Move up vs 8 tabling??

[elcheapo]

After getting my first Dell 2001FP and seeing 4 tables at the same time I've become pretty convinced that I could 8 table. So if thats not a concern the question is after 635+ 33s at 44% ITM and 33% ROI 4 tabling should I move directly to 8 tabling them or moving up to the 55's. I've played about 20 55's with a 80% ROI which doesn't mean much but maybe there is no fear factor. Whats the general consensus on the evolution?? 33's 4 tabling> 33's 8 tabling>55's 8 tabling>109-215 etc. while maintaining a 200 buyin bankroll for each level??

[1C5]

I would move up to the 55s while 4 tabling if I were you.

Others might say 8 tabling the 33s but I like the 4 tabling 55s idea better.

[elcheapo]

Do you know how much the ROI drops when you go from 4 to 8 tabling?? If there is a significant drop then 4 tabling the 55s at a similar ROI (within 10%)is the best solution.

[citanul]

what your roi drop will be is dependent on you. so no, we don't kow what the roi drop will be.

citanul

[elcheapo]

How bout from 33 to 55? I know that is considered to a be a smaller step versus the step from 55 to 109 but is it still a significant step.

[raptor517]

my roi dropped about 100% when moving from 4 to 8. i recommend trying out 4 tabling the 55s first. holla

[elcheapo]

Are you saying you lost money when you started 8 tabling or are you being sarcastic?

[AA suited]

50+5

my roi also dropped like a rock when i moved from 4 to 6 tables.

i created a new acct for the extra 2 tables and it lost $1000 (-50% roi) /images/graemlins/frown.gif

i'm back to 4 tables

[raptor517]

i was being sarcastic. just do whatever feels comfortable to ya. /images/graemlins/wink.gif holla

[hummusx]

[ QUOTE ]
50+5

my roi also dropped like a rock when i moved from 4 to 6 tables.

i created a new acct for the extra 2 tables and it lost $1000 (-50% roi) /images/graemlins/frown.gif

i'm back to 4 tables

[/ QUOTE ]

But your main account continued at it's original ROI?

[AA suited]

yep, main acct still 40% itm, 25% roi during that period.

so logically it has to be variance.

but you can also look at the opposite. 6 tabling HAS affected my play negatively. 40%itm and 25% roi was the variance. i just lucked out, and my real play is closer to my new acct?

but try it yourself both ways (8 table and move up) and see what your stats are. maybe your style gets you more $/hr 8 tabling. or maybe you're skilled enuf to hold your own at the higher levels. or neither and you get max $/hr is the old way.

the hardest part is actually going ahead w/the experiment and being prepared to for a slide in bankroll and ego/confidence.

[Mr_J]

I say add more tables first, then when you are comfortable with 8 move to the $55s and drop back to 4 for a while. I say this because if you tried the $55s first, you'd probally jump back to the $33s to 8table at first anyway. Also, after being used to 8 tabling, 4tabling the $55s will be a total breeze and allow you to focus on your game.

"while maintaining a 200 buyin bankroll for each level??"

If you don't mind having to drop down a level if you get low then a BR this large is not needed. If you want to move up and never have to move back down, then yeh 200 is very healthy.

[citanul]

i'm sorry, i forgot to ask the most crucial of the questions i think:

what are your goals with respect to sngs? where do you want to go?

citanul

[Maulik]

Chicago, my kind of town. Chicago, is.

[Degen]

55's are a different animal though. expect the learning curve.


Degen

[citanul]

[ QUOTE ]
Chicago, my kind of town. Chicago, is.

[/ QUOTE ]

i'm so confused /images/graemlins/smile.gif

hm. maybe you'll know the answer to the post i'm about to make.

citanul

[Degen]

Yes...it took me around 50 tourneys and a whole lotta posting and reading and PMing to get it.


Its not so much all-in PF stealing. There is a lot more poker to be played...the 200 extra chips make a BIIIIIIG difference.


Expect a learning curve and figure this into your bankroll.


Degen

[Degen]

how's 12-tabling going?


Degen

[Degen]

ditto when i tried to 8-table the 33's.

i think reading about people who 8-table is -EV /images/graemlins/wink.gif

Degen

[Degen]

"the hardest part is actually going ahead w/the experiment and being prepared to for a slide in bankroll and ego/confidence. "

yes


Degen

[citanul]

dude, take a valium or something.

citanul

[Degen]

eh?

