I took Josh's Preflop Challenge for 1000 hands

[QTip]

LAG reporting here....

I took Josh's Preflop challenge while clearing my bonus at PokerRoom. At one point, an observant player sucked with out with K2 (caught 2 pair on the river), and I had AA. He said "You've been raising with so much crap over there, now you had it!". I laughed at that point and said, "Good point." I was raising things like K9s and so forth from LP.

I lost money. (Not necessarily due to this topic)

However, I do think I learned some of what the point was. And I think the point was to see how powerful the PF raise is and just how much position really benefits you.

Also, it was a lot of fun!

[sthief09]

can you list some of the raises you had to make that you don't normally make?

[QTip]

Certainly, I'd like to post some, but I've just found out how to get my PokerRoom HH into PT (I needed the new version of PT, I just had the old one).

Anyway:

Small suited Broadways - this is a fairly common raise for me in LP with only 1 or 2 limpers that play poorly, but I did it regardless of the action or the limpers yesterday.

Small pps - I don't raise these LP, almost ever. There were a couple of times when I flopped my set on a really ragged non-broadway board and really cashed in because of the deception involved in the PF raise.

Mid pairs EP - mostly 77,88 as I frequently with raise 99 in a loose game. I was amazed at how frequently it was simply folded around at that point.

Suited connectors - 67s, 78s, 89s, 9Ts - the one thing I really liked about this was that I was often offered a free card on the flop if I felt like it.

Suited Aces and K9s

I'm going to download my HH when I get home, and see what my stats were, but I want to say I was real close to about 18/15. For some reason, the spirit of this challenge had me loosen up as well....

[slogger]

I think I get the gist of it, but what specifically was involved in the challenge?

[PokerBob]

[ QUOTE ]
I think I get the gist of it, but what specifically was involved in the challenge?

[/ QUOTE ]

limping=illegal except for 22-44 or something like that.

[QTip]

link (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Number=2244626&page=&view=&s b=5&o=)

[DMBFan23]

did you do any folding in EP with hands that you'd normally limp? which ones?

[private joker]

[ QUOTE ]
can you list some of the raises you had to make that you don't normally make?

[/ QUOTE ]

Time for me to hijack this thread -- sorry Q-Tip.

I played 6/12 at Commerce last night and ran card dead for a long time, so I got bored and decided not to limp preflop unless I had to. There were two hands I raised PF where I wouldn't normally.

Hand 1: I have K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif in MP1. UTG limps, UTG+1 folds, I RAISE, and the CO and button both cold-call. It's 5 to the flop, which is 953 with one diamond. Checked to me, I bet, they all call. Turn is the Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, I bet, get 3 callers. River is Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif, I check, everyone checks. We show down our hands -- I say "I missed my straight and missed my flush" and show K-high. Everyone nods and folds, and MHIG /images/graemlins/cool.gif

Hand 2: I have J/images/graemlins/heart.gif 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif UTG+1. UTG limps, I raised, folded around, blinds fold too. Heads up. Flop is KTx. Check, bet, call. Turn Q. Check, bet, he folds.

2 for 2.

Unfortunately, the other PFR hands I had were obvious: AKs, QQ, TT, and AKs again. I lost with all of them. /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

(Totally off-topic from this thread -- a dude sat down at the table with a copy of SSHE. I initially thought he was a devious 2+2er who was trying to make people think he was a donk while snowballing everyone with TAG play, but it quickly became clear he actually was that stupid. He played like crap; amazing that he was so open about bringing the book to the table -- he didn't even try to hide it; he lifted it up onto the felt and then made a commotion about stowing it. He lost about $200).

[shant]

[ QUOTE ]
(Totally off-topic from this thread -- a dude sat down at the table with a copy of SSHE. I initially thought he was a devious 2+2er who was trying to make people think he was a donk while snowballing everyone with TAG play, but it quickly became clear he actually was that stupid. He played like crap; amazing that he was so open about bringing the book to the table -- he didn't even try to hide it; he lifted it up onto the felt and then made a commotion about stowing it. He lost about $200).

