Is this story true "Fossilman"

[MDBLakers]

I read this on RGP.

"This past weekend I made my way to Foxwoods to try and win a seat
at the NEPC this upcoming weekend. I found the act 1 competition fairly easy to
wade through. I expected the act 2 to be a bit more competitive. I wasn’t
disappointed.

I sat down at the table next to guy wearing his best poker uniform;
sunglasses, hat, and a Pokerstars.com leather jacket. As I sat down he let me
know that there were a lot of good players at the table. He gestured to the
other end and told me who each of the four older gentlemen were and their recent
poker playing achievements. Great, I’m thinking… this should be quick and
painless.

Things went better than I had hoped for. After and hour and a half
all but four of us had been eliminated. Interestingly enough only one of the
heavy hitters remained. On one particular hand I was dealt pocket J’s. I put in
a $300 bet and was called by the heavy. The flop came 10s Jd 5d. I took another
peek at my cards to give the impression I was unsure of what I had. When I
looked up, Greg Raymer had taken the seat right next to the guy and was staring
at me (apparently they were friends as they chit chatted through the rest of the
round). Man was I surprised. Not awestruck or anything like that just a bit
surprised, this being only the second tournament table I’ve ever been at,(the
act 1 an hour before was the first) even if it was just an Act 2. So he was
looking me over and I noticed his eyes shifted down to my hands. It’s important
to note that I had only gotten about 3 hours sleep the night before and had had
way too much caffeine and very little to eat in the past 12 hours. At this point
I realized my hands were shaking ever so slightly. I checked it back to the
heavy and he put up $600 which I called. The turn came the 3s. Right before the
card hit the table I noticed Raymer had leaned over and was whispering something
in the guys ear. I knew what he was telling the guy. I knew it plain as day “His
hands shake when he has a monster hand.” I put up another $600 and the guy
folds and says nothing.

Twenty minutes later it’s me and the heavy again. He raises $200
pre-flop and I call him with rags (4d 7h or something equally as shitty), being
sure my hands are resting on the table as not to give anything away. The flop
comes 10s 9h Ad. He raises another $1200. At this point I lift my hands up off
the table surface and allow them to shake a bit while I contemplate a move here.
I make sure he notices my hands. Once I’m sure he has seen them, I think for
another minute or two and push everything I have into the middle. He thinks for
a minute and mucks it. As I’m scooping up the chips I tell the guy “I wish you
had called me”. He shoots back “I wish your hands didn’t shake so much when you
had a great hand.”. “Heh yeah” was my reply.

Soon after that, one of the other two at the table busted out and we
collected our Act 3 coupons from the floor guy. After everything was sorted I
went over and shook the heavies hand, complimented him on his play and then I
shook Raymers hand and told him I just wanted to shake his hand.

I busted out 2 hours into the Act 3 that night, after making a
stupid rookie mistake, going all in with pocket 7’s preflop then getting called
by pocket A’s. I was always careful to keep the hands from shaking though. Good
lesson to everyone. Get plenty of sleep and stay away from the caffeine.

I can’t think of another time I’ve ever had so much fun for a mere
$60 buy in. Good luck to everyone who made it through the Act 3’s.

If you happen to read this Greg, thanks for the lesson."


JD

[nolanfan34]

It's on RGP, it must be true!

Seriously though, I would put the chance of Greg essentially helping a fellow player during a hand like that, at a number lower than 0%. What a joke.

[Uethym]

He probably whispered "Bust this mother[censor]" /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Greg (FossilMan)]

If the facts of this story aren't true, then they're close enough, to the best of my recollection. However, I have no memory of what I might have whispered into my friend's ear on the occasion of this particular hand. It most certainly was NOT anything about the hand that was in play. I would never give advice to my friend about a hand WHILE he is playing it. After the hand was over, then I might have given advice. It is quite possible I was saying something to him about a previous hand against a different opponent, but I was definitely not coaching him about the hand or opponent in play.

I was more likely making a joke that was not directly related to the hand in play, and which was off-color enough that I didn't want to say it out loud in public. ;-)

Later, Greg Raymer (FossilMan)

[Boris]

So let me get this straight. You whispered something in your friend's ear while your friend was in a hand? If true, that's highly inappropriate behavior.

