Useless mental poker exercise.

[Pokey]

You're in a home game of $1/$2 Texas Hold 'Em and you limp with 33 and four players see a pot of 3-3-A. You say to the table, "here's a bonus for the winner" and drop a dead $100 bill into the pot. You then proceed to bet / raise every street.

Do you think this dead drop would be +EV? Why or why not?

[Ianco15]

I will try to answer this without getting into any odds because it's late and this is my last post before bed.

Assuming the table is not full of thinking players, I would say it is positive EV. People will see the $100 and chase everything, drawing dead or very slim. You will definitely earn more bets. You will lose the hand virtually never, and the $100 you will lose will more than be payed for by the bets you win the times you won the pot.

[Popinjay]

brilliant if against drunk players

[The_Bends]

If you can sell it as a gamble for a laugh rather than a calculated move it'd be worth it. Against thinking players they'd probably work you out.

Now if you did if before when you had nothing, then you'd see fireworks.

[eleventy]

do you do this alot? If not it would be pretty obvious you didn't think you were going to lose. Otherwise why through 100 into a 10 pot? If you do this, then make a big bet or checkraise, and then show trash once in awhile it might work.

[bernie]

No, they wouldn't see right through this at all. Because Im sure you do it often enough that they wouldn't wonder why you're all of a sudden putting that wad in. Especially if you're seen as a tighter player.

I doubt you do it enough to justify it. But it'd be fun to try.

Then of course someone gets running 4 to make quad 4s and beats you.

b

[Wally Weeks]

That's funny. What made you think of this "puzzle"?

Like the other posters stated, I agree that this would more likely work against non-thinking players. Against thinking players, they'd see this ruse for what it is: an amusing ploy. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

I'm not sure if it's quite +EV since it could piss off the weak players into making them suckers, if they fall for it. But then again, maybe it would lighten up the table with some humor (not to mention it seems like everyone that plays poker thinks they are good at it).

Regards,
Wally

[wade]

Man, you ruined my day...I can't stop thinking about this one.

$100 into a 4 handed flop at 1/2 gives infinate odds to any pocket pair or A to see the turn. Given 3 other players in the hand I'd say the $100 is too much.

4 players see the flop + your $100 = 104 small bets

Count r-r quads as less than 1 out and a set of aces as 1

Both need at least 46-1 to continue, which you gave them....so a bet of say $44 would be more appropriate.

I'm confusing myself /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[The_Bends]

A set of Aces has 1 out but any PP has far far less than one out odds. Factor in the odds of anyone having AA or a PP rather than any other hand in the deck and you're still a massive favourate with a $100 bet.

[dogmeat]

Author Frank Wallace suggested this type of ploy in his 1970's book on poker. In a home game, with lots of gamblers and friends, it might work more than once. He liked to pull a huge sandwich out of his bag when the game had been going for hours and guys were hungry - but only when he had found a big hand.............

Dogmeat /images/graemlins/spade.gif

[ThinkQuick]

Oh man, Frank R. Wallace's guaranteed income book was the first poker book I ever read, since it was online and free.

His ploys are very entertaining.. his whole game is social engineering, getting people to play regular games and just manipulating them..

ahh, found the link neo tech publishing (http://www.neo-tech.com/poker/)

[pzhon]

If no one knew you intentionally added money to the pot, it would be +EV to do so.

With a concealed monster, your equity is greater than the size of the pot. In normal play, this is true for premium hands preflop, overpairs and better on an uncoordinated flop, etc. That's why you don't need to get 7.5:1 odds to call with a low pocket pair: You don't always win when you flop a set, but you average more than the size of the pot when you hit.

The tiny chance of losing an extra $100 is much less important than the extra bets you will collect from any ace, any pocket pair, any wheel draw, and in fact, any backdoor draw.