.

[Jakesta]

I really think that you are underestimating Olerud. He was the reason that the Yankees lost 4 in a row to the Sox last year. He provided a steady bat in the lineup as well as veteran leadership.

[sublime]

I really think that you are underestimating Olerud. He was the reason that the Yankees lost 4 in a row to the Sox last year.

1) ?

2) reread my post, did i underestimate olerud?

[tbach24]

Sublime, it's in your best interest to check out the last 3-4 pages of the thread about the hot racing chick. You'll understand when you see.

[sublime]

yeah, i read sonme of them and am pretty sure its dead. i also got a PM giving me a heads up...if it is dead, he is a bigger retard than originally thought

[nothumb]

[ QUOTE ]
The Red Sox should start Olerud at first base every game. His glove is superior and I think that he has a better bat at the moment.

[/ QUOTE ]

Millar is a notoriously slow starter. Benching him will not get him in the groove. I think having Olerud there to push him will help as well. However others are right, Olerud is not in everyday shape and would probably not hit significantly better than Millar over the long run.

If I'm Terry I play Olerud about once a week at most, give Millar days off against pitchers he doesn't hit well and hope to help his confidence. If he's still slumping in three or four weeks and it's bringing the team down, or if Olerud stays hot, then think about switching em.

NT

[contentless]

[ QUOTE ]
yeah, i read sonme of them and am pretty sure its dead. i also got a PM giving me a heads up...if it is dead, he is a bigger retard than originally thought

[/ QUOTE ]

I mean, look at his posting rate. Seriously...holy cow.

And yesterday's Globe talked about Shoppach in the notes. He would've been here a week ago, but had a foot problem. But tonight's right, since he's worked with Wells (in ST, IIRC) before.

[JoeU]

I'm gonna actually go and watch the game. But, just to let you know, the Yanks are a stone cold lock for tonight. As I was putting my daughter to bed, she saw the Moose on the mound. I told her " that's the Moose pitching honey". She then said "night-night Moose" and blew him a kiss. It could be the kiss of death, but I have a photo to show you she's not foolin' around.

http://www.geocities.com/jpuccello@sbcglobal.net/img_1104.jpg


Joe

[Soul Daddy]

Wow, that was a freaking moon shot!

[sublime]

buuuhhhhh byyyyeeeee

[contentless]

One more run and we've yet again established Dead as a douchebag.

[sublime]

joe, i cant see the pic of your wonderfull daughter.

[sublime]

btw, i hate to sound like a brokne record, but these announcers are awful also.

[Los Feliz Slim]

Thank you so much for posting that very large picture. I would blame you more, but you are a Yankee fan from Connecticut, so there's just no accounting for your judgement.

In further news, Big Poppy just had a little something for your Moose. It landed in Connecticut.

[JoeU]

From the looks of the other posts, You might be blinded by a homerun.

Either that, or the photo really isn't loading.

Joe

[Soul Daddy]

[ QUOTE ]
One more run and we've yet again established Dead as a douchebag.

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't think the burden of proof lies with us.

[JoeU]

[ QUOTE ]
Thank you so much for posting that very large picture.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wish I knew how to make it smaller.

[ QUOTE ]
In further news, Big Poppy just had a little something for your Moose. It landed in Connecticut.

[/ QUOTE ]

I just caught the ball and threw it back! /images/graemlins/mad.gif

Joe

[Jakesta]

We haven't even seen Wells on the mound yet. Two runs is not insurmountable.

[sublime]

wow mussina sees a quailty lineup and struggles

[Jakesta]

He's not struggling. Like the bald white announcer(don't know his name) said, Mussina made good pitchers. Boston just has a good lineup. Let's see how Wells does.

[Los Feliz Slim]

I did see the pic while it was still up, BTW, and your daughter is adorable. I have a 3-month old girl who is decked out in Red Sox garb as often as her mother lets me.

[Jakesta]

Hello Jeter.

More to come. Nice pitch way up high in the zone.

