Prop Betting Procedure Question

[NLSoldier]

Please consider the following scenario.

We have 2 people. Person A and person B. On day 1, person A and person B agree to bet on a task that person A is to complete on day 3. If person A completes the task by a specified point in time on day 3, he wins the bet. If he fails to complete the task, person B wins the bet. The bet is agreed upon.

On day 2, person A comes to person B and says he wants to cancel the bet. He cites the fact that no circumstances have changed since the time the bet was agreed on. Person B says he does not want to cancel the bet, and argues that the fact that person A now wants to cancel is a change of circumstances in itself.

Does person A have the right to cancel the bet and not pay person B any money?

[Schneids]

Assuming the information is identical (in the case of this, it sounds like no circumstances have changed... unlike if say someone bet with Clark about UNC winning it all in the Sweet 16, then May got injured, and the person wanted to cancel while UNC was still alive), bets are cancellable.

That's why in roullette, you can modify or even remove your bet completely all the way up until the wheel starts to slow, even though technically your bet was placed.

[pshreck]

Under simple contract law, no, they cannot cancel the bet.

However, these prop bets are most likely all technically illegal, so either party can do whatever they want.

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
Assuming the information is identical (in the case of this, it sounds like no circumstances have changed... unlike if say someone bet with Clark about UNC winning it all in the Sweet 16, then May got injured, and the person wanted to cancel while UNC was still alive), bets are cancellable.

That's why in roullette, you can modify or even remove your bet completely all the way up until the wheel starts to slow, even though technically your bet was placed.

[/ QUOTE ]

Obviously prop betting is not the same as roulette. With a prop bet there are an infinite number of other factors that could be influencing Person A's desire to cancel the bet. I.E. he no longer believes he will be able to complete the task.

[Ianco15]

Once two parties agree to a bet (espically where time is important), one party cannot cancel the bet the next day without consent from the second party.

If someone pulled that with me I definitely wouldn't bet with them again.

[KidPokerX]

The answer, by law, is no. All conditions to this bet have been agreed upon by both parties, therefore person A cannot change the terms of this agreement without the (written) consent of both parties.

Of course if this was an oral contract, it becomes a little more sticky to resolve - and also cannot be changed orally (by law).

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
Under simple contract law, no, they cannot cancel the bet.

However, these prop bets are most likely all technically illegal, so either party can do whatever they want.

[/ QUOTE ]


I would assume the people are friends and wish to follow gentlemenly prop betting protocol.

[thatpfunk]

[ QUOTE ]
Assuming the information is identical (in the case of this, it sounds like no circumstances have changed... unlike if say someone bet with Clark about UNC winning it all in the Sweet 16, then May got injured, and the person wanted to cancel while UNC was still alive), bets are cancellable.

That's why in roullette, you can modify or even remove your bet completely all the way up until the wheel starts to slow, even though technically your bet was placed.

[/ QUOTE ]

Time was a factor in this bet though. Once a prop bet is agreed upon, its a done deal. Backing out of bets is weak.

[pshreck]

[ QUOTE ]

I would assume the people are friends and wish to follow gentlemenly prop betting protocol.

[/ QUOTE ]

It is pretty clear from this board and everywhere that there is no clearly defined prop betting protocol. The reason people find so many angles is because they are playing with shaky rules.

Under the idea of an agreement or contract, backing out once the agreement is made, with no penalty, doesn't make much sense. So I would assume that under prop bet protocol, you can't get out of it unless the second party allows you to.

[bicyclekick]

I've been asked to edit my response, so I will. Backing out of a bet is very toolish.

[MEbenhoe]

whod you make this bet with? and what was the bet? these (especially the 2nd) could effect the correct answer

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
whod you make this bet with? and what was the bet? these (especially the 2nd) could effect the correct answer

[/ QUOTE ]

The question was worded the way it was for the sake of anonymity. The people and involved will probably be disclosed after the poll is complete. The bet itself may or may not be, and should not matter.

[TheWillMo]

JERRY: So, when do I get my dinner?

KRAMER: There's no dinner. The bet's off. I'm not gonna do it.

JERRY: Yes. I know you're not gonna do it. That's why I bet.

KRAMER: There's no bet if I'm not doing it.

JERRY: That's the bet! That you're not doing it!

KRAMER: Yeah, well, I could do it. I don't want to do it.

JERRY: We didn't bet on if you wanted to. We bet on if it would be done.

KRAMER: And it could be done.

JERRY: Well, of course it could be done! Anything could be done! But it only is done if it's done. Show me the levels! The bet is the levels.