[Beerfund]

[ QUOTE ]
So let me get this straight. You whispered something in your friend's ear while your friend was in a hand? If true, that's highly inappropriate behavior.

[/ QUOTE ]

No shyt, what did you expect people to think? /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[MicroBob]

Indeed....whispering something in the friends ear while he had cards in front of him is pretty wrong.


Even if it is an off-color joke not at all related to the hand I would be less than thrilled if I was on the opposite end of the table and some guy was whispering something to the person I was in an important hand against.

How am I supposed to know what is being said?
Is this commonly accepted behavior? I'm not very tourney experienced but somehow I am pretty sure it isn't.

[Greg (FossilMan)]

[ QUOTE ]
So let me get this straight. You whispered something in your friend's ear while your friend was in a hand? If true, that's highly inappropriate behavior.

[/ QUOTE ]

"Highly inappropriate" seems a bit strong to me. If you ask me the time and I turn my arse towards you and fart loudly, saying "It's time to clear the room" is more of what I would think constitutes highly inappropriate behavior.

However, your general point, that I should avoid any appearance of impropriety, is well taken.

Oh, and just to say it again. I do not recall that I whispered into his ear DURING a hand. It is quite possible that I did, but I cannot say with absolute conviction that I either did or did not whisper at such a time. Let's just say, I'm sure I did nothing wrong, though it is possible I unintentionally did something that looked wrong.

Later, Greg Raymer (FossilMan)

[Beerfund]

[ QUOTE ]
If you ask me the time and I turn my arse towards you and fart loudly, saying "It's time to clear the room"

[/ QUOTE ]

This image is now forever burned into my brain. /images/graemlins/frown.gif

[CCx]

[ QUOTE ]
If you ask me the time and I turn my arse towards you and fart loudly, saying "It's time to clear the room" is more of what I would think constitutes highly inappropriate behavior.

[/ QUOTE ]

http://forums.maxima.org/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[Boris]

OK, OK, I'm guilty of some hyperbole in cyberspace. Please don't fart in my general direction.

[AnyTwoCanLose]

Any one that "whispers" to someone in the middle of a hand has no class.

I suspect that if Raymer's play was more highly regarded it would have been a bigger deal.

[ChrisCo]

[ QUOTE ]
Any one that "whispers" to someone in the middle of a hand has no class.

I suspect that if Raymer's play was more highly regarded it would have been a bigger deal.

[/ QUOTE ]

Damn trolls! /images/graemlins/mad.gif

[MicroBob]

[ QUOTE ]
If you ask me the time and I turn my arse towards you and fart loudly, saying "It's time to clear the room" is more of what I would think constitutes highly inappropriate behavior.

[/ QUOTE ]



Would you agree to do this at my table if I paid you $10?
It's really important to me.
Thanks.

[ismisus]

same thing when you asked for an autograph from Daniel Negraunu DURING an important hand at ESPN Tourney of Champs. Got to fix that habit.

[Rick Nebiolo]

[ QUOTE ]
However, your general point, that I should avoid any appearance of impropriety, is well taken.

[/ QUOTE ]

Greg,

As a long time admirer or your play, posts, style, and personal integrity I'm glad you took this line.

Regards,

Rick

[Sluss]

[ QUOTE ]
User has been ignored

You are now ignoring this user. You will no longer see the body of any of their posts.



[/ QUOTE ]

[KDawgCometh]

[ QUOTE ]

"Highly inappropriate" seems a bit strong to me. If you ask me the time and I turn my arse towards you and fart loudly, saying "It's time to clear the room" is more of what I would think constitutes highly inappropriate behavior.



[/ QUOTE ]

ROFLMAO. If I ever play at the same table as you, I'm gonna have to ask you do say that. Of course I'd probably be busted out soon after from laughing so hard

[bobbyi]

I don't think I could fake the "shaking hands" tells and have it look convincing. Can anyone else do this?

[betgo]

I am a great Fossilman admirer, but why would you be telling someone a dirty joke while they are in the middle of a hand? If I was in the middle of a hand at a tournament, I wouldn't want to be disturbed.