[sublime]

i wonder if we get the 'derek jeter this is your life' routine all night.

[Jakesta]

Don't know what you're talking about.

But the lineup is more than capable of hitting Wells.

[JoeU]

[ QUOTE ]
I have a 3-month old girl who is decked out in Red Sox garb as often as her mother lets me.

[/ QUOTE ]

You do know that doing that is considered child abuse in most states! /images/graemlins/grin.gif

Joe

[sublime]

*** You are ignoring this user ***

the chances are high you are dead, so you get ignored.

[Jakesta]

OH gee.

What was that?

[sublime]

in dont knwo what you said, but wells is a stiff

[Jakesta]

Wells looks lost out there.

[Soul Daddy]

[ QUOTE ]
wells is a stiff

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm not entirely convinced that he's not a Yankee mole.

[Jakesta]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
wells is a stiff

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm not entirely convinced that he's not a Yankee mole.

[/ QUOTE ]

He pitched great at Baltimore this year. He's just too old and too heavy to pitch well now. He leaves fat pitches up in the zone and he has poor control.

[sublime]

I'm not entirely convinced that he's not a Yankee mole.

well maybe he can settle down

[Voltron87]

pahk the cah at the habah, sheffield ties it up.

[Jakesta]

That was a great pitch by Mussina.

[Jakesta]

I have never seen Mussina that mad before. Walking back to back batters is very unMussinalike.

[DougOzzzz]

[ QUOTE ]
I have never seen Mussina that mad before. Walking back to back batters is very unMussinalike.

[/ QUOTE ]

he didn't walk back to back batters. He struck out Shoppach in between walking Mueller and Bellhorn.

[Soul Daddy]

[ QUOTE ]
well maybe he can settle down

[/ QUOTE ]
How did you do that?

[contentless]

The most telling statistic in this game so far is this:

Wells: 25 Pitches
Mussina: 58 Pitches

I remember Mussina being pissed last year because his offense wasn't really supporting him. Seems like it's happening again this game, especially since Wells isn't really that sharp.

[Soul Daddy]

w00t!

[DougOzzzz]

EDGAH! BIG PAPI!

[sublime]

morgan- the red sox dont usually have a high OBP (dead wrong)

miller- it wasnt that long ag that mussina almost pitched a perfct game against the sox.........yeah only 2001 u idiiot


bam bam.....mussina struggling yet?

[contentless]

Slugfest out here.

Oh, and by the way, you're a douche, Dead.

[Los Feliz Slim]

BANG BANG

[Dead]

It's only a 2 run lead. Give me a break.

[sublime]

yeah morgan, the devil rays hit pop ups against mussina.......the sox hit BOMBS kneegrowww

[DougOzzzz]

[ QUOTE ]
morgan- the red sox dont usually have a high OBP (dead wrong)



[/ QUOTE ]

is that why they lead the majors in OBP? I honestly didn't hear him say that, but if he did, he's an idiot. Well he's an idiot anyways.

[contentless]

[ QUOTE ]
It's only a 2 run lead. Give me a break.

[/ QUOTE ]

"Yankees will hit Wells early and often, 5-2, blah blah blah."

[sublime]

Loc: Watching Mussina pwn

not today, bitch

[jason_t]

I don't normally participate in these threads, but jesus christ that was a f[/i]ucking monster by Ortiz.

[Dead]

Gee, that wasn't racist at all.

[sublime]

he said it was unusual that they had a high OBP

which is akin to saying its unusual for A-rod to hit homers

he is an idiot

[Dead]

You are a fool.

He's saying it's unusual because the Red Sox have never been a team to take walks. They are free swingers.

[sublime]

this is like BP for the sox

[Dead]

Joe Morgan is right.

Mussina isn't sucking.

So STFU.

[Uglyowl]

[ QUOTE ]
The RED SOX bats will hit Mussina early and often, and the RED SOX will triumph by the score of 5 to 2.

