valuebet this?

[dark_horse]

figured raising on the button is better than limping with this. on the river in 1st pos HU i would c/c. if i were c/r here not sure what i would do.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (8 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is Button with Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, T/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
UTG calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP1 calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, BB calls, UTG calls, MP1 calls.

Flop: (8.50 SB) 4/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 2/images/graemlins/heart.gif, T/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
BB checks, UTG checks, MP1 checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, BB folds, UTG calls, MP1 folds.

Turn: (5.25 BB) 5/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
UTG checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG calls.

River: (7.25 BB) A/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
UTG checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG folds.

Final Pot: 8.25 BB

[KaiShin]

Perfect.

People who want to know how to get their PFR up, this is how.

[Mister Z]

I like it, but I'm folding to a raise. That turn completes a lot of draws. Given the line he's taken here I bet you're good 65% of the time.

[Duerig]

I really dislike the preflop raise. But other than that, I think you played the hand perfectly. Missing a value bet on this river is a mistake, in my opinion.

[Shillx]

[ QUOTE ]
People who want to know how to get their PFR up, this is how.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is what he meant to say:

People who want to know how to turn LAG, this is how. /images/graemlins/cool.gif

Brad

[Malachii]

I kind of like the flop raise. I mean, it's not for value in that he's not pushing an equity edge with QTo, but raising in last position could allow him to steal the pot if rags flop because he's representing an overpair. Keep in mind he only has to do this rarely for it to be a profitable play.

[bottomset]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
People who want to know how to get their PFR up, this is how.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is what he meant to say:

People who want to know how to turn LAG, this is how. /images/graemlins/cool.gif

Brad

[/ QUOTE ]

i think a Shillx vs Entity duel in the making .. the preflop raise is ok if the limpers are the bad LPP types, since you didn't provide reads .. i don't think this should be the automatic default line here

[Duerig]

He's playing low limit where everyone loves to call down. Value betting should be your primary source of income in this game, I think. Also, he's paying 3 SB (preflop raise and the flop bet) for the change to pick up 6 SB (assuming limpers and the BB call preflop). So this has to work more than 33% of the time. I don't think it does at this level. Just my opinion.

[JimNashe]

I am folding this pf, with a couple of limpers QTo can't figure to be very good even on the button. But if the fold button wasn't working, I might raise it half the time and limp the other half (depending on whether I thought the blinds might fold to a raise).

The flop and turn play is fine, but on the river I would certainly check behind.

The last card out is an overcard to your pair, it completes a 4 straight and a flush. If UTG was chasing a straight, the A and 5 wille have made him either two pair or a straight.

If he was chasing with overcards the ace will often have made him top pair.

And if the last card didn't him it will scare him and make him less likely to call with a bad hand.

The value of betting contains two components, the cost that you incur when he's made a better hand than you and either check-raises or just calls and the income you gain when he
calls your bet with a worse hand than your own. While the cost side of the equation might not have changed that much with the last card I think the income side went down considerably.

If he did check-raise the river I would almost certainly fold it unless I had a solid read.

[ArturiusX]

I hate QTo because the best hands it makes are tough to hold up. I'd muck this. It might be profitable with great post flop play, but I'll leave that too the poohbahs /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[@bsolute_luck]

w/o reads: fold. an UTG limper means he has something. even with loose players, i'm checking because you're not improving your position and QTo has little equity. would people raise if it would buy the button? i might consider that.

Fortunately this hand turned out great for you. i think the bet on the river is debatable. i like it only because UTG folded, but i don't know what he'd be calling down with unless it was a flush or straight draw or an overcard. KQo maybe?? usually, i'd just check behind.

[dark_horse]

in 1/2, you might be surprised (or maybe not) to see what players call down with. i think at this limit it's an alright valuebet, but at higher limits, even 2/4, it's debateable.

[@bsolute_luck]

[ QUOTE ]
in 1/2, you might be surprised (or maybe not) to see what players call down with. i think at this limit it's an alright valuebet, but at higher limits, even 2/4, it's debateable.

[/ QUOTE ]

really? hmmm...i think i'd play the way i posted and i only play at .25/.5 /images/graemlins/crazy.gif

[grjr]

[ QUOTE ]

The flop and turn play is fine, but on the river I would certainly check behind.


[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with this and everything else that Jim wrote.

[Dead]

[ QUOTE ]
That turn completes a lot of draws.

[/ QUOTE ]

No it doesn't.

It completes two inside straight draws(A-3 and 6-3), and the second one is unlikely.

[bozlax]

Check me if I'm wrong, here, but isn't this a classic WA/WB river? You've got straights and flushes on the board, plus an overcard that players luuuurrrrve to limp and run to the river with. Isn't the right play here to take the free showdown, since you won't fold a better hand or be called by anything worse than yourself? I s'pose you might get a TPP to fold KT, but that's about it?

[Entity]

I would limp preflop unless the SB or BB were good players. I like the rest.

Rob

[Entity]

Guys,

Folding preflop here sucks the big one unless the limpers are good. You don't need to be a magic worker postflop to turn a profit from a hand like this on the button.

[KaiShin]

I advocated the raise, but I would definitely at least limp this.

Or were you just using my response as a convenient post to address everyone in general? /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Entity]

[ QUOTE ]
I advocated the raise, but I would definitely at least limp this.

Or were you just using my response as a convenient post to address everyone in general? /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

I just hit reply on a random post. I know you advocated the raise, which I probably wouldn't do here unless I felt I gained something from it -- I'd do it if the limpers were fit-or-fold or if the blinds were good, but I'd just limp otherwise.

Rob