Am I ready for the jump? 35k stat check up.

[jess72]

Does anything look way out of line? I want to move to 1/2 for good but not sure if I'm ready yet.



http://img216.echo.cx/img216/7171/stats45ny.jpg (http://www.imageshack.us)




Does my aggression factor suck for this level? Or will it change as I move up?




http://img227.echo.cx/img227/9371/stats51na.jpg (http://www.imageshack.us)



Sorry if this post looks stupid. I dont know how to trim the images.

Thanks for any comments
J72

[Hojglad]

Haha you are so past ready that it isn't even funny. Good luck at 1/2.

[kenberman]

it's hard for me to intelligently comment on stat posts, but I would take a shot. why not?

[wyoak]

i can't believe you played 35K hands at .5/1

[MrEngenic]

Move up asap. If you stay at 0.5/1 you will get used to how the game is down there and it's a whole different game compared to higher limits.

[deception5]

I think it's safe to say you are beating .50/1.00...

[Messy Harry]

Does anybody think the VPIP is too high? Will this VPIP be a problem at a higher level?

[itsmesteve]

The VPIP MAY be a probalem at a higher level, perhaps, but not 1/2. As long as you play solidly postflop, preflop mistakes tend to be minor, and not playing enough hands can be a bigger mistake. My VPIP is over 22 at 10K hands of 1/2, and I'm certainly not suffering from playing the extra hands.

[GrunchCan]

[ QUOTE ]
Does anybody think the VPIP is too high? Will this VPIP be a problem at a higher level?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, and yes. Also, you (OP)don't PFR enough, and you're too passive postflop.

Go ahead and move up if you think you're ready too. Just be prepared to adjust your game.

[spacemonkey57]

[ QUOTE ]
Does anybody think the VPIP is too high? Will this VPIP be a problem at a higher level?

[/ QUOTE ]

It could probably stand to come down a little. I'd recommend getting rid of QJo and JTo everywhere but the button. It looks like you were ready 20K hands ago. Good Luck!

[k000k]

[ QUOTE ]
i can't believe you played 35K hands at .5/1

[/ QUOTE ]

What's wrong with that? I have about 180k hands of .5/1! Just cuz you have the funds doesnt mean you should automatically move up..

OP: You're loose, you wont get away with limping in with suited aces, etc. in 1/2. Your PFR is decent, just lose some of those limping hands, especially in early positions. Be more aggro too, add about 1 to your AF and you'll be in good shape.

[Messy Harry]

[ QUOTE ]
I have about 180k hands of .5/1!

[/ QUOTE ]

Seriously?

[Chris Daddy Cool]

for those who say he's too loose prelfop, it wouldn't surprise me at all if 23 is close to ideal (i don't have a significant sample size at .50/1.00) and it wouldn't suprise me if he could get away with EVEN more than 23.

my main gripe is for such a high vpip, your pfr looks low and your aggression is low too. but clearly you can move up and readjust your game there. the problem with playing at one level too long (and crushing it) is that you can get lulled into a sense of compatency and have bad habits stick with you for too long simply because "it worked" at the level you've played at for so long.

[davelin]

You're a tad loose-passive.

[UATrewqaz]

Wow, those are good stats, especially considering your low aggression factor. I'm slightly more tight and slightly more aggressive and have much lower in terms of BB/100.

I'm guessing your postflop play is very good and your reads are also really good. I say move up.

[kapw7]

[ QUOTE ]
You're a tad loose-passive.

[/ QUOTE ]
Would it really be more optimal to have a very high AF and a low VPIP in loose-passive 0.5/1 games?
When you have the odds to limp with a less premium hand PF combined with the fact that your opponents play very bad post flop.
When you have the odds to call more post-flop.
When raising to protect your hand is ineffective. (It does work better on the turn though)
When you have no idea if you are beaten on the river with your TPTK by the calling station with pairs of 7 and 3.

[kapw7]

I doubt if a lot of ppl can make more money over the same number of hands playing 1/2 party full ring.

[Nomad84]

[ QUOTE ]
Does anybody think the VPIP is too high? Will this VPIP be a problem at a higher level?

[/ QUOTE ]

My VPIP at .5/1 was almost as high. It has dropped at 1/2 due to the games being tighter, in general. There is also more preflop raising at 1/2 in my (limited) experience. Some hands that I might play at .5/1 are no longer profitable. I end up folding hands like suited aces and suited connectors in places where they might be worth limping at .5/1. Also fewer hands go to showdown. Agression can buy a lot of pots off of some of the weak-tight guys. Hopefully your aggression will go up a bit, but I think that tightening up preflop will result in more agressive postflop play and less calling down. Looks to me like you're more than ready to move up.

BTW, I am working to reduce my VPIP and the OP probably should too. I just wanted to point out that it will drop some on its own.