[/ QUOTE ]

FYP Dead

[sublime]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v168/Grunherz54/B-24.jpg

[Los Feliz Slim]

[ QUOTE ]
he said it was unusual that they had a high OBP
which is akin to saying its unusual for A-rod to blow Derek Jeter
he is an idiot

[/ QUOTE ]

My very first FYP.

[sublime]

i sonmehow saw what dead typed

yeah, mussina is pitching a gem you retard!!

hahahahahahhaahhaha Morgan said so

hahahahahahahhahahahahhah!!

[Uglyowl]

If Millar gets a hit, then Mussina is the worst pitcher ever.

[sublime]

he is pitching a good game. you know, 90 pitches thru 3 innings. 3 home runs....5 runs...multiple walks....cy young type [censored]

[sublime]

http://www.storm.ca/~rbutton/macuddersidepark/t%20ball%20t.jpg

the yankees starter next time the sox meet. he is tearing up the minors right now

[sublime]

that chick is a dime, i would buy dvd's for her kids

[DougOzzzz]

[ QUOTE ]
You are a fool.

He's saying it's unusual because the Red Sox have never been a team to take walks. They are free swingers.

[/ QUOTE ]

Okay. Then that's why the Sox led the league in OBP in 2003 and 2004.... and were 2nd in walks both years.

[Soul Daddy]

Sox Team OBP/MLB rank:

2005 - .366/1
2004 - .360/1
2003 - .360/1
2002 - .345/4

[sublime]

thanks for taking out my trash guys

dead just never ceases to amaze us

[sublime]

dead you are so friggin dumb


ahahahahahhahahahahah

[Aytumious]

[ QUOTE ]
Sox Team OBP/MLB rank:

2005 - .366/1
2004 - .360/1
2003 - .360/1
2002 - .345/4

[/ QUOTE ]

Joe Morgan is brilliant. He also thinks Billy Beane wrote Moneyball

[tbach24]

[ QUOTE ]
Last Play: T. Womack grounded into double play shortstop to second to first, D. Jeter out at second

[/ QUOTE ]

I believe that this is why you don't have a POS hitter batting 2nd.

[Dead]

Now we will see how Wang does against a "real team".

I did not see this move coming.

[sublime]

mussina looked awesome tonight

[Dead]

WOW, BERNIE SUCKS SO MUCH IN CENTER FIELD!

HE'S SO OLD!

Damon wouldn't have caught that.

[sublime]

*** You are ignoring this user ***

no dead, just because the yankees are showing us thier wang, we will not pull ours out.

[Aytumious]

[ QUOTE ]
WOW, BERNIE SUCKS SO MUCH IN CENTER FIELD!

HE'S SO OLD!

Damon wouldn't have caught that.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sample size dumb [censored].

[Dead]

Nerd alert. Sending in the troops.

[DougOzzzz]

Damon, or any respectable CF (even Williams a few years ago), would have made that look like a routine play.

[sublime]

another miller error (repeated it twice)

ortiz had a homer against mussina on the playoffs b4.

[sublime]

Damon, or any respectable CF (even Williams a few years ago), would have made that look like a routine play.

bingoooooooo

[Dead]

Postseason doesn't count, dipstick.

[Dead]

Damon wouldn't have caught that one either.

[sublime]

nice catch bernie

[tbach24]

When the Yankees were sucking, I recall you screaming "sample size! sample size!"

This is why I love having Dead off of ignore

Last Play: M. Ramirez singled to left center, E. Renteria scored, D. Ortiz to third

[sublime]

should i take him off?

has he commented on miller and morgan again?

[Aytumious]

[ QUOTE ]
should i take him off?

has he commented on miller and morgan again?

[/ QUOTE ]

Just his typical idiocy.

[tbach24]

Nothing substantial. I just find the comments here and there that add up to his total hipocrisy/stupidity to be great.

[Dead]

Nasty pitch by Wang.

If you think that the Yankees are out of this game then you are a dumbass.

[tbach24]

[ QUOTE ]
Now we will see how Wang does against a "real team".

I did not see this move coming.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes we shall. 4 baserunners, 1 ER.

