i am a walking vagina post-flop and need help [Archive]

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liucipher

04-26-2005, 01:15 PM

Background: I just graduated from 6s to 11s after building a BR, and I've lost 9 buy-ins or so in a row on the 11s. A lot of the times it's because I'm short-stacked with ~600 chips in level 4. I'm seeing I lose some chips early (~100 or so at a time) on hands like this. Am I being way too tight?

In this hand, I'm not thrilled about my position + two callers.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t15 (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

MP1 (t800)
MP2 (t660)
MP3 (t800)
CO (t795)
Button (t1085)
Hero (t785)
BB (t800)
UTG (t800)
UTG+1 (t675)
UTG+2 (t800)

Preflop: Hero is SB with T/images/graemlins/club.gif, Q/images/graemlins/club.gif.
1 fold, UTG+1 calls t15, UTG+2 calls t15, 5 folds, Hero completes, BB checks.

Flop: (t57.50) Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif, J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 5/images/graemlins/heart.gif (4 players)
Hero bets t60, BB folds, UTG+1 calls t60, UTG+2 calls t60.

Turn: (t237.50) K/images/graemlins/spade.gif (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG+1 bets t80, UTG+2 calls t80, Hero folds.

River: (t397.50) 2/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (2 players)
UTG+1 bets t80, UTG+2 folds.

Final Pot: t477.50

Results in white below: 
UTG+1 doesn't show.
Outcome: UTG+1 wins t477.50.

Iamafish

04-26-2005, 01:18 PM

You're short stacked in level 4 becuse your playing TQs in level 1.

Phil Van Sexton

04-26-2005, 01:20 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Your short stacked in level 4 becuse your playing TQs in level 1.

[/ QUOTE ]

He was the SB. There is no justification for folding QTs preflop from the SB. None.

Scuba Chuck

04-26-2005, 01:21 PM

My favorite part of this post are the results. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

Phil Van Sexton

04-26-2005, 01:27 PM

There are a few different ways to play this, but none of them should involve folding on the turn for only 80 more.

You may have the best hand and you have a straight draw.

I'd probably bet the turn if I bet the flop, but I don't think checking is bad. It worked out great when he only bet 80, but unfortunately you folded.

If you want to play it safe, just check the flop and see what happens.

Sam T.

04-26-2005, 01:31 PM

I actually think you are being too loose post-flop. Obviously the completion in the SB is not a problem, but you need to remember why you are in the hand in the first place - top pair lousy kicker is not a hand you want to be betting. If you don't flop two pair or better, or an absolute monster of a draw, you should check-fold.

Your bet might take down the pot from time to time, but this early in the tournament, you are going to get called by clowns with a worse (or better) pair, a gutshot, etc. Then you've built a huge pot with a very weak hand, and have to decide whether you want to back it with your stack. The bet is a no-no, the check fold is fine.

Sam

Sorry, just realized that the turn gave you the OESD. In that case call. But I stand by the check-fold advice.

liucipher

04-26-2005, 02:04 PM

I agree. Betting the flop is an iffy move. But I would argue more because of my obscenely ugly position than the strength of the hand? I mean dominating kickers are going to be KQ and AQ, and I think either tend to reraise me rather than flat call in which case I release the hand. Also, both tend to get raised by players (regardless of position) pre-flop in low limit SNGs.

On the turn: In retrospect, I was 1/5 to improve to a straight draw or trips, so it was dumb for me to fold 80 to a 400 pot (pot odds much?). I think I was just jittery about having two callers on my pot-sized bet on the flop so I opted to get out of the hand.

What to do on the river though? UTG+1 didn't exactly show massive strength by betting 1/3 of the pot on the turn. Should I check w/ the hopes that he bets weak (like he did) and call expecting him to flip over Q+weak kicker, Jx, and occasionally Kx? Or should I retake initiative and lead out w/ a bet on the blank of a river?