Unconventional hand

[Michael Davis]

Here is hand I played last night in $2-$10 spread limit:

I have pocket Ks with a Q showing. Two of my Qs and one other K are out, so my hand is not live. The bring-in and three others are in for $2, I make it $12 to go and get two callers.

On fourth street, the hands are:

Me KK/Q5
Bring-in xx/24 both hearts
Other xx/85 both clubs

I am high and check. It gets checked around.

On 5th street, the hands are:

Me KK/Q56
Bring-in xx/242
Other xx/859 all clubs

Bring-in bets, other player calls, I fold.

Comments?

[Andy B]

Is there an ante in this game? If so, I like the raise on third street. If not, I'd either limp or fold. Having raised on third, I think I'd follow through with a bet on fourth and hope that these guys fold. As it was, I think that you were correct to fold on fifth. This demonstrates the importance of playing live cards.

[Dynasty]

Your hand isn't worth a raise on 3rd street. It's barely playable.

[Michael Davis]

Andy,

There is no ante in the game. Do you think this is a clear fold? I usually raise my big pairs to $7 or wait until 4th street to pop someone, but because of my decreased chances of improvement, I decided to try and take everyone's two bucks or play this hand heads up. Should I be folding in the future? Obviously, a limp on my part is not an option.

On 4th, I checked because of the dangerous cards caught by my opponents. I find many opponents who can lay down lower pairs on 3rd but not three flushes. No matter what they have, I figure I'm in real trouble on 4th and likely to get called in both spots. However, had the 24s checked, I would have checkraised a bet from the 85s who could have been on a pair of 8s. If the 24s would have bet, I would have folded if the 85s called. Is this a ridiculous strategy, or is a checkraise to play the hand heads up okay because of the money in the pot offsets the times when my opponent is favored with a four flush or even money with a live pair & three flush?

On 5th, I agree that I had a clear fold. The danger of the paired doorcard plus the great chance that I would be outdrawn even if holding the best hand makes it an easy pitch.

Thanks for the response.

Mike

[Michael Davis]

Dynasty,

Could you please elaborate on your comments? You would not play a semi-dead pair of Ks heads up against a lower pair? Is it because this is a no ante game? I am of the impression that this hand is still a clear play if I can limit the field, but I would appreciate being shown how and why I am wrong. Thanks for your response.

Mike

[Dynasty]

You should play the hand but just limp in with it and see what develops. Three opponents have already decided to play their hand so I don't see why you expect to get them to fold unless that's common in your game.

I agree with Dynasty here. The key is that three limpers aren't all going to muck, and you're making the pot big enough that it will encourage those who call third to stay on fourth and beyond. And for what? A chance to grab a $2 bring in. I'd just call here and hope for improvement or a chance to thin the field if others brick on fourth. But I'm wanting to get away from this hand if anyone bets.

Dear players,
if you fold a semi-dead pair of kings in that spot it's better to stay home watching basket.

You gave the hand away on 4th street.
I like the 3rd street play - raise the max, see who folds, hopefully play this heads-up with your kings, which should be a favorable situation.
Then, on 4th street, you missed a bet. Yes, both your opponents may have called your $12 with pocket 2 flush, but I doubt it. The bring-in could have split 2, and be unable to get away from them when raised (which, based on his 5th st. bet seems likely). Because so many Qs are dead, they put you on a steal. Then you check, and they get a free play behind you (neither one is going to bet a 4 flush or small pair here and risk a check-raise).
You should have bet the max on 4th street; if they both call behind you, you can check 5th, but you might win it on 4th because you are making them think that they will have to pay to go all the way.
If the bring-in does have split 2s (and I have seen MANY players call a big raise or 2 on 3rd st when they are the force and have split 2s), on 5th, he catches trips, and makes the right play.
If you bet on 4th street, you probably win the pot, or one of your opponents folds. If you get it heads up on 4th, different story altogether.