[sublime]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/jrs362/er_owned.jpg

[Uston]

[ QUOTE ]
Nasty pitch by Wang.

[/ QUOTE ]

Having given up only one run and four baserunners in an inning, I'll admit that Wang is much better than I thought he would be.

[Dead]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Nasty pitch by Wang.

[/ QUOTE ]

Having given up only one run and four baserunners in an inning, I'll admit that Wang is much better than I thought he would be.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's his first relief appearance ever, you dip.

He'll settle down in the next inning.

[Aytumious]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Nasty pitch by Wang.

[/ QUOTE ]

Having given up only one run and four baserunners in an inning, I'll admit that Wang is much better than I thought he would be.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's his first relief appearance ever, you dip.

He'll settle down in the next inning.

[/ QUOTE ]

Reread. He was complimenting Wang.

[tbach24]

Never said they were out, just it's looking grim for Wang in his appearance.

On a good note, Renteria, Ortiz and Manny are 9-9 with 3 jacks. But you probably already knew that.

[Dynasty]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Nasty pitch by Wang.

[/ QUOTE ]

Having given up only one run and four baserunners in an inning, I'll admit that Wang is much better than I thought he would be.

[/ QUOTE ]

I know it's hard not to dismiss everything Dead says. He is quite the troll. But, Chien-Ming Wang is actually a decent young prospect.

[Dead]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Nasty pitch by Wang.

[/ QUOTE ]

Having given up only one run and four baserunners in an inning, I'll admit that Wang is much better than I thought he would be.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's his first relief appearance ever, you dip.

He'll settle down in the next inning.

[/ QUOTE ]

Reread. He was complimenting Wang.

[/ QUOTE ]

It was a backhanded compliment.

[sublime]

http://www.eggpublishing.com/images/bernie.jpg

new on itunessss....please note the title of the albulm

[contentless]

[ QUOTE ]
Reread. He was complimenting Wang.

[/ QUOTE ]

Just leave him be. He's probably seething right now, having all his predictions go wrong and all. I don't think he's having a good time at all.

And stop quoting him! /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Interestingly enough, Jakesta has disappeared. Little Dr. Jekyll action over there, Dead?

[sublime]

Chien-Ming Wang

why did miller and morgan keep calling him wong?

thats worse than saying ortiz has never homered off of mussina

[Dead]

He has posted the same minute as me like 4 times today, you fool. It's not me. Get over it.

[Dead]

[ QUOTE ]
Chien-Ming Wang

why did miller and morgan keep calling him wong?

thats worse than saying ortiz has never homered off of mussina

[/ QUOTE ]

Because it's pronounced that way?

[sublime]

And stop quoting him!

yes, PLEASE stop...i then feel compelled to respond to him and make fun of the corky

[Aytumious]

[ QUOTE ]
And stop quoting him! /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

God you are right. Having his words written once is too many. No need to propagate the idiocy.

[Uston]

I know it's hard not to dismiss everything Dead says. He is quite the troll. But, Chien-Ming Wang is actually a decent young prospect.

So is Cla Meredith, yet I'd expect nothing good to happen if he were to pitch against the Yankees tonight.

[Dead]

But Wang is pitching well against the Sox.

[tbach24]

Wow, this is the closest something has come in a while to replacing Natalie Portman as my background.

[sublime]

derek jeter leats out the secrets of baseball sucess. get runners on and move them along.......

[sublime]

this telecast is a circus


u think morgan wears clown shoes to work?

[sublime]

is miller mocking morgan&gt;?

[Dead]

Gee, Wang had a 1-2-3 inning. What a surprise, NOT. He's third in the majors in 1-2-3 innings behind Clemens and Pedro.

He's doing a hell of a lot better than Cla Meredith did.

[tbach24]

[ QUOTE ]
http://img275.echo.cx/img275/6091/79137ew.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
Watching Mussina pwn

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you blind?

[sublime]

miller- francona, manger of the NYY


HOW THE FCUK DO THESES GUYS KEEP THIER JOB?