[b0000000000m]

Yes. It just involves my carrying a tiny syringe of epinephrine in my pocket. When I want to "shake," I just pull it out, and pretend to rub the back of my neck. Really I'm jabbing the needle directly into my brain.

[nothumb]

[ QUOTE ]
I am a great Fossilman admirer, but why would you be telling someone a dirty joke while they are in the middle of a hand? If I was in the middle of a hand at a tournament, I wouldn't want to be disturbed.

[/ QUOTE ]

Come on, it was an Act 2. Fossilman wipes his ass with an Act 2 ticket. Act 3, if he's had chili.

Seriously, this is dumb.

NT

[Vince Lepore]

I just read this post accusing Greg of giving advice during a hand. I'll tell you a TRUE story about Greg that, I believe, will show how Greg feels about poker Playing and his friends.

I count Greg Raymer as a friend. You may take this story with a grain of salt if you like but it is true and these are the facts as I remember them.

Greg was in Vegas last year playing in tournament, I believe that it was at the Plaza. That part is a bit hazy. Greg busted out of the Tournament early but decided to play in a $300 buy-in, with rebuy's, NL Tournament at the Golden nugget. I went there with him. I told him that I wouldn't mind playing but the buy-in and rebuy's were to high for me. He offered to take %50 of me as long as I agreed to take a rebuy whenever it was available. I agreed. I played fairly well through the rebuy period and managed to go into the second phase of the tourney buying only the $300 add on. Total investment was $600.

To make a long story short. The tournament paid 5 places. When we got down to 6 players they were Greg, me and four others. I believe that I had ~ T4800k in chips. I was the short stack but not by much. Two others were real close, they were on my right and had I blind Position on them so they had to go through Blinds before me. The Blinds were 300-600 or 400-800. Not important for this discussion. Greg was the Chip leader with a lot of chips. He was the BB. I was the cutoff. I picked up A,Ts. I raised, maybe 3 times the blind. (Don't say that I should have moved in. You might be right but I didn't. I wanted to make the money and was not married to this hand). Anyway, it's folded to Greg. Now remember, Greg has 50% of me. From a +EV point of view it would be to his advantage to help me make the money if it's possible. But from a moralastic point of view if he plays his hand differently than he would if he didn't have a piece of me it would be unethical. Greg played as if he did not have a piece of me. In fact, talking to him later, I found that he did not even consider the fact that he had a piece of me. He played poker the way he always plays poker. To win. In this hand he called with a worse A. A,9 to be exact. The flop was A,A,4. Check, check. Turn was a blnak. Check, I bet half of my chips. Greg called. 9 on the River and he moved me in and knocked me out of the tournament.

Greg Raymer, through the play of this simple hand demonstrated his integrity. He is an Honorable man and loves Poker. He believes that Poker is a one man to a hand game and one man to a game. In a nutshell this is Greg Raymer. He would never give poker advice to anyone during a hand. He is above all else and Honorable Man.

Vince

[betgo]

I have a hard time believing Fossilman would do something like this. However, his explanation that he might have been telling a dirty joke doesn't make much sense.

Although Fossilman is a lawyer, maybe he got tricked into apparently admitting something that wasn't true. I don't think it is a good idea to wisper something to someone playing a tournament hand. It might be misinterpreted. If you are as well known as Fossilman, it might wind up on the Internet.

[Joe Tall]

I do not recall that I whispered into his ear DURING a hand. It is quite possible that I did,

I'm very surprised. As soon as a friend of mine has a live hand, I stop talking. If they gesture to me to continue with what I'm saying, I quickly say, "Play your hand."

I would also never sit down at a live tournament table while there are hands in play.

But that's me.

[andyfox]

"However, your general point, that I should avoid any appearance of impropriety, is well taken."

-Spoken like a true champion.

"Let's just say, I'm sure I did nothing wrong, though it is possible I unintentionally did something that looked wrong."

-Spoken like a true lawyer. /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[Myrtle]

....I’ve been called many things in my life, but this is the first time I’ve been called a ‘heavy’.

Yes........... that was me that Greg sat down besides.

