$20/40 Bay 101 or Garden City?

[TheMetetron]

I've played one session of both, lost about $200-300 each time over a few hours... yeah, I suck.

Anyways, I'm curious what people who have played more of these games think is the better one. At this point, I'm leaning towards Garden City being a tad easier. And of course the $3 button drop beats the $7 per half time.

Just looking for any thoughts about these two games as I'll probably be making them my regular B&M games now.

[scrub]

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And of course the $3 button drop beats the $7 per half time.

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This is extremely questionable with autoshufflers.

scrub

[scrub]

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And of course the $3 button drop beats the $7 per half time.

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This is extremely questionable with autoshufflers.

scrub

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Actually, now that I do the math it's not even close. The time is a much better deal.

scrub

[edtost]

are you really getting 47+ hands/hr, or am i just retarded at arithmatic?

[TheMetetron]

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are you really getting 47+ hands/hr, or am i just retarded at arithmatic?

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Okay, let me think this out.

9 handed @ GC. 10 handed at Bay 101.

GC, $3 button drop. Bay 101, $7 time per half per player.

GC, I pay $3 per 9 hands. Bay 101, $7 per half an hour.

I have to get 21 hands per half or 42 per hour for it to be break even. Any more hands and it goes to Bay 101. Any less, makes it Bay 101.

Now, am I really getting in more than 42 hands per hour? I don't actually know the answer... guess I'll have to count.

[scrub]

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are you really getting 47+ hands/hr, or am i just retarded at arithmatic?

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I am.

I did it a long time ago and figured it was about even if the shufflers got 5 hands more per hour. Not really sure what I did when I checked the math a minute ago, but I somehow ended up off by a factor of 2.

scrub

[scrub]

Oh, I see what I did.

Anyway, if you adjust for how often you have someone lobbying in the drop game, it's not at all clear that the drop is a better deal.

scrub

[DrPublo]

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Not really sure what I did when I checked the math a minute ago, but I somehow ended up off by a factor of 2.


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Mol bio = bad at arithmetic? You're kidding! /images/graemlins/smile.gif

The Doc

[scrub]

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Not really sure what I did when I checked the math a minute ago, but I somehow ended up off by a factor of 2.


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Mol bio = bad at arithmetic? You're kidding! /images/graemlins/smile.gif

The Doc

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Seriously.../images/graemlins/smile.gif

In this case, I decided to give myself a $7/hr discount on the time, since I'm such a nice guy and all...

scrub

[Glurfle]

I've played in some truly atrocious games at Garden City. Chopped 3-4 times/orbit, that kind of thing. Usually the game's pretty good, though. The Bay 101 game has been consistently not crappy for me, and occasionally really, really good. I've got a mild preference for Bay 101, but I don't think it's a big deal. Actually, I think the AJ's 15/30 is the best game, but it might be too far away.

[UprightCreature]

Both GC and 101 use autoshufflers at the 20/40 games.

I like the GC 20/40 games better in general. They are usually (not always though) softer in my experience. I do however like the way 101 handles must moves better. GC always runs their games in a must move chain with sometimes 1 main and three succesive must moves. 101 usually has only 1 must move table and then a couple main games.

[scrub]

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Both GC and 101 use autoshufflers at the 20/40 games.

I like the GC 20/40 games better in general. They are usually (not always though) softer in my experience. I do however like the way 101 handles must moves better. GC always runs their games in a must move chain with sometimes 1 main and three succesive must moves. 101 usually has only 1 must move table and then a couple main games.

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Chaining move games is really dumb.

scrub

[Analyst]

Generally, I think the games at GC are a bit softer though both are usually good, often very, very good. Bay101 may actually be slighty better right now - there's some truely terrible play - but really the two cardrooms are pretty close in that regard.

As has been pointed out, GC's must-move policy is frustrating. It is chained (vacancy at the main game is filled by the second table, then the second table's now open seat is filled by the third table, etc.). When you factor in seat changes, it will often take more than ten minutes from the time a seat opens at the main game to a player being called from the list.