[Aytumious]

He looks like a solid prospect, but his lack of strikeouts in the majors is a bad sign. Still, it may go up with time.

[sublime]

my apologies to morgam and miller for saying WONG...it is coreect

[Aytumious]

[ QUOTE ]
miller- francona, manger of the NYY


HOW THE FCUK DO THESES GUYS KEEP THIER JOB?

[/ QUOTE ]

Honestly, how many announcers have you not thought that about while watching a game? Most are braindead.

[Dead]

[ QUOTE ]
my apologies to morgam and miller for saying WONG...it is coreect

[/ QUOTE ]

No Sheet. I said that 15 minutes ago.

[sublime]

Honestly, how many announcers have you not thought that about while watching a game? Most are braindead.

not local ones (unless we are real lucky up here), and despite that these guys are AWFUL. its like listening to two senile old men.

[Aytumious]

Fatty looking great right now.

[Soul Daddy]

Remy is awesome, Orsillo is okay. As a tandem, they are substantially better than most.

[sublime]

yeah he dug in. low pitch count also.

[sublime]

question

does renteria beinfg a better fielder make up for theb fact that jeter is a better hitter.....or in other words, do we have the better SS?

[Dead]

Renteria is not a better fielder than Jeter. And no one in their right mind would say that you have the best SS. We have the best SS in baseball, and he's playing at 3B.

NICE DOUBLE PLAY!

Wang is keeping this game in reach.

[sublime]

let me guess....u said that jeter is a better fielder than rent...ummmm ur wrong u idiot.

[Dead]

Peachy style talk doesn't befit you.

U retard!!!!!!!111111

[contentless]

For 2004, maybe not, but for 2001-2003, Jeter was basically an average shortstop because he was SO BAD defensively.

At the moment we do though, since Renteria is so hot.

[tbach24]

[ QUOTE ]
Renteria is not a better fielder than Jeter. And no one in their right mind would say that you have the best SS. We have the best SS in baseball, and he's playing at 3B.

NICE DOUBLE PLAY!

[/ QUOTE ]

Jeter may be the worst fielding SS in baseball. He certainly was between 2000-2003. (http://www.tangotiger.net/UZR0003.html)

Yes Gay-Rod would be the best SS, however he plays 3B.

[Dead]

A-Rod is the best 3B in baseball, and it is not close.

[sublime]

he won the GG by default last year....if OC was on the sox all year it wouldnt be close

[Voltron87]

bah, even if we lose this game we are 3.5 back with 3 against the royals while boston play the o's.

[tbach24]

Yes, I never said he wasn't Stop changing the subject. Jeter is a lousy fielder and I have proved it. You are supposed to give your "but he looks so good in his tight pants" counter-point now.

[Voltron87]

[ QUOTE ]
Yes, I never said he wasn't Stop changing the subject. Jeter is a lousy fielder and I have proved it. You are supposed to give your "but he looks so good in his tight pants" counter-point now.

[/ QUOTE ]

tbach on a roll with the pants comment.

but seriously, that page you linked is just a bunch of numbers with no explanation, what are they.

[Dead]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Yes, I never said he wasn't Stop changing the subject. Jeter is a lousy fielder and I have proved it. You are supposed to give your "but he looks so good in his tight pants" counter-point now.

[/ QUOTE ]

tbach on a roll with the pants comment.

but seriously, that page you linked is just a bunch of numbers with no explanation, what are they.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you don't know what UZR is, then you shouldn't be posting in this baseball thread. No offense.

[tbach24]

I honestly have no idea. I tried to get more info on it, but the guy who did it now works for the STL Cards so he may have taken it off the web. Jack of Arcades gave it to me. I just had it up because I was writing a paper on baseball for my physics class. Something like "Super Linear Weights" is the total system and there's probably more of an explanation somewhere if someone wants to do a GS.

[Voltron87]

whatever, im not a sabremetrics freak. not knowing what uzr is does not mean i don't know anything about baseball, i disagree.

