Heisman Trophy winner?

[pudley4]

[Clarkmeister]

My voting order if I had a ballot:

1. Larry Johnson
2. Carson Palmer
3. Brad Banks

I think these 3 are way stronger candidates than the others.

[IrishHand]

The Heisman voting is probably the most flawed voting of any of the major individual sports awards, although it probably has to be. How many voters do you think actually saw each of the candidates play even once? Not very many - and when you factor in that it realistically takes 3+ games of viewing to get a good feel for a player, you get a sense of the level of ignorance that basically every voter is drawing from. Really, the Heisman award is as much a testament to name awareness (eg. hype and SportsCenter coverage) and gaudy stats (how else are the voters supposed to compare when you know they haven't seen the guys play?) as it is to any notion of selecting "the best college footbal player in the country."

Of course, I have no solution to this - when you have 100+ teams with only 12-15 games each, a ton of deserving guys are going to get lost in the shuffle. It's not like the NFL where you have 30 teams and 16 games and even casual fans have probably seen each of the MVP candidates play.

Irish

[Josh W]

To me, Brad Banks is the 'clear' choice. "Clear" is in quotes, because it would be silly to say that anybody is worlds ahead of anybody else in this race.

That said, I also need to confess ignorance, inasmuch as I've seen very very very very little of Larry Johnson.

But the thing is for me, Banks is DEFINITELY better than Palmer. Look at their TD/INT numbers and their passing efficiency. Palmer was very pedestrian early in the season, and exceptional late in the year. I think it will help him that he has finished with such a bang.

And, I'm not using this as an argument, but who was the last QB to win the Heisman on a two loss (bowls excluded) team? I really don't know the answer, but I think it's been quite a while.

So, for me, my ballot would be:

1.) Brad Banks
2.) Byron Leftwich
3.) Carson Palmer

with the aforementioned disclaimer that I cannot consider gramama since I haven't seen him play at all.

Josh

[Clarkmeister]

I put Palmer ahead of Banks because he played against a significantly tougher schedule. As long as your team is in a bowl I don't care how many losses they have. Its not an MVP, its a straightforward "best player in CFB" award.

All Johnson did was rush for over 2,000 yards and set the NCAA rush/carry average at 8.1 while not even having to play the second half of many games. I'm sorry but 8.1 yards a carry is too much for me to overlook. That isn't merely great, its insane.

Leftwich's numbers aren't good enough to overcome the conference he plays in. In the game against VaTech he was simply awful until the second half and by then they were down 28 points.

That said, I wouldn't have a problem with any of Banks, Palmer or Johnson winning it. Anyone else and I think it would be a mistake.

[Josh W]

If the numbers that you stated about Johnson are accurate (and I believe that they probably are), then I too would likely put in a vote for Johnson. Like I said before, I know nothing about him, so if I were to put all other candidates in some order, then try to put him in there somewhere, it would have all of the accuracy of my throwing a feather into the wind.

Palmer definitely played a much tougher schedule, but he also did so with a far superior supporting cast. To me, these factors about cancel each other out, hence my pick for Banks. His numbers are just too much better, and he's 2-dimensional.

Regarding Byron Leftwich...I'm perhaps overswayed by the awesome play where his O-lineman carried him down the field between snaps...that kind of value is awesome. One thing I don't like is people discounting his accomplishments because of his conference...yeah, he's just playing at Marshall, so he has an easier schedule. But this also means that he has worse receivers, worse offensive linemen, worse rushing attack to balance the offense, etc...

Lastly, like I said, I don't use the fact that USC has two losses as a detractor from Palmer....I'm merely curious as to when the last time a QB with two losses won the award. I'd be the first to admit that Palmer is a very very very very legit candidate, and very worthy....it just rarely happens that such a candidate is a QB on a two-loss team.

But I'd still vote for Banks /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

Josh

[Ryan_21]

Ah darnit, I was going to do this about a week ago, but have been procrastinating b/c I've never made a poll and didnt want to try to figure it out. Anyway, Im glad somebody did it and I hope more people vote.

Ryan_21

[Ryan_21]

I think its funny that you guys argue so much about Banks, Johnson, and Palmer, but the bottom line is, as much as I hate it, I can almost guarantee Dorsey will win it. Even though he's not the best player on his team, he is the Senior leader of the undefeated national champs with a 34 game winning streak, and his overall record is 38-1. And as much as I'd like the award to be given to the "best" player in college football, you guys both know that its not always that way. As much as I hate Miami, I'd be uterlly shocked if Dorsey didnt win it.

Ryan_21

[Josh W]

I think I agree with you. I mean, I think he's gonna win, and I certainly don't think he's most deserving....If he wins, it's going to be on the strength of his performance over multiple years, not just this year.

I just hope I'm wrong.

[Mash]

Jason Gesser is. I don't know why he isn't getting more consideration. Gesser beat Palmer when they played this year. Don't get better future NFL career mixed up with who is a better college QB this year.

[Josh W]

I grew up in WA, and I like Gesser worlds more than Palmer...He's done more with less...a less talented WR corps, a worse running game, a worse O-line, and a worse D, so he's had fewer opportunities.

But I have to disagree with you for a couple of reasons. I think that Palmer is more deserving....he's on a better team, had a much tougher schedule, and has better numbers across the board.

And, I further disagree about pro vs. college. I think Gesser will be better in the pro's...he's shown more heart and leadership to me than Palmer has. If I was Cincy (and thus the #1 draft choice), I'd take Leftwich, Gesser/Banks, then Palmer.

Josh

[marbles]

Antwaan Randle El was the best college player in the country last year (and arguably the best in years), and was not even a finalist.

The Heisman is a joke.

[Mash]

I think that Palmer is more deserving....he's on a better team, had a much tougher schedule, and has better numbers across the board.

Huh? WSU beat USC, how can you say USC is a better team? Tougher schedule, maybe, although WSU did play Ohio St tough. Better numbers across the board, maybe, I'm too lazy to look them up. But if you're talking numbers look at Cody Pickett, he threw for a ton of yards. It's easy to have padded QB stats when your team is down by 24 every game.

I think that Gesser's knock for being a NFL QB is that he is too short. Not that I buy into that theory, but that is what the so-called expects have been saying. On the other hand the so-called expects thought Ryan Leaf would be a can't miss hall of famer!