KK Line vs 2+2er

[Ogre]

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t30 (7 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

OGRE (t910)
UTG (t1035)
MP1 (t890)
MP2 (t965)
CO (t4020)
Button (t1065)
SB (t1115)

Preflop: OGRE is BB with K/images/graemlins/club.gif, K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
<font color="#CC3333">UTG raises to t90</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, CO calls t90, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">OGRE raises to t225</font>, UTG calls t135, CO calls t135.

Flop: (t690) 8/images/graemlins/club.gif, 7/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, T/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
OGRE checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets t810 (All-In)</font>, CO folds, OGRE calls t685 (All-In).

Turn: (t2185) K/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players, 2 all-in)</font>

River: (t2185) 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players, 2 all-in)</font>

Final Pot: t2185


Is the flop check raise against an agressive player good or bad after reraising him preflop? In this situation I got him all-in but in general do you like this play or is it just giving away too many free cards? I respect him and he raised from UTG so I thought he had a big hand probably TT-AA, AK AQ.

OGRE

[citanul]

the problem with going for the check raise against a good thinking opponent is that they will often be more scared when you check after reraising than if you had bet. your line looks ok if you think that your opponent is a very aggressive type, i'm not much of a fan of free cards, but honestly, when you're ahead here, your opponent is usually drawing to very few outs, so it's not that bad. meh, that's as much as i want to get into that exact topic just now.

notes on this post, but not necessarilly this hand: just cause someone is a 2+2er does not make them necessarilly a good thinking player. letting people know the buyin level of your hand is usually helpful as well.

citanul

[Apathy]

Looks like a fine line, trying to make it look like you have Ak and missed. Who was the 2+2er? And what is your SN, I've never seen it anywhere....Pm me if its a secret, or don't is its a REALLY big secret /images/graemlins/tongue.gif.

[Ogre]

Sorry I always forget that the converter doens't tell the buy in. It was a 50+5.

[Ogre]

I don't give out my SN anymore, this is why (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=&amp;Number=2140406&amp;page=&amp;view=&amp;sb=5&amp; o=&amp;fpart=1&amp;vc=1)

The 2+2er was DoYouSeeWhy. I'm pretty sure it was a 2+2er at least.

[J-Lo]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't give out my SN anymore, this is why (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=&amp;Number=2140406&amp;page=&amp;view=&amp;sb=5&amp; o=&amp;fpart=1&amp;vc=1)

The 2+2er was DoYouSeeWhy. I'm pretty sure it was a 2+2er at least.

[/ QUOTE ]
I think his name is DoYouSeaWhy

[beeyjay]

Does the 2+2er know that youre a 2+2er or at least know that u know what youre doing? I think this might makes a difference here. He would know that you'd be willing to lay down a big hand. He would also be more likely to be scared off if you bet straight out I would imagine if he knew this.

[Ogre]

DoYouSeeWhy and DoYouSeaWhy are the same person I'm pretty sure. Just 2 different accounts for 8 tabling?

[Apathy]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't give out my SN anymore, this is why (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=&amp;Number=2140406&amp;page=&amp;view=&amp;sb=5&amp; o=&amp;fpart=1&amp;vc=1)

The 2+2er was DoYouSeeWhy. I'm pretty sure it was a 2+2er at least.

[/ QUOTE ]

DoYouSeeWhy is a 2+2er who very rarely posts. He also plays 109s quite a bit, and multitables. He is decent and solid.


So You don't want to share you SN because your underage... I guess I understand that, but I don't think anyone here is going to rat you out... /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[Apathy]

[ QUOTE ]
Does the 2+2er know that youre a 2+2er or at least know that u know what youre doing? I think this might makes a difference here. He would know that you'd be willing to lay down a big hand. He would also be more likely to be scared off if you bet straight out I would imagine if he knew this.

[/ QUOTE ]

No its really the opposite, a better player will be more scared of a check here.

[Ogre]

By checking I thought he might bluff with his overcards that he would be folding if I would have bet out.

[citanul]

yes, but what apathy is saying is that this is more likely the case with a bad player than a good player. a good player is not often going to bluff off significant chips against someone who reraised preflop out of position and then checks the flop all that often. he's more likely, in my opinion, to try to "snap off your missed AK" than to do that.

citanul

[beeyjay]

I don't know. I thought about it for a minute and kept switching back and forth. I think I agree with you though considering it was such a large reraise.

However quite honestly I don't know how you're going to get them all in on this hand. If I was the other 2+2er I would have laid down anything but KK or AA preflop to this preflop raise from another 2+2er. My only hope I think would be to throw him off with a check and maybe think for a minute he could steal the pot.

[Apathy]

[ QUOTE ]
By checking I thought he might bluff with his overcards that he would be folding if I would have bet out.

[/ QUOTE ]

This seems pretty unlikely to me, I think he had JJ or QQ but correct me if I'm wrong.

[Ogre]

He didn't know I was a 2+2er

[beeyjay]

I think so, last week I'm pretty sure I had one of each of these on my tables. Isn't "do you see why" the line microbets always dropping?

[Ogre]

You are correct

[beeyjay]

If he didn't know I think the check was better. I have to think this would extend the range of hands you are reraising preflop with in his mind and thus make it more likely that you could have missed the flop and not already had him beaten preflop.