Easy QQ hand (easy for everyone but me)

[Atropos]

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (6 max, 6 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

MP ($203.37)
Hero ($134.85)
Button ($98.5)
SB ($78)
BB ($136.13)
UTG ($108.6)

Preflop: Hero is CO with Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif. SB posts a blind of $0.5.
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP calls $1, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $4</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, MP calls $3.

Flop: ($9.50) 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 4/images/graemlins/club.gif, T/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
MP checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $4.5</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP raises to $9</font>, Hero calls $4.50.

Turn: ($27.50) 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">MP bets $20</font>, Hero calls $20.

River: ($67.50) 6/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">MP bets $20</font>, Hero calls $20.

Final Pot: $107.50

My NL game is soooo weak. I'm 1tabling at the moment to finally start improving again, but I never have a good read on my opponents /images/graemlins/frown.gif This opponent was quite loose-aggressive, but I feared a strange straight/two pair too much...

[iceman5]

Thats not such an easy hand. Most times when you get minimum check raised in a raised pot, he will have a set.

Theres no way I would put more money in this pot than you did so if you won and youre upset that you didnt make more money, then dont be.

I think you lost though.

[Atropos]

But doesnt the river bet look very fishy? Most of the time someone bets the same amount on turn + river it seems to be a sign of weakness.

Lets suppose I want him to fold at the river. What should I raise? All-in? 3x his raise? Minraise? (Minraise doesnt seem to work there).

[jhall23]

[ QUOTE ]
But doesnt the river bet look very fishy? Most of the time someone bets the same amount on turn + river it seems to be a sign of weakness.

Lets suppose I want him to fold at the river. What should I raise? All-in? 3x his raise? Minraise? (Minraise doesnt seem to work there).

[/ QUOTE ]

If it's fishy and you think you have him beat why would you raise? Or do you think weakness here could apply to a weird two-pair.

If not what better hands do you think you can fold out here? Maybe an overpair to yours, but I am guessing he might re-raise those PF if he limped with them. Do you think that he will lay down two pair/set/straight? Maybe two pair, less likely a set and I doubt it against a straight. I don't think he'll give you credit for the flush. I think your fold equity is pretty low here. If he fold's you probably had him beat anyway.

[Atropos]

Yeah you are right my fold equity is indeed pretty low there. Raising to push out a better hand would have been a stupid idea.

Raising for value is not possible here because there are too many possibilities for me to be beat? I hate calling down with overpairs because when I win I seem like an ultra weak-tight player. Should I reraise the flop to get a better read on my opponent?

[Godfather80]

MP's preflop limp/call, then flop min-raise indicate set to me. I think that the turn call is marginal. I'd like to say I'd raise on the turn just to be sure of where I'm at, but his turn bet is really good-sized.

I can't think of a holding he has that you are beating at that point given the action leading up to and on the turn. I'd have to fold on the turn because there are too few hands (only JJ or 99 and even those seem like a stretch given the flop min-raise) that he could reasonably play that way that I can beat.

[Atropos]

OK thx thats quite what I wanted. After the showdown I thought "damn, I missed some value here" but in fact the hand seems to be so difficult that I actually made a good (or stupid, but lucky) call.

Results: MP shows [ Qc, Td ] a pair of tens.

[Godfather80]

Yikes. In that case congrats. Against some players, a min-raise really just is the minimum raise and not a one way ticket to broke.

[jhall23]

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah you are right my fold equity is indeed pretty low there. Raising to push out a better hand would have been a stupid idea.

Raising for value is not possible here because there are too many possibilities for me to be beat? I hate calling down with overpairs because when I win I seem like an ultra weak-tight player. Should I reraise the flop to get a better read on my opponent?

[/ QUOTE ]


Although it feels weak I don't think it's weak tight. I play pretty aggro in these games and would sometimes raise the flop here just to keep my image going, but with QQ most of the time I wouldn't. I'd personally rather re-raise on the flop as either a bluff when you wiff the board or with a monster like TT. In those situations if he calls then you are either done with your bluff or looking really good with top set.

With no big draws it is probably a good idea to play it as you did against an aggro. It comes down to your read of the villian. Re-raising on the flop probably folds worse hands and inflates the pot against better hands. If the guy is super aggro calling down is a great way to make money off him. Let him continue to bluff/bet weaker hands at you. You may get a read on players though that only do the min-raise with a set and ocassionaly you can lay down on the flop. In general you can't be doing this all the time especially in the 6max games or people will start min-raising you all the time on the flop. Also remember to ocassionally check behind on the flop even with overpairs to mix it up. That way your continuation bets when you miss will get more respect and you can let people try and bluff you on the turn.

[Mordok]

err didn't see the results in parenthesis. glad you won /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[jhall23]

[ QUOTE ]
OK thx thats quite what I wanted. After the showdown I thought "damn, I missed some value here" but in fact the hand seems to be so difficult that I actually made a good (or stupid, but lucky) call.

Results: MP shows [ Qc, Td ] a pair of tens.

[/ QUOTE ]

So it looks like you did this against the right type of player. NH /images/graemlins/grin.gif

If you end up losing to a set just take notes on the player for the future and pay attention to see if that is a common theme.