I have overs... but I think I need to fold it to 1 BB on the river.

[Schizo]

Villian has 50% VPIP over 60 hands. Not sure aggression factor counts at this # of hands. Will post if needed.

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (8 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
<font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, CO calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, Hero checks.

Flop: (2.33 SB) 8/images/graemlins/club.gif, 2/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 5/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, CO calls.

Turn: (2.16 BB) 8/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, CO calls.

River: (4.16 BB) 2/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">CO raises</font>, Hero .....

Should I of even bet out?

[PokerBob]

Raise this pf. Call the river.

[Schizo]

[ QUOTE ]
Raise this pf. Call the river.

[/ QUOTE ]

Really? Why?

The flush is made and villian very likely has a boat. What is your reasoning?

[PokerBob]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Raise this pf. Call the river.

[/ QUOTE ]

Really? Why?

The flush is made and villian very likely has a boat. What is your reasoning?

[/ QUOTE ]

This could be a bluff. It could be an A. Do you see how this hand changes DRAMATICALLY if you raise it pf?

[Schizo]

Kind of. I would think most villians like this would put me on overs and not PP. They would still call down. OK, I see how an A weaker kicker would be much more likely to fold though.

[Schizo]

Is it best to check call here?

[PokerBob]

[ QUOTE ]
Is it best to check call here?

[/ QUOTE ]

I bet and call.

[Evan]

I agree with everything PokerBob has said so far.

[Schizo]

[ QUOTE ]
I agree with everything PokerBob has said so far.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok, well I guess I need to think about the whys for a while.

I totally understand the PF raise as it prevents a weaker ace from getting fancy. However it won't scare anything off that hit the flop. The river raise is 7.16:1 (minus .5 BB) which means we need to be good about 1/6.66 ~ 15% of the time. The odds of this being a weak ace high bluff should mean we can call.

However, if we raised PF then this would be a river fold?

[Klepton]

the reason you raise pf is because you have a hand that beats the CO probably 98% of the time

but i'm check/calling this river, giving him a chance to bluff at it

i don't want to get raised here, and i don't want to call a raise, therefore i'm check calling

[chesspain]

[ QUOTE ]
OK, I see how an A weaker kicker would be much more likely to fold though.

[/ QUOTE ]

You do realize on the river that kickers are irrelevant.

[Schizo]

[ QUOTE ]
You do realize on the river that kickers are irrelevant.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, that much is obvious but odds are if you raised PF you can get it to fold on the flop or the turn if villian didn't make a pair and put you on a better ace.

[roy_miami]

[ QUOTE ]
OK, I see how an A weaker kicker would be much more likely to fold though.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is a good reason for not raising preflop.

[Schizo]

This is very true. Thankyou for the correction.