Winning low limit players

In the internet forum someone recently asked which low-limit players on Paradise are good. This led me to start thinking about what makes a good low-limit player. From my relatively short time, the key ingredient seems to be hand selection. What would you folks say are the key skills for winning at the lower limits?

In hold'em it will be the same skills as at higher limits, although you will have to use certain skills more at low limits than in higher limit games. And you will need less of those skills. :-) This may be a bad way of saying I don't think it's a good idea to categorize skills by the limit you play. I want to move up and play higher. I need more skill, experience, and bankroll. So I have tried to learn some things while taking some shots at bigger games. I find I now play better at the lower limits. Which skills did I improve, my mid-limit skills or my low limit skills? Of course, I just improved some because I increased my knowledge and experience.


One danger of only learning the skills to beat a particular limit is that you might only learn how to beat one particular game, i.e. a very loose hold'em game that isn't too aggressive. You will win at that kind of game whatever the limit, but you will need perfect game selection to win. Or take rocks, they have a narrow skill range that lets them win miniscule amounts. Read Feeneys chapter on why to learn to beat tougher games in his book.

"you will have to use certain skills more at low limits than in higher limit games" - which ones are those HDPM?


Thanks for your thoughts

Jess:


There's no question that hand selection is very important and you won't be able to win without it. But to be successful at hold 'em you also need to play well from the flop on. So you need to concentrate on playing well in both areas. By the way, playing well from the flop on is much more difficult than playing well on the first two cards.

Jessica,


Here is a list of skills I think are important to winning low limit hold 'em. They are not in order:


1. Good hand selection. Low Limit Hold ‘Em (LLHE) is showdown poker--you very often have to have the best hand at the end to win the pot. Good players think of your hole cards as building blocks for a showdown hand. They know that those who play cards that will build better hands win more.


2. Knowing your players. Most LLHE players can be categorized relatively easily. Know who will not raise without the nuts, who chases too much, who always slowplays, who raises their draws often, who always thinks someone always has the best possible hand, who calls all the way with a bad hand, etc.. Since you will often being faced with callers when you bet and raise it is helpful to know what types of hands certain players will call with so knowing your players is key.


3. Knowing when to fold. Good LLHE players internalize the fact that their are no good hands, only good situations. Since most LL games are loose, it is not improbable that a good pre-flop hand will be run down. You must not get married to your hand, no matter how good it may seem. Bad LLHE players routinely play their premium starting hands to the river despite mountains of evidence that they are beat. Good players are better at accepting that someone with a worse pre-flop hand has overtaken them post-flop and moving on. Lastly, when you are raised, think about what you can beat--very often that list is not very long but people call anyway, refusing to admit that they are beaten.


4. Using position to play draws correctly. There is much discussion in the poker literature (and here) about playing for the free card. It is my opinion that this tool is more powerful in LLHE than in higher limits. This stems in part from the fact that most LL players fear aggression and will "check to the raiser" a very high percentage of the time. Therefore this tool works often and rarely faces defensive re-raises. In addition, because there is little bluffing in LLHE, the fact that taking a free card can announce your hand is not as relevant. You probably can't win unless your draw hits, so the fact that everyone knows you are drawing is not as consequential. The second part of playing your draws correctly is knowing when to raise them for value.


5. Correct blind play. This may seem like a minor point but I think a lot of LLHE players are enticed to play too many hands out of the blinds because "hey the pot is big, I am in already in for 1/2 a bet (or a full one when someone has raised and you are BB), so why not"? Why not is that your position stinks and it may cost you dearly to find out your mediocre hand is not good enough, even when you flop something. This very often occurs when people play one big-card/one small card hands such as K9, A6, Q8, etc. out of blinds and flop a pair. Good players play tighter in the blinds than bad players.


6. Knowing when to chase. Many LLHE players see hands at a showdown and think that someone sucked out on them when mathematically their opponent played correctly. In a loose game hands like gutshot straights, second pair/high kicker, combination draws. etc. are playable. Good LL players recognize these situations, know the odds and play accordingly. They are also proficient at recognizing how "live" their draws are, not mistakenly drawing to bad flushes, ignorant straights, or two pair that gives someone a better hand, etc..


7. Knowing when to show aggression early v. later in a hand. Good LL players get the best out of their good hands by using their bets to maximize profit and they play aggressively when their hands are vulnerable and want a smaller field. This DOES NOT mean you should routinely slowplay. Know your players--it is often correct to play your monster hands aggressively from the start. Bad players routinely slow play too much and confuse monster hands with vulnerable hands (ie. JJ and a board of 863 rainbow). Good players recognize when they must try to eliminate the field and it is not prudent to slowplay. They also realize when they will get callers despite having a nut hand and bet accordingly.


8. Avoiding tilt. LLHE is a frustrating game. Good players know that their tight-aggressive play will not always be rewarded. They prepare themselves mentally for a rollercoaster ride of loose calls, miracle draws, runner-runner suckouts, etc.. They know that in the long run they benefit from their opponents mistakes and thrive for optimal play despite any setbacks they face in a particular session. They take breaks as needed, avoid talking about poker at the table, never belittle a poor player, etc.. Therefore, their game is stronger because they continue to make the correct moves, not letting tilt turn them into a poor player.


9. Avoiding “Fancy Play Syndrome”. One thing that separates the upper levels of good LLHE players is knowing when to make a move for profit’s sake v. fun’s sake. Many LLHE players aspire to be better players, have read the important books and know about some of the advanced concepts and moves. But, they apply these moves indiscriminantly thus costing themselves some extra bets. LLHE is a very straightforward game and should be played as such. All betting strategies have their place. The best LLHE players realize this and only try to manipulate their opponents when it is logical to do so.


I’m sure there are some more but I think these are most important. Hope this helps. Feel free to ask any questions or request examples from any of the above.


KJS

How to play top pair in a 10-way pot. :-) I should have worded my answer a bit differently. I did say that you need more skill in higher limits than in lower limits. You need all your skills more in higher limits of course. However, you will have to make certain adjustments in LL if the game plays more "irrationally." The specific adjustments will come from your overall skill. So I think my choice of words was poor and a bit misleading. You will face certain situations in LL more than in higher limits, and will have to adjust. But the skills that you use to make that adjustment are the same.

Losing happens all the time. You have to take what they give you and realize that if you are down you are either chasing or getting stuck with lot's of those "almost" hands.


It only takes 2 or 3 good wins to make up a lot of money.


oops - not talking to you Mason.

nicely said.

[rousing applause]

bravo.


-alex

1 thing i notice on low limit table is when people limp in and there's a raise behind them and they get that pinch-faced look. just think as yer limpin whether youd mind if there was a raise behind you. if the answer is that you would mind, maybe you shouldnt be limpin in. then its a raise/fold situation, leaning towards folding. think ahead. it will save lots.


b

Jessica,


Patience is a key in low-limit games. It takes a lot to put in disciplined hours for such small returns.