[Arnfinn Madsen]

See you at 1/2. Hope I don't run into you /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[bottomset]

[ QUOTE ]
for those who say he's too loose prelfop, it wouldn't surprise me at all if 23 is close to ideal (i don't have a significant sample size at .50/1.00) and it wouldn't suprise me if he could get away with EVEN more than 23.

my main gripe is for such a high vpip, your pfr looks low and your aggression is low too. but clearly you can move up and readjust your game there. the problem with playing at one level too long (and crushing it) is that you can get lulled into a sense of compatency and have bad habits stick with you for too long simply because "it worked" at the level you've played at for so long.

[/ QUOTE ]

i agree he isn't necessarily too loose, its just its loose for his aggression level

[Isura]

[ QUOTE ]
i can't believe you played 35K hands at .5/1

[/ QUOTE ]

[bottomset]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
i can't believe you played 35K hands at .5/1

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

Entity has played at least 32k

[jess72]

Wow, thanks for all the comments!

My vpip was higher and I have worked hard to lower it just a point. I need to work on post flop skills and agression. I hope 1/2 or 2/4 will force the issues.

One thing that has held me at this limit so long is multitabling to clear bonuses at a level I'm comfortable playing.

Time to throw the baby bottle away! I'm going to break out the sippy cup!!!!

Thanks again
J72

[Greg J]

vpip: Pretty good. Just over optimal IMO. Not too high to be a leak IMO. I think the optimal vpip is probably ~21-22 for .5/1. 24 is not ridiculous.

pfr: Should be higher. I could go for 10-12 range. Not a huge leak, but as you move up yr pfr should approach yr vpip (the gap should lessen).

Aggression factor postflop: I think this is where you need to work on yr game. More betting and raising and reraising. Don't go nuts though -- do it selectively. Don't spew. Be smart.

[davelin]

[ QUOTE ]
I doubt if a lot of ppl can make more money over the same number of hands playing 1/2 party full ring.

[/ QUOTE ]

There are plenty of people with at least 2BB/100 in 1/2 full ring over this many hands.

[davelin]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
You're a tad loose-passive.

[/ QUOTE ]
Would it really be more optimal to have a very high AF and a low VPIP in loose-passive 0.5/1 games?
When you have the odds to limp with a less premium hand PF combined with the fact that your opponents play very bad post flop.
When you have the odds to call more post-flop.
When raising to protect your hand is ineffective. (It does work better on the turn though)
When you have no idea if you are beaten on the river with your TPTK by the calling station with pairs of 7 and 3.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your statement doesn't make a ton of sense to me.

[GrunchCan]

[ QUOTE ]
for those who say he's too loose prelfop, it wouldn't surprise me at all if 23 is close to ideal (i don't have a significant sample size at .50/1.00) and it wouldn't suprise me if he could get away with EVEN more than 23.

my main gripe is for such a high vpip, your pfr looks low and your aggression is low too. but clearly you can move up and readjust your game there. the problem with playing at one level too long (and crushing it) is that you can get lulled into a sense of compatency and have bad habits stick with you for too long simply because "it worked" at the level you've played at for so long.

[/ QUOTE ]

In theory, I agree. But in practice a very good postflop game is needed in order to play so many hands up front. The OP's PF and postflop aggression factors indicate to me that thier postflop game probably still needs work. In this case, I'd still recommend tightening up a good bit while studying postflop play.

Sorry, but that's my opinion.

[kapw7]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
You're a tad loose-passive.

[/ QUOTE ]
Would it really be more optimal to have a very high AF and a low VPIP in loose-passive 0.5/1 games?
When you have the odds to limp with a less premium hand PF combined with the fact that your opponents play very bad post flop.
When you have the odds to call more post-flop.
When raising to protect your hand is ineffective. (It does work better on the turn though)
When you have no idea if you are beaten on the river with your TPTK by the calling station with pairs of 7 and 3.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your statement doesn't make a ton of sense to me.

[/ QUOTE ]

Read it again.
I'm questioning a low VPIP - high AF approach in loose passive 0.5/1 games.

[kapw7]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I doubt if a lot of ppl can make more money over the same number of hands playing 1/2 party full ring.

[/ QUOTE ]

There are plenty of people with at least 2BB/100 in 1/2 full ring over this many hands.

[/ QUOTE ]

I have only 1000 hands in 1/2 full so I cannot insist on my statement. But I found the games extremely tight and thus it would be hard for most of the ppl to sustain a >2 BB/100 win rate.

[k000k]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I have about 180k hands of .5/1!

[/ QUOTE ]

Seriously?

[/ QUOTE ]

They go fast if you play enough tables, 700hands/hr gets you to 180k pretty fast. 12-tabling .5/1 makes me $28/hr, and if I'm clearing bonuses, that can be $80-$100/hr easy. I can't achieve that at any other limit, so that's where I play mostly.

[handsome]

[ QUOTE ]

They go fast if you play enough tables, 700hands/hr gets you to 180k pretty fast. 12-tabling .5/1 makes me $28/hr, and if I'm clearing bonuses, that can be $80-$100/hr easy. I can't achieve that at any other limit, so that's where I play mostly.

[/ QUOTE ]

Move up and become a better player.

