30-60 hand against Puggy Pearson

[J_V]

This hand was one of the last in the worst live session I have ever had. I have thought it over for a while and don't like the way I played it.

Puggy had just sat down, I didn't know he was puggy, but I deduced it from his southern drawl and non stop chatter. There was also some doyle brunson talk. So asked who he was, and puggy told me he was some "Johnny come Lately" and I told him that there are a lot of those running around here (Vegas). He showed me some cool paper where some big shot casino guy was going to sell him a cardroom in 1981 for a 1000 bucks. Don't know why he showed it to me, nor did I really understand the transaction but it was interesting anyway.
Dont have a real read on his play, other than he's not a total fish, and I don't think he a big shark either.

4 limpers, puggy raises in the cutoff, I three bet with black K's in the sb.

Everyone calls, puggy four bets saying "he's getting good odds on his money" I five bet, realizing there is a damn good chance puggy has AA. six players come for five bets.

Flop comes 8-2-2 two spades. I bet, all call, puggy raises. I huddle, and puggy tells me "don't let them suck out on us" which makes my mind up. I call. All call. Turn is a 9s. One player and myself check call puggy's bet. The river is a spade. I bet.

Comments? Results to follow.

[mikelow]

Unbelievable you played it this badly-- I think Puggy had the black aces.

He was luring you in--you should have quit before he sat down. I didn't know he was still alive.

Was this at the Bellagio?

[gaylord focker]

I think I would have played the hand the same as you. I dont see any point of reraising the turn, becuase there is no need to force any marginal hands out. Any one with two spades will likley call anyway, you cant fold an 8, and the ace is the only overcard that is likely to beat you. I like your value bet on the river, you cant be afraid of the ace.

[gaylord focker]

http://www.pokerpages.com/articles/pokergreats/puggy-pearson01.htm


very interesting article

[J_V]

I don't know, but if you asked the people who would, I doubt puggy would rank highly as a limit player. Certainly he's played long enough and with enough good players to not be an easy mark though.

I believe the only mistake I made was my river bet.

[J_V]

The river bet is bad. It really looks like AA, which would make it 50/50 on whether or not he has the As, plus the other player on the river could have this hand. I was going to pay a raise, so Im laying 2-1 on even money. The five bet can hardly be questioned, IMO. I actually didn't realize how high of a regard is held in by some. I think I was turned off by how hard he tried to let others know he was a "somebody" in the poker world. Friendly guy though.

[Boris]

I would've strongly considered check-raising on the turn. I would not have bet the river.

[skp]

Well, the presence of the third chap makes the river bet a bit more dicey but if you were headsup with Puggy, I think you have a clear bet on the river. It's 50/50 that he has you beat even if you were to assume that he has AA. Now, a certain percentage of the time, he is going to show you QQ so, I think you ought to bet.

But the third guy could have the As (although that would mean he had to play an offsuit ace without a raise preflop eg. AsJd - he may or may not play worse offsuit hands). Had you three bet the flop and he still called, then his chances of having the As go down i.e. he is likely hanging on to an 8 or a pocket pair if he coldcalls two more on the flop.

I don't mind your river play at all.

[mike l.]

"I dont see any point of reraising the turn"

you mean the flop.

"Any one with two spades will likley call anyway"

change likely to deinitely.

"you cant fold an 8"

you dont want to as they are drawing to 2 outs since the flop is paired. so that's not worth mentioning.

"and the ace is the only overcard that is likely to beat you."

it's the only overcard at all and it definitely beats you.

"I like your value bet on the river, you cant be afraid of the ace."

it's a very likely card for one of the two remaining players to hold so fearing it is reasonable.

[Boris]

How much did you lose? My personal best at 30-60 is torching $3,300 in about 2.5 hours. I had more money in my pocket but was too disgusted to keep playing.

[J_V]

i played 28 hours and lost close to 4K. I was going to play till I got dealt aces, but I couldn't see straight by the end. I had my heart set on going a week if I had to.

aaargh talk about pain, i just timed out with AA online. At least I didn't have to wait 30 hours. Reminds me why I like clicking buttons.

[J_V]

my roommate was at the table, and we both felt like QQ was far less likely than AA after discussing it later. Just something about the timing, my image, his image and the jabber he was going through. You had to be there........:)

[jen]

I wish someone had posted those numbers right after my worst session in 15-30 -- $1800 in nine hours...

[J_V]

Here's some more ego fodder.....I lost 3300 at 15-30 (albeit three shorthanded games) in 3 hours. I lost 6K in one day online.

[mikelow]

Is there some compulsion to lose here? Have you really evaluated your game after each number?

One reason shorthanded games are dangerous.

[J_V]

he had AA with As, like any world champion would /forums/images/icons/smile.gif.

[glen]

I think that's one of the cons relating to online play. Compared to playing live, when you're running bad, you can lose FAST(er). I've lost 60 BB's in an hour and a half, because when you're playing 3 or 4 handed without shuffling, that equates to several hours of live play. When one is used to playing live, though, the amount of money lost may make one more susceptible to tilt, and, or, not play their "A" game. I think it works the other way as well. If you sit in a 10-20 game, and you're up 50 BB in an hour, it might make a very disciplined player make some bad plays. I know online players get used to this, but if you're accustomed to playing live then it's a new challenge.

[gaylord focker]

I meant a deuce, not an 8. Also I do think betting the river is reasonable even if he is reasonable sure Puggy has aces. Suppose he figures there is a 90 percent chance he holds aces and a 10 percent chance he holds Queens. So even if he does hold Aces, there is only a 50 percent chance that he holds the Ace of Spades. So it is still worth betting out on the river if there is any chance he doesnt have pocket aces.

[glen]

. . . if there's a 45% chance Puggy the ace of spades, another person in the hand who called the turn, and the fact that if either of them have it they are going to raise, why would you bet?

[jen]

Those are some pretty hefty numbers for 15-30... I hope you don't break those records anytime soon! /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

[angry young man]

i just timed out with AA online. At least I didn't have to wait 30 hours. Reminds me why I like clicking buttons.

well, that and the hack.

[budman]

If it makes you feel any better, last weekend I lost $380 in the first five minutes at my 20-40 game.

What makes this remarkable is the way I lost it. I looked very slyly at my cards, one at a time, sliding them back and forth and peeking at them. Two black aces! Capped before the flop, I made a set on the flop. Flop was three bet.


Anyway, to make a bad story short, I never looked back at my cards until I was about to show the winner. I picked them up and realized I had looked at the same card twice.

Nice start.

[riffraff]

Anyway, to make a bad story short, I never looked back at my cards until I was about to show the winner. I picked them up and realized I had looked at the same card twice.


That made me laugh /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

[EZ$$$]

"aaargh talk about pain, i just timed out with AA online. At least I didn't have to wait 30 hours."

I had AA twice in half hour,lost both against A6 and AK flop came 66X and KXX turned K...would you like to have my AA?

[riffraff]

I had AA twice in half hour,lost both against A6 and AK flop came 66X and KXX turned K...would you like to have my AA?

I can top that. This happened about an hour ago. EP raises, EP+1 cold-calls, I 3-bet with AA in BB. Both EP's call. Flop comes 662 rainbow. I bet, EP folds, EP+1 calls. Turn is a Ten. I bet, EP+1 calls. River is a Ten. I bet, EP+1 raises, I call. He turns over TJo. Nice 168-1 shot sir.