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm dissapointed you didn't call me up because I would've drove to Commerce just to see this.

Did he ever call time and open it during a hand to see what he should do?

[pokerstudAA]

[ QUOTE ]


Small pps - I don't raise these LP, almost ever. There were a couple of times when I flopped my set on a really ragged non-broadway board and really cashed in because of the deception involved in the PF raise.


[/ QUOTE ]

/images/graemlins/laugh.gif How about that! Amazingly people start check raising the turn with top pair against your aggressive betting.

[DMBFan23]

hand 1 is a super standard pf raise in my playbook, for what that's worth

[private joker]

[ QUOTE ]
hand 1 is a super standard pf raise in my playbook, for what that's worth

[/ QUOTE ]

For me it is from MP3-CO-Button, but in EP I've been raising KJs and better. QTs and KTs I've been limping.

[DMBFan23]

I usually raise KJs UTG, KTs from UTG+1 on, and I save QTs for either an open raise or a MP3-CO-Button isolatelimpers/getvalue/buybutton/freecard raise

EDIT: I'm not trying to nitpick because I think it's fine to limp KTs. I just raise it and it's worked well for me so far, without having the pokertracker data in front of me.

[private joker]

[ QUOTE ]


Did he ever call time and open it during a hand to see what he should do?

[/ QUOTE ]

No, but me and another guy were subtly making fun of him to each other (I don't think he heard; he was at the other end of the table). One time a board was QQ75 on the turn, and a tight player checked to him, he bet, and the EP guy check-raised. The SSHE-reader 3-bet the turn. He had A7. (Obviously the opponent had a Q). My neighbor and I looked at each other and said, "Chapter 12."

Later, the board was K9xT on the turn, and the river paired Ts. The SSHE-reader bet, and a super-passive lady in LP raised him -- anyone who has been remotely observant knows this lady has constantly checked top pair, and checked 2 pair whenever a straight was possible. She would never raise here without a T, and indeed she had KT for the boat. He actually called her raise and threw down AA. He got angry. My neighbor and I looked at each other and said, "Chapter 4."

[QTip]

Suited Aces.

[shant]

[ QUOTE ]
"Chapter 12."

[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
"Chapter 4."

[/ QUOTE ]
Brilliant, in my opinion.

[Chris Dow]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
"Chapter 12."

[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
"Chapter 4."

[/ QUOTE ]
Brilliant, in my opinion.

[/ QUOTE ]

If I ever get the chance to do this with a neighbor, it will make at least my month, if not my year. Hillarious.

[QTip]

SSHE is not divided into numerical chapters. Discuss.


For those that have their sarcasm detectors turned off - /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[Chris Dow]

You ass.

I had to actually run over to my copy upon reading this, can you imagine my disappointment? Well, can you, punk?



For the sarcasm detectorless among us: /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[Victor]

hahaha....thats how i play normally.

[sthief09]

[ QUOTE ]
Suited Aces.

[/ QUOTE ]


clark is all about the suited aces. I kinda think they suck out of position. I like them in LP where I can get to showdown cheap or judge when I am or am not good. I also think the wheel aces are infinitely better than A6 and A7

[QTip]

Ed talks about the wheel power over kicker power thought in SSHE. His thoughts were that the kicker was much more improtant, and I do agree with that. His thoughts were that perhaps A5s was somewhat better than A6s, but that's as far as he would go.

[sthief09]

[ QUOTE ]
Ed talks about the wheel power over kicker power thought in SSHE. His thoughts were that the kicker was much more improtant, and I do agree with that. His thoughts were that perhaps A5s was somewhat better than A6s, but that's as far as he would go.

[/ QUOTE ]


Page me please. I don't recall that.

[sthief09]

I'd limp J9s in that spot FWIW unless the table was tight

[QTip]

Page 70 1st paragraph. That's w/o looking! Just kidding...

Also, there's a footnote on that section that says the following:

"For more on this topic, see p. 151 of The Complete Book of Hold'em Poker by Gary Carson."