KRAMER: But I don't want the levels!

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
JERRY: So, when do I get my dinner?

KRAMER: There's no dinner. The bet's off. I'm not gonna do it.

JERRY: Yes. I know you're not gonna do it. That's why I bet.

KRAMER: There's no bet if I'm not doing it.

JERRY: That's the bet! That you're not doing it!

KRAMER: Yeah, well, I could do it. I don't want to do it.

JERRY: We didn't bet on if you wanted to. We bet on if it would be done.

KRAMER: And it could be done.

JERRY: Well, of course it could be done! Anything could be done! But it only is done if it's done. Show me the levels! The bet is the levels.

KRAMER: But I don't want the levels!

[/ QUOTE ]

VERY NICE!

[MEbenhoe]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
whod you make this bet with? and what was the bet? these (especially the 2nd) could effect the correct answer

[/ QUOTE ]

The question was worded the way it was for the sake of anonymity. The people and involved will probably be disclosed after the poll is complete. The bet itself may or may not be, and should not matter.

[/ QUOTE ]

Post edited, cuz this whole situation is way too easy to see through, and NLSoldier didnt want me to give it away.

[DBowling]

something similar just happened to me yesterday. my brother bet me he could ride a flatbed cart down home depot without running into anything/one. I immediatly agreed. Upon realizing that there were 2 people in said eisle, he declined to make an attempt, yet he gave me the money anyway.

So yes, the bet is still on, though it depends what the change in circumstances is, i believe.

[Ulysses]

Of course he can't cancel. WTF kind of dumb question is this?

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
Assuming the information is identical (in the case of this, it sounds like no circumstances have changed... unlike if say someone bet with Clark about UNC winning it all in the Sweet 16, then May got injured, and the person wanted to cancel while UNC was still alive), bets are cancellable.

That's why in roullette, you can modify or even remove your bet completely all the way up until the wheel starts to slow, even though technically your bet was placed.

[/ QUOTE ]

WTF are you smoking Schneids? Roullette? Who f'in cares about roullette?

OK, let me get this straight. In your world of betting, the following could happen:

Wednesday:

[Schneids] Yo, Diablo, I bet you $500 that the Giants are going to score over 75 runs in the baseball game on Friday.

[Diablo] Uh, yeah, I will bet they score less than 75 runs.

<Diablo and Schneids shake on it>

Thursday:

[Schneids] Yo, Diablo, you know that bet we made about the Giants game tomorrow?

[Diablo] Yeah?

[Schneids] I thought about it some more and decided I made a stupid bet, so the bet's off. "LOL"

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
WTF are you smoking Schneids?

[/ QUOTE ]

[bicyclekick]

[ QUOTE ]
Of course he can't cancel. WTF kind of dumb question is this?

[/ QUOTE ]

Schneids likes to pull lots of bs on friends.

[LondonBroil]

So....are we making that Giants bet or not?

[pshreck]

Im glad Diablo came and really pointed out the absurdity of even asking this question. I was confused why there was any discussion on it at all.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Of course he can't cancel. WTF kind of dumb question is this?

[/ QUOTE ]

Schneids likes to pull lots of bs on friends.

[/ QUOTE ]

OK, since this is a real situation and there appears to be some dispute, let me explain exactly what the procedure is here.

Person A can offer to settle w/ Person B for some compensation in exchange for being let out of the bet. If no such agreement is reached, the bet stands.

[daryn]

it's a bet! /images/graemlins/wink.gif J/K "LOL"

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Of course he can't cancel. WTF kind of dumb question is this?

[/ QUOTE ]

Schneids likes to pull lots of bs on friends.

[/ QUOTE ]

OK, since this is a real situation and there appears to be some dispute, let me explain exactly what the procedure is here.

Person A can offer to settle w/ Person B for some compensation in exchange for being let out of the bet. If no such agreement is reached, the bet stands.

[/ QUOTE ]

YEP, this is what I said as well....but *someone* else seems to think differently....

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
Im glad Diablo came and really pointed out the absurdity of even asking this question. I was confused why there was any discussion on it at all.

[/ QUOTE ]

Please see BK's post.

[Schneids]

Alright, I asked to get outta the bet. Soiler said no. He offered a compromise pay off, I said eff that to his two options he gave me. He said we'll make a poll and if the results say you can get outta it then you can otherwise the bet is on. I say ok. I expect the results to say the bet is still on and I'm fine with that though if they didn't for some reason that's a bonus; especially because it really is an easy bet I expect to win. So yeah, this poll really is going to end up costing Soiler $150.

