Call/Call/Call line here?

[Mister Z]

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif. MP1 posts a blind of $1.
<font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, MP1 (poster) checks, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, BB calls, MP1 calls.

<font color="blue"> I know this raise is somewhat questionable but it's right out of SSH's tight game PF rec's... </font>

Flop: (6.50 SB) K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, A/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 5/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, MP1 calls, Hero calls.

Turn: (4.75 BB) 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, MP1 calls, Hero calls.

River: (7.75 BB) 6/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, MP1 calls, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 10.75 BB
<font color="blue">
I took the call/call/call line here from a lot of threads I've been reading lately - especially Q-Tips poo-bah thesis. Is this a good use of it here or should I be raising at some point? I figure there's no way to protect my hand with the bettor being to my left, and a raise isn't really for value since I'm either pretty far ahead or way behind. </font>

[KaiShin]

This is a great PF raise. I will raise this hand 100% of the time in this situation.

Nice hand.

[GrunchCan]

The only thing that's questionable PF is why you think it's questionable. You must raise.

[cold_cash]

If you were heads up I think this line is probably fine.

With the other guy in the middle I think a raise somewhere would be prudent.

[blackize]

Why do you have to raise this hand? I have been raising hands such as this from the button almost every time on these limits at party. Most players are very very passive at these limits and will flat call with A10 and up and then let you bet the hand for them.

[Elbie]

I like your raise preflop. A9s is a pretty strong hand and here you have dead money (poster) in the pot. Calling or folding would be pretty bad.

Postflop your line is ok I guess but like cold cash I would have found a raise somewhere because of the MP1 still being in the hand.

[Ianco15]

I actually like the call/call/call line here. The board was not draw heavy and by calling down you can induce betting by a worse hand.

It would have been okay if you raised the flop to see where you stand. Either line is fine IMO.


Ship__It.

[Rev. Good Will]

Raise for info on the flop! The response you get could save you the trouble of staying and wasting 2 BB's

[ArturiusX]

[ QUOTE ]
I actually like the call/call/call line here. The board was not draw heavy and by calling down you can induce betting by a worse hand.

It would have been okay if you raised the flop to see where you stand. Either line is fine IMO.

Ship__It.

[/ QUOTE ]

I like the call call call because it makes you look passive, and extracts the most money from a worse hand. And you get to see a showdown, rather then having a war and folding to an unknown.

[numeri]

[ QUOTE ]
I know this raise is somewhat questionable but it's right out of SSH's tight game PF rec's...

[/ QUOTE ]

[Replying before reading other posts - grunching]

I'm not sure about the call/call/call line - I don't have a good enough understanding of it - but I have a problem with your first line. It's been mentioned by others in some other threads that we shouldn't raise because the good book tells us to. Why are you raising here?

I would say that your raise is because A9s is a pretty good hand! Particularly against the blinds and a poster.

So now to see what everyone else wrote.... /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

EDIT: Misread the board - hero is already the button.

[btspider]

for clarification, the line is call, betting if checked to.. or 1 bet per street postflop.

i might raise this turn. a 5 outer like Kx may fold.

[Mister Z]

[ QUOTE ]
Why do you have to raise this hand? I have been raising hands such as this from the button almost every time on these limits at party. Most players are very very passive at these limits and will flat call with A10 and up and then let you bet the hand for them.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is my reason for taking this line - I've seen ppl do this w/AT numerous times. I figure this way I lose the least amount if behind or drawn out on, and still win bets from both opponents if ahead. Either way I'm not getting an AX to fold and I'm defending myself against a C/R. I think I like my line here after some more thought.

Unfortunately... BB turned over A6 for a rivered two pair - but had I raised the flop or turn I bet he would have C/R'd me on the river.

[Mister Z]

[ QUOTE ]
for clarification, the line is call, betting if checked to.. or 1 bet per street postflop.

i might raise this turn. a 5 outer like Kx may fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

Since I'm last to act and the bettor is on my immediate left I don't see anyone folding for one more bet on the turn - plus that could expose me to a 3-bet which I would have to fold. Had the BB checked and MP bet the flop or turn I would definitely raise.

[jrz1972]

1. This is an automatic raise.

2. I don't think call-call-call is bad and I would probably play it this way HU, but with another guy in the hand its probably a good idea to raise the turn. (A flop raise isn't folding the guy in the middle, but a turn raise might).

BTW, if you were HU, you should at least consider raising the river. This particular hand is at or near the lower end of the call-call-raise line.

[MrWookie47]

I think I'm with you. I like raising the turn since there's another person in the hand. HU, I'm not so sure. Your line makes more sense then, but I might still try and find a raise somewhere. It's easier to get a raise in when you have position than when you're out of position and have to use c/c, c/c, bet.

[SlantNGo]

I would raise the flop, and I think it's a value raise. Your opponents are much more likely to be holding a K or a lower Ace. If you're outkicked, you also have 4 outs to improve.

[ QUOTE ]
a raise isn't really for value since I'm either pretty far ahead or way behind.

[/ QUOTE ]

[numeri]

[ QUOTE ]
If you're outkicked, you also have 4 outs to improve.


[/ QUOTE ]
How do you get 4? On the flop, I see 3 outs to win (3 9's) and 3 outs to tie. (3 5's) The turn adds 3 more outs to tie (3 7's). Am I missing something?

[Redd]

Disclaimer: I'm being Grunchcan's bitch and posting in the dark.

I really like the whole hand.

[SlantNGo]

Sorry, I missed the outs to a chop. I meant 4 outs to a win (1 out for the backdoor flush).

[ QUOTE ]
How do you get 4? On the flop, I see 3 outs to win (3 9's) and 3 outs to tie. (3 5's) The turn adds 3 more outs to tie (3 7's). Am I missing something?

[/ QUOTE ]

[davelin]

PF raise is great. I'm throwing a raise somewhere, I think your hand is good more than 33% of the time here.

[numeri]

[ QUOTE ]
Sorry, I missed the outs to a chop. I meant 4 outs to a win (1 out for the backdoor flush).

[ QUOTE ]
How do you get 4? On the flop, I see 3 outs to win (3 9's) and 3 outs to tie. (3 5's) The turn adds 3 more outs to tie (3 7's). Am I missing something?

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]
Ahh.... forgot the BDF. My bad.