Time charge vs. button drop - eh, not enough difference to worry about.

[TheMetetron]

Bay 101 is my new favorite after last night... I got the crap scared out of me but after being capped 3 way on a 7 5 5 board... I ended up winning a ~$700 pot with AA against the cappers power hand of 76!

[Analyst]

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Bay 101 is my new favorite after last night... I got the crap scared out of me but after being capped 3 way on a 7 5 5 board... I ended up winning a ~$700 pot with AA against the cappers power hand of 76!

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NH! Not too surprising, though. One reason I think that Bay101 may have moved past GC is that people are cold-calling raises with anything: small suited one- or two-gappers like 74s, any connectors and any paint. I had someone call 3 cold on me with KTo. Even ABC, ram-and-jam poker - and patience - should be able to beat this game fairly handily.

[haakee]

I think you are getting just about that -- 42 hands an hour with the machine. I measured once, but I think I measured in the 40-80 which probably goes a little faster.

[Rick Nebiolo]

[ QUOTE ]
I like the GC 20/40 games better in general. They are usually (not always though) softer in my experience. I do however like the way 101 handles must moves better. GC always runs their games in a must move chain with sometimes 1 main and three succesive must moves. 101 usually has only 1 must move table and then a couple main games.

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Do you think there is any connection between must move policies and quality of games? Don't be influenced by Scrub, who may or may not agree with me regarding chaining must moves /images/graemlins/grin.gif

~ Rick

[UprightCreature]

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Do you think there is any connection between must move policies and quality of games? Don't be influenced by Scrub, who may or may not agree with me regarding chaining must moves

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There are three things I don't like about must move chains.
1) It takes a long time to move through the chain when a seat at the main table opens up. (not that important, when I call ahead I never have to wait that long.)
2) No table selection.
3) (maybe 2 a) I commonly go to the card room with my wife, and we prefer to play at different tables.

Advantages of must move chains:
1) If good players don't like chains the games may be softer.

Unkown
1) The main game is full of people who have been playing a long time. Are people who have been playing a long time in general playing better or worse? I'm not sure about this... stuck and trying to get even, someone pushing the rush, good TAG grinding it out ect.


I can't see any reason why a must move chain game would atract better players, but it may discourage them from playing. In order to make a must move chain game better the overall player quality difference would have to be enough to make up for the lack of table selection.

Having said all this I have still found the GC game softer in general than the 101 game.

[edtost]

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Do you think there is any connection between must move policies and quality of games? Don't be influenced by Scrub, who may or may not agree with me regarding chaining must moves

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chaining must moves blow.

also, scrub's posts are almost never wrong.

[Analyst]

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There are three things I don't like about must move chains.
1) It takes a long time to move through the chain when a seat at the main table opens up. (not that important, when I call ahead I never have to wait that long.)

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This point is a factor for me, as I typically only have a short while to play. Though it probably only impacts a very few people, the added ten minutes of musical chairs takes up a measurable percentage of my game time.

[Rick Nebiolo]

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Do you think there is any connection between must move policies and quality of games? Don't be influenced by Scrub, who may or may not agree with me regarding chaining must moves

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chaining must moves blow.

also, scrub's posts are almost never wrong.

[/ QUOTE ]

Agree on both points above. Plus I like scrub's avatar /images/graemlins/smile.gif

As mentioned before in other threads my observation is that chaining must moves and never taking the must move off creates a filtration system of sorts to ensure that all the fun and gamble is taken out of the games, especially as you move toward the "main game" in the chain, which is often full of stuck, joyless grinders and nits.

Typical gamblers and/or recreational players can understand being moved once to protect games that were spread earlier. But when they are moved more than once in a chain their next move is often out the door.

Casinos and card clubs that chain must moves usually find that the chain rarely grows beyond three games, or the introduction of chaining will cut down four or five games to two or three.

Regards,

Rick

[DiamondDave]

game selection: advantage bay 101
opponents making ill-advised raises: advantage garden city