[daryn]

so why would you back out? start talking details or forever be labelled "douche".

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
Alright, I asked to get outta the bet. Soiler said no. He offered a compromise pay off, I said eff that to his two options he gave me. He said we'll make a poll and if the results say you can get outta it then you can otherwise the bet is on. I say ok. I expect the results to say the bet is still on and I'm fine with that though if they didn't for some reason that's a bonus; especially because it really is an easy bet I expect to win. So yeah, this poll really is going to end up costing Soiler $150.

[/ QUOTE ]

LMFAO, Care to share what the bet is, since its "so easy to win"

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
so why would you back out? start talking details or forever be labelled "douche".

[/ QUOTE ]

[pshreck]

[ QUOTE ]
so why would you back out? start talking details or forever be labelled "douche".

[/ QUOTE ]

LOL

I just pictured his grandchildren in 50 years going "Merry Christmas, you douche."

[mason55]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
so why would you back out? start talking details or forever be labelled "douche".

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

is this a gay masturbation bet or something?

[daryn is right]

[ QUOTE ]
start talking details or forever be labelled "douche".

[/ QUOTE ]

No kidding. I'd fess up pretty quick here. You know how harsh 2+2 can be.

Good call daryn.

[NLSoldier]

HAHAHAHAHAHA /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Schneids]

[ QUOTE ]
so why would you back out? start talking details or forever be labelled "douche".

[/ QUOTE ]

Bet about asking out a certain girl in my journalism class tomorrow. A bet I wanted to back out of because
A) I wanna skip the class to work on one of three papers that are due soon that I haven't worked on enough the past day or two.
B) Realized it was a short term infatuation. So, since I'm shifty and constantly changing my mind, I wanted out.

However, I'm prepared to and very capable of going forward to earn the easiest $150 on the planet.

[daryn]

you just have to ask her out? that's it?

wow, sounds like an easy $150.

still though, no back-outs, only buy-outs.

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
so why would you back out? start talking details or forever be labelled "douche".

[/ QUOTE ]

Bet about asking out a certain girl in my journalism class tomorrow. A bet I wanted to back out of because
A) I wanna skip the class to work on one of three papers that are due soon that I haven't worked on enough the past day or two.
B) Realized it was a short term infatuation. So, since I'm shifty and constantly changing my mind, I wanted out.

However, I'm prepared to and very capable of going forward to earn the easiest $150 on the planet.

[/ QUOTE ]

I for one am very surprised that this just got posted....

Anyways, I'll be sure to let you guys know how I spend the money /images/graemlins/cool.gif

[nolanfan34]

[ QUOTE ]
you just have to ask her out? that's it?

wow, sounds like an easy $150.

still though, no back-outs, only buy-outs.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was going to say, that does sound easy.

How would NL even know that you did it?

This sounds like a bet where you could take advantage of loopholes, like ask her when she can't hear you.

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
you just have to ask her out? that's it?

wow, sounds like an easy $150.

still though, no back-outs, only buy-outs.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was going to say, that does sound easy.

How would NL even know that you did it?

This sounds like a bet where you could take advantage of loopholes, like ask her when she can't hear you.

[/ QUOTE ]

CMON, dont give him and silly ideas!

[Evan]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
so why would you back out? start talking details or forever be labelled "douche".

[/ QUOTE ]

Bet about asking out a certain girl in my journalism class tomorrow. A bet I wanted to back out of because
A) I wanna skip the class to work on one of three papers that are due soon that I haven't worked on enough the past day or two.
B) Realized it was a short term infatuation. So, since I'm shifty and constantly changing my mind, I wanted out.

However, I'm prepared to and very capable of going forward to earn the easiest $150 on the planet.

[/ QUOTE ]
It also makes you a douche that you turned down what I assume was the same bet with what I know is the same girl, when I offered. Lame.

[daryn]

i don't get this whole situation. is there something physically wrong with schneids? does he have 3 eyes or something? two noses? otherwise i don't get it.

[Evan]

Well, getting a date with her was implied in my offer. Even a 3-eyed, 2-nosed freak could ask a chick out. The bet was dependant on success.

[Schneids]

[ QUOTE ]
i don't get this whole situation. is there something physically wrong with schneids? does he have 3 eyes or something? two noses? otherwise i don't get it.