[Dead]

I'm definitely not a Bill James freak either, but I know what UZR is.

[tbach24]

[ QUOTE ]
whatever, im not a sabremetrics freak. not knowing what uzr is does not mean i don't know anything about baseball, i disagree.

[/ QUOTE ]

Dead was trying to be funny. He failed. He has no idea what UZR is either. It's basically the best way to measure a defender, but I have no idea how he formulated it.

[Dead]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
whatever, im not a sabremetrics freak. not knowing what uzr is does not mean i don't know anything about baseball, i disagree.

[/ QUOTE ]

Dead was trying to be funny. He failed. He has no idea what UZR is either. It's basically the best way to measure a defender, but I have no idea how he formulated it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I know what UZR is, and I can explain it to you if you wish.

It stands for Ultimate Zone rating, and it's important just like range factor is.

[sublime]

i like jeter and think he is a great player, but fielding is NOT his strong suit.

[contentless]

[ QUOTE ]
Yes, I never said he wasn't Stop changing the subject. Jeter is a lousy fielder and I have proved it. You are supposed to give your "but he looks so good in his tight pants" counter-point now.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's not even his counter-point. Jeter has great spin moves.

A-Rod, by the way, isn't the best 3B. Last year, both Beltre and Blalock had more fielding win shares than A-Rod, and close was Rolen (A-Rod: 5.7, Rolen, 5.6). I'm pretty sure that a lot of people would argue that it IS close.

Likewise, in terms of overall value, both Beltre and Rolen ranked ahead of A-Rod. Sure, Beltre has fallen off this year, but let's wait until the end of the season to hand out awards.

Even more when you consider who's paid what.

I recall that when I used to lurk NYYFans (back when I posted on RSN and SoSH), they used to teach their posters about statistics. What happened with you, Dead? Are you the bastard child?

[tbach24]

Explicame, por favor.

[Soul Daddy]

[ QUOTE ]
Jeter has great spin moves.

[/ QUOTE ]
Never gets old.

[Soul Daddy]

[ QUOTE ]
whatever, im not a sabremetrics freak. not knowing what uzr is does not mean i don't know anything about baseball, i disagree.

[/ QUOTE ]
If you're actually curious:

UZR #1 (http://www.baseballthinkfactory.org/files/main/article/lichtman_2003-03-14_0/)
UZR #2 (http://www.baseballthinkfactory.org/files/main/article/lichtman_2003-03-14_0/)

[Voltron87]

If anyone thinks a person who doesn't know about uzr is not very baseball savvy, theyre wrong.

im really not a fan of fielding being reduced to numbers, or a fan of people on internet message boards posting stats they dont even come close to understanding.

[Dead]

[ QUOTE ]
Explicame, por favor.

[/ QUOTE ]

I will do my best.

It is similar to defensive average.

They divide the field into different zones. Third base zone, second base zone, etc. A second baseman that turns a double play is credited with 2 outs in this system because their play on the ball resulted in two outs, and not just one, as the DA statistic would record it as.

It measures how often a fielder makes a play when the ball is hit into his zone. It removes the pitching staff biases in range factor cause it takes each hit ball one-by-one and observes whether the fielder made the play.

[Dead]

I posted an explanation above, so I'm certain I understand it a hell of a lot better than you do.

[tbach24]

Okay, that makes sense. Then how do you justify that Jeter is a good defensive SS other than the spin moves and the tight pants?

[Dead]

Because like Voltron said, stats aren't everything. I don't believe in a lot of the sabermetric bullshit propagated by you and Jack of Arcades, but I feel that I should understand it so I can argue.

[Voltron87]

how many zones are there? does it discriminate between hard it balls and easy grounders? there are soooo many factors and variables, i dont see how you can just say "there were 1325 balls hit to the SS zone and Jeter made 1290 outs" or whatever

[sublime]

http://www.dudleychateau.com/Yankee%20Email/jeter%20skirt.gif

spin moves? my kneegrow got mad hops

[Dead]

Stop being a racist prick.