[citanul]

nothin, you made 4 posts in this thread in 2 minutes, that's all.

citanul

[elcheapo]

Honestly, consistent 4 hr a day income. Making a 100 K a year with rakeback working 40 weeks a year 20 hours a week would be nice. After playing many limit and NL cash games over my first 1 1/2 of playing I realized that I'm a just a better tournament player than at cash games. Maybe the fact I'm kind of limited so far in the depths of thinking that is poker that I enjoy having a clear cut result after a few easy decisions based off the gap concept or my own perceptions of what will work and won't work at a given table. Basically find a draw,two pair,top pair,set, straight, flush or trips and look for a way to maximize wins and minimize losses. If I'm wrong then I lose 33$ or 55$ but I learn and the next 4 or 5 times I get it right.

[AA suited]

good that you can learn immediately and apply it to the next 4 to 5 games.

me, i still think about pushing w/77 at lvl3 and go for coinflips /images/graemlins/blush.gif

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=2148497&page=0&view=colla psed&sb=5&o=14&fpart=1

[citanul]

[ QUOTE ]
Honestly, consistent 4 hr a day income. Making a 100 K a year with rakeback working 40 weeks a year 20 hours a week would be nice. After playing many limit and NL cash games over my first 1 1/2 of playing I realized that I'm a just a better tournament player than at cash games. Maybe the fact I'm kind of limited so far in the depths of thinking that is poker that I enjoy having a clear cut result after a few easy decisions based off the gap concept or my own perceptions of what will work and won't work at a given table. Basically find a draw,two pair,top pair,set, straight, flush or trips and look for a way to maximize wins and minimize losses. If I'm wrong then I lose 33$ or 55$ but I learn and the next 4 or 5 times I get it right.

[/ QUOTE ]

i'm too lazy right now to figure out your rakeback numbers and how they would impact this, they won't be insignificant though:

100k a year 40 weeks a year 20 hours a week.
100k a year 800 hours = 125 an hour

i'm also not going to stop here and make a talk about if this is what's actually your goals with poker, and what would make you happy, or anything like that. onward. i'm also way way too lazy to make the correct adjustments to say that you're going to get in more than one table per slot per table, maybe i'll guestimate something at the end.

125 an hour 4 tabling is 31.25 a table per hour
125 an hour at 8 tabling is 15.65 a table per hour.

alright, i know i just said i wasn't going to guestimate any but here goes:

4 tabling that looks like very attainable 4 tabling the 100s.
8 tabling that looks like very attainable 8 tabling the 50s.

especially when you factor in the rakeback.

your competition/variance will likely be better for you at the 8 tabling the 50s route.

you say you are currently 4 tabling the 30s, right?

my path for you if i had to choose one would look something like this then, making adjustments and stepping down if you need to:

4 table the 50s for 1000 sngs or so, then 6 table them for a bit, then move to 8 tabling them do that for a while, til you're comfortable with it, then 4 table the 109s, then you can probably skip 6 tabling and go right to 8 tabling the 109s.

some, possibly me, would recommend when you move up each time playing fewer tables for a bit, so you might want to not 4 table the 50s the first couple days you play them or something, or maybe you do, who knows. but this is neatly handled if you move this way up to the 109s and will have you playing 4 of them for the first week or so even though you've moved up levels.

good luck.

citanul

[1C5]

Very nice post.

How about for me, what would you suggest? I just started playing SnGs in December, got through 500 $11s (I skipped the $6 ones) And I am now currently 4 tabling the $22s. I have 2 2001fps, but would you suggest I stick to 4 tabling and move up to the 33s or stay at the 22s and move to 6 and 8 tabling there?

Goals in poker is to improve my play but the money of 8 tables would be nice as 4 tabling is a breeze for me and I don't think I will have any problems at all with 8.

[citanul]

there's no harm in trying 8 tabling, and seeing what happens to your results at the level you're playing at. i would in general always move to fewer tables for the first couple of days when moving up though. i think that unless you have a really strange brain, the amount of stuff learning there is to do as you move up requires playing few tables so that you can see/learn instead of just losing and not knowing why, or even worse, not knowing why other people are losing around you. sorry i can't go into more detail right now, i need to scout out some tables and get started for the day.

citanul