[/ QUOTE ]

They all like to rip on me because I like girls like Natalie Portman and Avril Lavigne more than their huge chested fantasy girls. And because my social life is written like a soap opera and I openly share with them more than I probably should because I'm this weird mix of both extremely reserved-nature (usually around girls I want) as well as random outgoing splurges (usually around girls I don't want), and as such has made for some funny yet admittedly sad stories.

At least, that's why I think it is anyway. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
i don't get this whole situation. is there something physically wrong with schneids? does he have 3 eyes or something? two noses? otherwise i don't get it.

[/ QUOTE ]

They all like to rip on me because I like girls like Natalie Portman and Avril Lavigne more than their huge chested fantasy girls. And because my social life is written like a soap opera and I openly share with them more than I probably should because I'm this weird mix of both extremely reserved-nature (usually around girls I want) as well as random outgoing splurges (usually around girls I don't want), and as such has made for some funny yet admittedly sad stories.

At least, that's why I think it is anyway. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Nice try.

Ya, hes got 7 eyes and 14 noses actually.

[daryn]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In risposta di:</font><hr />
Well, getting a date with her was implied in my offer. Even a 3-eyed, 2-nosed freak could ask a chick out. The bet was dependant on success.

[/ QUOTE ]

whoa.. i don't know about that. if the bet was, "i bet you $150 you will not ask this girl out" then all he has to do is ask and you lose. why is prop betting so hard, or alternatively, why are retarded people allowed to make prop bets?

or maybe you stipulated it must end in success? don't say it was assumed.

[daryn]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In risposta di:</font><hr />
</font><blockquote><font class="small">In risposta di:</font><hr />
i don't get this whole situation. is there something physically wrong with schneids? does he have 3 eyes or something? two noses? otherwise i don't get it.

[/ QUOTE ]

They all like to rip on me because I like girls like Natalie Portman and Avril Lavigne more than their huge chested fantasy girls. And because my social life is written like a soap opera and I openly share with them more than I probably should because I'm this weird mix of both extremely reserved-nature (usually around girls I want) as well as random outgoing splurges (usually around girls I don't want), and as such has made for some funny yet admittedly sad stories.

At least, that's why I think it is anyway. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

wow, you sound like me.

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Well, getting a date with her was implied in my offer. Even a 3-eyed, 2-nosed freak could ask a chick out. The bet was dependant on success.

[/ QUOTE ]

whoa.. i don't know about that. if the bet was, "i bet you $150 you will not ask this girl out" then all he has to do is ask and you lose. why is prop betting so hard, or alternatively, why are retarded people allowed to make prop bets?

or maybe you stipulated it must end in success? don't say it was assumed.

[/ QUOTE ]

My bet with him was not dependant on success.

[Evan]

[ QUOTE ]
They all like to rip on me because I like girls like Natalie Portman and Avril Lavigne more than their huge chested fantasy girls.

[/ QUOTE ]
Not true.

[ QUOTE ]
And because my social life is written like a soap opera

[/ QUOTE ]
Sitcom, dude, the word is sitcom.

[Ulysses]

Well, just in case you haven't watched enough teen movies, let me tell you how this one goes.

Chick is not really that hot. You ask her out, she accepts, you win bet.

Once she gets made up a little, turns out she is actually super hot. But then she finds out you asked her out on a bet and never wants to talk to you again. Right after this she engages in a 3-way w/ NLSoldier and Evan.

You go back and tell her that you loved her all along and that the bet was just an excuse to do what you wanted to do anyway and you were stupid. She thinks this is sweet and you guys get back together.

[mason55]

[ QUOTE ]
My bet with him was not dependant on success.

[/ QUOTE ]

So this sounds like you're secretly trying to give him incentive to ask this girl out cause he's too shy? Just a guess.

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
They all like to rip on me because I like girls like Natalie Portman and Avril Lavigne more than their huge chested fantasy girls.

[/ QUOTE ]
Not true.

[ QUOTE ]
And because my social life is written like a soap opera

[/ QUOTE ]
Sitcom, dude, the word is sitcom.

[/ QUOTE ]

NH!

[Evan]

Sometimes NL Soldier and I use different words, even when we talk to the same person.

[daryn]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In risposta di:</font><hr />
Sometimes NL Soldier and I use different words, even when we talk to the same person.

[/ QUOTE ]

touche.

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
My bet with him was not dependant on success.

[/ QUOTE ]

So this sounds like you're secretly trying to give him incentive to ask this girl out cause he's too shy? Just a guess.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good guess /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

[mason55]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
My bet with him was not dependant on success.