[Dead]

No it doesn't discriminate. And I agree with you. A lot of these sabermetric stats are total bullshit. I happen to think that Jete is a great fielder. But I make an effort to understand it, and you should too.

[tbach24]

Wow, you're really going after my background here. First Bernie's CD, now this. Cannot. Replace. Portman /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Voltron87]

whats the over under on times youre going to post this with no one laughing? 10?

putting a pink dress on a baseball player? are you 10 years old? What's next a scathing cooties diss?

[contentless]

[ QUOTE ]
He has no idea what UZR is either. It's basically the best way to measure a defender, but I have no idea how he formulated it.

[/ QUOTE ]

UZR is similar to probabilistic range by Pinto, and I know how that works (I don't remember this stuff much anymore for UZR). PR works on the league probability that the average fielder will catch a certain ball in a certain place. Some balls can be fielded by multiple players; this is taken into account. Pinto then, with the average, figures each player's EV for making outs, and finds the difference between expected and actual.

You can find more about it here: http://www.baseballmusings.com/archives/004765.php

By the way, in the 2004 PMR rankings, Renteria was slightly better than Jeter; but remember, 2004 was Jeter's best year defensively. http://www.baseballmusings.com/archives/008292.php

As I've stated on multiple occasions, Jeter sucks at fielding grouders. This is supported by PMR, despite 2004 being Jeter's best defensive seasons in a long time. Jeter made more than 37 less outs than the average fielder when it was a ground ball. http://www.baseballmusings.com/archives/008305.php

Edit: I'm reading my explanation, and it sounds surprisingly like some of the reasoning used in poker. Funny how some people discredit sabermetrics so much.

[sublime]

oh you must have missed the post above yours.

[Dead]

I already explained it, dip.

[Voltron87]

its not that im not making an effort to understand it... I just don't read about sabremetrics that much. when people bring up stats i dont know about i look them up, as i am now.

my baseball routine consists of: watching every yankee game, baseball tonight, whatever game is on espn if i have time, mike and the mad dog, and reading nyyfans (its usually awful though). mostly its just watching the games.

[contentless]

[ QUOTE ]
I already explained it, dip.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks. Don't you get tired of being angry?

Not all defense can be reduced to numbers, but given a large enough sample size, these numbers always regress to the mean. Jeter is not a good fielder.

[Soul Daddy]

Forgive us for attempting to further any understanding for curious minds. Your explanation could not possibly be expanded.

[sublime]

what a motor

[sublime]

http://www.eggpublishing.com/images/bernie.jpg


that man can move

[DougOzzzz]

nice pic

[sublime]

dirty water


must suck to have ur cheif rival come in and win a series /images/graemlins/frown.gif

[James282]

You get pretty cranky when the Yanks lose, Dead. It will be interesting to see how close the Yankees come to the projected 6 game winning streak you projected to start today.
-James

[Phildo]

[ QUOTE ]
If anyone thinks a person who doesn't know about uzr is not very baseball savvy, theyre wrong.

im really not a fan of fielding being reduced to numbers, or a fan of people on internet message boards posting stats they dont even come close to understanding.

[/ QUOTE ]
The problem is that you can't judge defense by jsut watching a guy play, or you end up with crap like Jeter winning the Gold Glove last year (HOLY [censored] HE RAN INTO THE STANDS) or morons like Dead thinking Bernie is a good CF cause he makes a spectacular catch. The problem being that anyone competent would make the play and you'd just think it was a routine out. Flashy plays != good defense. I blame Sports Center for the propgation of this fallacy.

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
I think that St. Louis will get hammered by both Boston and New York when they meet in June. I don't think that the Cards will win more than 2 games out of the 6.


[/ QUOTE ]

So how's that working out?

[Voltron87]

WTF is this all about? When I signed up to be a Yankee fan no one told me this would happen.

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]


I doubt that St. Louis will get hammered by either Boston or New York when they meet in June. I don't think that the Cards will lose more than 2 games out of the 6.

[/ QUOTE ]

FYP