[k000k]

[ QUOTE ]
Move up and become a better player.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ya I know, I know.. I always play higher limits on the cryptos, a little $1/2, mostly $2/4 and £1/2, and I'm beating em all there, but I just can't seem to get positive in party's 1/2 game.. I'm still down a few hundred bucks in something like 12k hands. It just pisses me off, makes me frustrated, win a little or lose a lot.. I can't remember the last time I was happy at the end of a $1/2 session on party. I destroy .5/1, it's easy to justify staying where I know I can make a few $'s.

[davelin]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
You're a tad loose-passive.

[/ QUOTE ]
Would it really be more optimal to have a very high AF and a low VPIP in loose-passive 0.5/1 games?
When you have the odds to limp with a less premium hand PF combined with the fact that your opponents play very bad post flop.
When you have the odds to call more post-flop.
When raising to protect your hand is ineffective. (It does work better on the turn though)
When you have no idea if you are beaten on the river with your TPTK by the calling station with pairs of 7 and 3.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your statement doesn't make a ton of sense to me.

[/ QUOTE ]

Read it again.
I'm questioning a low VPIP - high AF approach in loose passive 0.5/1 games.

[/ QUOTE ]

Okay I did and it still doesn't make sense to me -

1) I'm not advocating a super tight, super aggressive strategy, I just said he was a TAD (i.e. slightly) loose passive.

2) The OP's VPIP is about 24% but his PFR% is about 9% which means he's limping or cold-calling 15% of his hands. This is probably higher than almost everyone who's played in micros for a significant amount of time. If his stats were more like 24/12 then I could live with it more because that means he's isolating, open-raising and blind-stealing more. Pre-flop raising is generally good in the right circumstances because it gives you position and initiative. OP's blind-stealing stats indicate this to me as well.

3) I don't think many would say than an Agression Factor less than 2 could use a little improvement to just right above 2. Again, I'm not saying bump it to 3 or 4, it's just been shown time and time again that Passives usually make much less than Aggressives.

4) What does "When raising to protect your hand is ineffective" mean? When you raise your good hands/draws it's value if they call and protection when they fold, good both ways. If every micro-opponent out there called you on every single hand to the river, you would net out to be a big winner long-term.

5) "When you have no idea if you are beaten on the river with your TPTK by the calling station with pairs of 7 and 3." Huh? Calling stations looking to hit their 4-5 outers against you will pay you off in the long term. Bad opponents = $$$.

[nsdjoe]

[ QUOTE ]
i can't believe you played 35K hands at .5/1

[/ QUOTE ]

How long were you at .5/1? Anyone know what a good rule of thumb is as far as #hands before moving up? Or is it completely on a case-by-case basis of when youre ready?

[droolie]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

They go fast if you play enough tables, 700hands/hr gets you to 180k pretty fast. 12-tabling .5/1 makes me $28/hr, and if I'm clearing bonuses, that can be $80-$100/hr easy. I can't achieve that at any other limit, so that's where I play mostly.

[/ QUOTE ]

Become a better player.

[/ QUOTE ]

FYP. The limit you play does not define your skill level.

Moving up is not the only way to become a better player. While it certainly helps to consistently play against tougher competition the limit amounts are arbitrary. Some .50/1 games play like higher limits (early on at a 2+2 table before everyone gets drunk, for instance) and some 3/6 games play like the fishiest of .50/1 games. Sure the average .50/1 game is way fishier than the average 3/6 game but to assume you can only get the type of competiton you'll see at 3/6 at 3/6 is incorrect.

I've been playing poker online for almost a year and continue to learn new aspects of the game every day. I still have a lot more to learn and am quite sure I will continue to learn regardless of what limit I happen to be playing.

I've played over 50K at .50/1. Why? It's fun and I end almost every session way ahead. Reliably making $30 and hour while having fun and almost zero risk is not a bad thing.

Many of us have very different motivations for playing poker. Personally I am very risk averse and do not enjoy winning more money if it feels like a grind. I have played higher limits and been successful but I always come back to .50/1 because there is no stress. I have enough stress in my regular job that when I come home and play at night the last thing I need is more stress. The actual gaming experience of winning 5+BB/100 and winning 2+BB/100 is vastly different. Though I have won more money per hour playing some 2/4 and 3/6 stretches the experience was not as enjoyable for me as a typical night of playing .50/1 clearing bonuses.

If winning the maximum amount of money is your only motivation, regardless of the emtotional toll, then by all means move up every time you have the roll but don't assume that's why we're all playing poker. I'm quite confident I'm a better poker player fundamentaly than many of the players who do quite well at higher limits but the circumstances of my life suit making lower amounts of easy money playing micro limits better. Perhaps you could argue I am leaving $$ on the table by being a pussy or whatever but poker has been fun for me almost every night I've played. Not many people, even the most successful of players, can say that. I'm reasonably sure I will begin playing exclusively at higher limits in the not too distant future but I feel very comfortably defending anybody who decides that .50/1 is the game for them. It's fun. Fun is +EV.