KK Pre-flop against uber fish.

[trumpman84]

Live game so I have decent reads on people. The person in question in this pot..it was my first time playing with him but he limped in for 90% of the pots played (with as bad as 94o UTG) and never raised once out of about 50-75 hands we had played so far.

So he is UTG and makes a large raise ...about 5 times the size of the BB...very out of character from him from what I'd seen. I'm in the seat next to him, and already I'm suspicious before I look down and see KK. I seriously thought I might already be behind and was thinking of smooth calling, but decided I couldnt do that as if I did have the best hand I'd be letting everyone behind me in cheaply, so I raise 8 more.

It folds around to uber fish who almost immediately pops it up for 15 more. I have 45 more behind..30 if I called the 15 and he has me covered. I honestly could not think of a single hand he would do this with other than AA being that he was so loose passive and I hadn't seen him do much betting or raising after the flop and none before the flop, so I folded.

I've always told myself that I would never fold KK preflop ever, but I certainly think that this was one of the very few exceptions. Was the play right?

[mythrilfox]

I have seen this same play made by similar players in the past with TT and worse. They could have been getting crap all night and this is the first decent hand they have. This player sounds too erratic - I think you should have pushed it in.

[NYCNative]

Unless you know that he has Aces, you have to push. All the signs were Aces, admittedly, but who knows? Maybe he had the other two Kings...

If I ever lay down Kings, I'm showing it. I don't think that's a good move, but screw it, I would have to...

[trumpman84]

Oh..I did show...and stun the table when the guy turned over his aces.....no way he makes this play with TT or JJ..and I think he even smooth call my reraise with QQ. So that leaves KK and AA. Anyway, I'm glad he showed, otherwise I would've been second guessing all night.

[Marcotte]

I think you give the fish action. You should be in good shape to get the money back from him if he does have aces. I disagree with showing your lay down also. It doesn't help your table image IMO (I'm assuming the rest of the table is pretty fishy as well.)

[PinkSteel]

Man, that has got to feel about as close to scoring a hole in one as you can get.

I look forward to the day when I lay down Kings in a LIVE game, show them, and then have the raiser make me the smartest guy on the planet by showing the crowd his Aces.

And you can BET I'll be posting the story.... /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Publos Nemesis]

[ QUOTE ]
I look forward to the day when I lay down Kings in a LIVE game, show them, and then have the raiser make me the smartest guy on the planet by showing the crowd his Aces.

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you kidding? If this table is as fishy as it seems, then your raise was absolutely correct. The fishes reraise (a minraise right?) definitely suggest aces. Don't even look at the fish and throw your kings into the muck. Don't EVER show your hand unless you want to show your opponents how to destory you. Because then they will reraise you all night long and keep you guessing.

[trumpman84]

I disagree. I want people to reraise me with KK. haha. I want them to re-raise me with lesser hands. I don't see how this can be unprofitable if they are opening up and giving me action to try to steal pots from me based on the assumption that im weak tight because I'm anything but. This was a very specific situation with a very specific read. I really don't mind showing down my big lay downs for this reason.

Plus, like when you show down utter rags on a stone cold bluff to say to the table "I know what you have and I can outplay you every hand, but you'll never know what I have", this is kind of like saying "I know what you have and you'll never trap me or ever get me to put my money in with a lesser hand" If you can make one of each of these kinds of showdowns in one one night, you'll have the table completely guessing as to what you're doing!

[crosse91]

so what do you do when you put a player on a hand and know he should call your reraise but he does.....and then shows down a horrible hand?? i HAVE to stop making moves on people who don't know what they mean

[TheWorstPlayer]

Good lay down. Terrible show. Sorry, man. Just terrible. Do you see why?