[/ QUOTE ]

So this sounds like you're secretly trying to give him incentive to ask this girl out cause he's too shy? Just a guess.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good guess /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Sorry I let the cat out of the bag /images/graemlins/cool.gif That's makes you a pretty cool friend. I wish my friends paid me to ask girls out!

[Schneids]

[ QUOTE ]
Well, just in case you haven't watched enough teen movies, let me tell you how this one goes.

Chick is not really that hot. You ask her out, she accepts, you win bet.

Once she gets made up a little, turns out she is actually super hot. But then she finds out you asked her out on a bet and never wants to talk to you again. Right after this she engages in a 3-way w/ NLSoldier and Evan.

You go back and tell her that you loved her all along and that the bet was just an excuse to do what you wanted to do anyway and you were stupid. She thinks this is sweet and you guys get back together.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is one of my top 25 fav. movies of all time. Your sarcasm doesn't phase me. NH.

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
Well, just in case you haven't watched enough teen movies, let me tell you how this one goes.

Chick is not really that hot. You ask her out, she accepts, you win bet.

Once she gets made up a little, turns out she is actually super hot. But then she finds out you asked her out on a bet and never wants to talk to you again. Right after this she engages in a 3-way w/ NLSoldier and Evan.

You go back and tell her that you loved her all along and that the bet was just an excuse to do what you wanted to do anyway and you were stupid. She thinks this is sweet and you guys get back together.

[/ QUOTE ]

LMFAO, I missed this amidst all the other rapid replies.

[daryn]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In risposta di:</font><hr />
</font><blockquote><font class="small">In risposta di:</font><hr />
Well, just in case you haven't watched enough teen movies, let me tell you how this one goes.

Chick is not really that hot. You ask her out, she accepts, you win bet.

Once she gets made up a little, turns out she is actually super hot. But then she finds out you asked her out on a bet and never wants to talk to you again. Right after this she engages in a 3-way w/ NLSoldier and Evan.

You go back and tell her that you loved her all along and that the bet was just an excuse to do what you wanted to do anyway and you were stupid. She thinks this is sweet and you guys get back together.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is one of my top 25 fav. movies of all time. Your sarcasm doesn't phase me. NH.

[/ QUOTE ]

whoa, one of your top 25 fav. movies has your gf in a 3-way with your two buddies?

[Evan]

[ QUOTE ]
whoa, one of your top 25 fav. movies has a girl that doesn't know who the [censored] you are in a 3-way with your two buddies?

[/ QUOTE ]

[astroglide]

[ QUOTE ]
I thought about it some more and decided I made a stupid bet, so the bet's off. "LOL"

[/ QUOTE ]

the LOL in quotes is truly excellent there man, i have to give it up

[Schneids]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
whoa, one of your top 25 fav. movies has a girl that doesn't know who the [censored] you are in a 3-way with your two buddies?

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

I wouldn't stop to respond if this was anywhere close to true but that's a flat out lie.

...Just thought I'd interject, King Pez. Thanks, lets end this spam now.

[nolanfan34]

[ QUOTE ]
...Just thought I'd interject, King Pez. Thanks, lets end this spam now.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sounds like someone has a new nickname.

[Schneids]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
...Just thought I'd interject, King Pez. Thanks, lets end this spam now.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sounds like someone has a new nickname.

[/ QUOTE ]

Just so we're clear that this name was specifically selected by me for Evan...

Here's what urbandictionary.com says about Pez:

A pez can be one or all of the following.

1. An emofag
2. A Thick bastard
3. An Immature wanker
4. A midget

1. "Look at that emofag over there listening to lostprophets, hes such a pez
2."AHAHAHA that pez does not understand the relative advantages of a communist society""
3."Look at that loser over there with his pecker out, he’s a complete pez"
4."Poor Nikki and her vertically challenged boyfriend John, he's king pez"

[bugstud]

just go get some ass, eh? /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[gamblore99]

no circumstances have changed. I see no reason why he can't back out of the bet. If he changed his mind 5 minutes after the hand shake would that be ok? it damn well better be.

If time has allowed for the development of new knowledge than thats differnt. but if the circumstances are the same its fine.

[mason55]

[ QUOTE ]
no circumstances have changed. I see no reason why he can back out of the bet. If he changed his mind 5 minutes after the hand shake would that be ok? it damn well isn't.

[/ QUOTE ]

[DavidC]

I voted no.

The exception is if you guys included a cancellation clause in your bet. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

(If you did, you're friggin geniouses!)

[NLSoldier]

Bump for results.

Can we all please give our runner up a big round of applause /images/graemlins/grin.gif