I've heard from a reliable source (rakeback related)

[Bigwig]

that Party is eventually going to do away with all rakeback on skins. I've also heard that there may be a few (or less) survivors. I don't know enough about this subject to draw any conclusions.

Will there eventually be no way to obtain rakeback?

[Nottom]

Unless they plan on eliminating their affiliate program as it is now, they really can't stop all rakeback deals.

If they do, that might finally open the door for other sites to finally close the gap. There are a lot of people who would leave party (or skins) if they didn't get any rakeback.

Like others have said, there are other sites with bad players as well.

On the other hand if they killed the affiliate program and used the extra money to reduce their rake ... but I don't see that happening

[Scuba Chuck]

OK, just for fun, who's your source?

Next, we both know that Party is going to IPO soon. What are the risks to eliminating rakeback? IMO, too many. That being said, I can see them eliminating Party skins, but there would still be rakeback via Party (like I have now).

So guess I'll have to wave bye bye to 8 tabling for rakeback. Or buy two computers /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[Bigwig]

[ QUOTE ]
OK, just for fun, who's your source?

Next, we both know that Party is going to IPO soon. What are the risks to eliminating rakeback? IMO, too many. That being said, I can see them eliminating Party skins, but there would still be rakeback via Party (like I have now).

So guess I'll have to wave bye bye to 8 tabling for rakeback. Or buy two computers /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

He's in the industry, but I'd rather not say.

[tech]

This has already been discussed extensively in the Internet forum. Not much we can do except enjoy it while it lasts.

[tech]

[ QUOTE ]
I can see them eliminating Party skins, but there would still be rakeback via Party (like I have now).


[/ QUOTE ]

According to multiple confirmed reports, Party has already stopped reporting stats on individual trackers.

[Scuba Chuck]

[ QUOTE ]
He's in the industry, but I'd rather not say.


[/ QUOTE ]

That's what always makes these discussions so interesting.

How about this, do you know who's underwriting them? I can go grab a red herring if it's available yet. I checked with the syndicate manager in my office, and he said there's nothing on the radar (He also didn't know what Party Poker was /images/graemlins/tongue.gif). Are they IPO'ing under another name?

[mcpherzen]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
He's in the industry, but I'd rather not say.


[/ QUOTE ]

That's what always makes these discussions so interesting.

How about this, do you know who's underwriting them? I can go grab a red herring if it's available yet. I checked with the syndicate manager in my office, and he said there's nothing on the radar (He also didn't know what Party Poker was /images/graemlins/tongue.gif). Are they IPO'ing under another name?

[/ QUOTE ]

Isn't Party a Canadian company? Which would mean they aren't going public on the NYSE or NASDAQ, right?

[Scuba Chuck]

[ QUOTE ]
According to multiple confirmed reports, Party has already stopped reporting stats on individual trackers.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't understand that terminology "individual trackers."

Also, and I'm sure this has been hashed out, but as long as other sites continue to provide rakeback, Party will lose millions of dollars by eliminating this deal. I'm sure this is hard to believe (not), but the players that pay most of the bills for PartyPoker (think Gigabet) probably have rakeback established. Why would they continue to play here if there is a better opportunity for TOTAL RETURN elsewhere. If a big part of the ocean moves from Party Poker to say the crypto sites, then why do I care where I play. Fish are fish.

If all the sites promptly stopped providing rakeback, this would smell of collusion.

In the end, if they just lowered their 10% rake to 7.5% rake, I'd be fine with that as well. But that just brings us back to the coupon argument/analogy. Why don't manufacturers just sell their products at the with coupon price? It's easy to see why. That logic applies here as well.

[pokerlaw]

"PartyGaming, the parent company of the dominant poker Website, PartyPoker.com, reportedly is considering an initial public offering in London that could value the four-year-old company at more than $5 billion. PartyPoker.com is estimated to control as much as 50% of the market."

This is a quote from the Feb 21st Issue of Barrons (Online Poker was cover story).

[Scuba Chuck]

[ QUOTE ]
This is a quote from the Feb 21st Issue of Barrons

[/ QUOTE ]

Any specifics on who might/will be doing the underwriting?

[pokerlaw]

No, they were pretty vague on the specifics. My buddy at one financial firm was trying to find specifics the other day, but he didnt get anything worth sharing...

[Voltron87]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
According to multiple confirmed reports, Party has already stopped reporting stats on individual trackers.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't understand that terminology "individual trackers."

Also, and I'm sure this has been hashed out, but as long as other sites continue to provide rakeback, Party will lose millions of dollars by eliminating this deal. I'm sure this is hard to believe (not), but the players that pay most of the bills for PartyPoker (think Gigabet) probably have rakeback established. Why would they continue to play here if there is a better opportunity for TOTAL RETURN elsewhere. If a big part of the ocean moves from Party Poker to say the crypto sites, then why do I care where I play. Fish are fish.

If all the sites promptly stopped providing rakeback, this would smell of collusion.

In the end, if they just lowered their 10% rake to 7.5% rake, I'd be fine with that as well. But that just brings us back to the coupon argument/analogy. Why don't manufacturers just sell their products at the with coupon price? It's easy to see why. That logic applies here as well.

[/ QUOTE ]

There would be nothing illegal about all the sites fixing rake prices high. That would give a 3rd party motive to come in and start another site with competitive rake.

I don't think anyone not from PP understands who pays what rake. I've enver seen any real analysis of this.

[tech]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't understand that terminology "individual trackers."


[/ QUOTE ]

When they report rakeback to an affiliate, if they do not report it on an individual level, then the affiliate has no simple way to determine how much rakeback to pay each individual. The only way at that point is to do it via PT or some other method, which obviously gets into a multitude of other issues.

For comments on the other issues, check out this thread (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Number=2256998&page=&view=&s b=5&o=) .

[wuwei]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't understand that terminology "individual trackers."

[/ QUOTE ]

Affiliates use an individual tracker for each customer - so they receive individual numbers of MGR for each person receiving rakeback. Party has stopped reporting on each tracker and instead just provides a lump sum dollar amount for each affiliate. In the future, Party affiliates will not have info on what each person paid in rake. They will have to use other methods to ascertain how much they should be paying in rakeback.


[ QUOTE ]
Why don't manufacturers just sell their products at the with coupon price? It's easy to see why. That logic applies here as well.

[/ QUOTE ]

Because their profits would decrease?

[Newt_Buggs]

Has this just happened on Party, or on the skins as well?

[wuwei]

[ QUOTE ]
Has this just happened on Party, or on the skins as well?

[/ QUOTE ]

Just Party right now, but there are posts on other message boards by someone who works for Party saying they have plans to deal with this at all skins in the future. How they plan to deal with it is vague, but it's something that will apparently make all the whiney non-rakebacking affiliates happy.

If you're interested in these issues, skim the internet gambling forum every day. It's on topic there, and you'll get more information.