manku
12-17-2002, 03:05 PM
Home game, $5 dealer ante (sometimes 5-10 blinds), stacks range from $250-1500. Very loose, very aggressive.
First question: When playing dealers choice, the last bettor in the previous round leads betting the next round. How should this affect my play? Sometimes, I don't want to put a raise in preflop, as I'll be first to act on the flop. Or if I raise the flop, then I'll be first on the turn. In a game where checking virtually guarantees that the other player will bet (esp. button), how should I adjust?
Hand #1: Am dealt JQQK, double suited in BB(position, not actual BB as we only player dealer ante). SB bets out $15, gets 5 callers. This, BTW, is very normal.
Flop: QQ5, rainbow.
I bet pot, about $95 I think.
Button, a wild player, calls. At this point, I put him on a Q but no 5.
Turn: 10. No help. If I check, he'll bet the pot. BTW, at this point, I only have $180 left in front of me. I decide to go all in. He calls and turns over Q1073.
Hand#2: I wasn't involved, but it gives you an idea of the type of game we play. This time, PL HE.
Tight player (UTG) check raises pot behind 4 callers. Gets one caller(lets call him MP, BTW same player who beat me in Hand #1).
Flop 2-6-8. TP bets pot. MP thinks out loud, and says "I know you have an overpair, but I have a pair with a high kicker" and calls.
Turn: 8. Not good for TP, but bets pot, all in anyway about $80 more. MP cold calls. I figure him for A8.
River: 6
MP shows A6, TP shows QQ. MP takes it down.
Post script: I went over my records, YTD, with this game.
22 session, 11 wins, 11 loses. Down about $400 YTD. Basically, break even. However, players in this game make awful mistakes. For instance, yesterday in PL08:
Flop: 456 rainbow.
UTG bets pot, MP raises pot, two callers, UTG goes all in as does MP, final two callers call as well.
UTG: A2
MP: 2378
Other callers: one had A3, the other top set (666). BTW, I folded middle set.
MP scooped $2000 pot when Ace came on turn, and face card on river.
Another hand someone called a $500 turn bet to draw to king high flush when the low was out AND a pair showing!!!
People will constantly play hands like this, when they know they are currently losing and only playing for half the pot. A dream scenario. However, the cards just haven't fallen for me. I play in other games, am a consistent winner (on line & clubs too), but my mental state is such that I feel less confident in this game than any other, despite it being easier. I sit there folding hand after hand. Despite my tight play (image too), people call my bets so it doesn't hurt me. Players don't like to fold, so semibluffs are worthless.
Most of our sessions are between 3 1/2- 4 hours, so maybe the short time frame works against me.
Perhaps, as I read somewhere, having all these mediocre players works against me as I'm involved in too few pots. I think it was MM who said that a table full (and of the 8 players, only one is tight-aggressive, all others are loosey goosey) of these types of players is the hardest to win at.
Comments anyone, or should I just quit the game?
manku
PS. I enjoy the game and company, its fairly social, so quitting isn't really an option.
First question: When playing dealers choice, the last bettor in the previous round leads betting the next round. How should this affect my play? Sometimes, I don't want to put a raise in preflop, as I'll be first to act on the flop. Or if I raise the flop, then I'll be first on the turn. In a game where checking virtually guarantees that the other player will bet (esp. button), how should I adjust?
Hand #1: Am dealt JQQK, double suited in BB(position, not actual BB as we only player dealer ante). SB bets out $15, gets 5 callers. This, BTW, is very normal.
Flop: QQ5, rainbow.
I bet pot, about $95 I think.
Button, a wild player, calls. At this point, I put him on a Q but no 5.
Turn: 10. No help. If I check, he'll bet the pot. BTW, at this point, I only have $180 left in front of me. I decide to go all in. He calls and turns over Q1073.
Hand#2: I wasn't involved, but it gives you an idea of the type of game we play. This time, PL HE.
Tight player (UTG) check raises pot behind 4 callers. Gets one caller(lets call him MP, BTW same player who beat me in Hand #1).
Flop 2-6-8. TP bets pot. MP thinks out loud, and says "I know you have an overpair, but I have a pair with a high kicker" and calls.
Turn: 8. Not good for TP, but bets pot, all in anyway about $80 more. MP cold calls. I figure him for A8.
River: 6
MP shows A6, TP shows QQ. MP takes it down.
Post script: I went over my records, YTD, with this game.
22 session, 11 wins, 11 loses. Down about $400 YTD. Basically, break even. However, players in this game make awful mistakes. For instance, yesterday in PL08:
Flop: 456 rainbow.
UTG bets pot, MP raises pot, two callers, UTG goes all in as does MP, final two callers call as well.
UTG: A2
MP: 2378
Other callers: one had A3, the other top set (666). BTW, I folded middle set.
MP scooped $2000 pot when Ace came on turn, and face card on river.
Another hand someone called a $500 turn bet to draw to king high flush when the low was out AND a pair showing!!!
People will constantly play hands like this, when they know they are currently losing and only playing for half the pot. A dream scenario. However, the cards just haven't fallen for me. I play in other games, am a consistent winner (on line & clubs too), but my mental state is such that I feel less confident in this game than any other, despite it being easier. I sit there folding hand after hand. Despite my tight play (image too), people call my bets so it doesn't hurt me. Players don't like to fold, so semibluffs are worthless.
Most of our sessions are between 3 1/2- 4 hours, so maybe the short time frame works against me.
Perhaps, as I read somewhere, having all these mediocre players works against me as I'm involved in too few pots. I think it was MM who said that a table full (and of the 8 players, only one is tight-aggressive, all others are loosey goosey) of these types of players is the hardest to win at.
Comments anyone, or should I just quit the game?
manku
PS. I enjoy the game and company, its fairly social, so quitting isn't really an option.