Yes.............. I noticed your hands shaking in that hand.....but they were also shaking at other times. FWIW, I discounted that potential tell as unreliable.

As far as my comment goes after I mucked my whiffed pre-flop steal attempt.........don’t believe everything you hear at a poker table.

I distinctly remember making that comment to you......Can you think of any reason that I might have made it?

So the question is.....What did Greg whisper in my ear, and when did he do it?

You say that you “knew it plain as day” that Greg told me “that his hands shake when he has a monster hand”. I certainly understand how you could feel that way, but did you really think that I missed that and needed Greg to point it out after we had been sitting at the same table for such a long time?

For the record, although you are ‘sure’ that Greg was tipping me on your ‘tell’, you are wrong. I say this with no hostility; only to point out the truth.

I remember EXACTLY what Greg said to me....I just don’t remember if the timing of it is as you have reported. I will assure you that what he said to me was personal & private, and had absolutely nothing to do with you or the play of any hand in progress.

Greg and I are good friends, and, as good friends do, we often sweat each other. It is not our custom to disturb each other when either of us is in a hand. I guess this could have happened when I was in the hand, but it would have been out of habit for either of us.

I do feel badly, as it appears that it left an impression with you that perhaps there was something going on, that really wasn’t. I really wish you had addressed it at that moment, but understand why you might not have felt comfortable doing so.

Sometimes when good friends are having a good time and life is good, their back & forth chatter/behavior can be easily misinterpreted to be something that it really isn’t.

I assure you that that is exactly what happened in this case, and I apologize to you for giving you any reason to believe that something below board was going on.

This post has served as a wake-up call to me, and I will be doubly conscious of my behavior from now on under similar circumstances.

[betgo]

I think the problem was what was Fossilman doing sitting at a tournament table chatting with one of the players in the first place. (I guess there are a lot of empty seats at a sattelite.) I think if someone else had done this, he would have been told to leave by various people. In fact the original poster was probably thrilled to have Fossilman at his table until, in his mind, Fossilman prevented him from winning a big pot.

[andyfox]

"I do feel badly, as it appears that it left an impression with you that perhaps there was something going on, that really wasn’t. I really wish you had addressed it at that moment, but understand why you might not have felt comfortable doing so.

Sometimes when good friends are having a good time and life is good, their back & forth chatter/behavior can be easily misinterpreted to be something that it really isn’t.

I assure you that that is exactly what happened in this case, and I apologize to you for giving you any reason to believe that something below board was going on.

This post has served as a wake-up call to me, and I will be doubly conscious of my behavior from now on under similar circumstances."

Good man.

[Myrtle]

[ QUOTE ]
I think the problem was what was Fossilman doing sitting at a tournament table chatting with one of the players in the first place. (I guess there are a lot of empty seats at a sattelite.) I think if someone else had done this, he would have been told to leave by various people. In fact the original poster was probably thrilled to have Fossilman at his table until, in his mind, Fossilman prevented him from winning a big pot.

[/ QUOTE ]

to explain....not to defend...

It's commonplace (at Foxwoods, anyhow) for friends to 'sweat' friends during these single table satellites. Usually they will sit or stand behind the player and a conversation ensues.

Besides the fact that Greg is now an easily recognized 'celebrity', he's also very personable, and generally livens up any table that he's either sitting at or observing. In this case, as he is a Foxwoods based player, he knew 2 or 3 other players at the table, and there was the usual amount of back-and-forth banter between all of us.

And yes, all one had to do was to look around the table once Greg arrived. Those who did not know him were obviously pleased that he was there, and it didn't take long for his presence to draw a crowd.

Again, I really don't remember definitively if the ‘whisper’ actually took place during the hand. It’s not like us to do that, but because I can’t remember, I cannot deny it.

I fully understand that even the faintest scent of impropriety can do damage. I feel pretty badly that anything that I had part in ended up casting aspersions on Greg’s character.

Anyone who knows Greg or me also knows that the chance of something unethical happening surrounding an issue like this is zero.

As I said earlier, I will now be doubly alert in the future.

[Vince Lepore]

Myrtle,

I know you and you are no "playa"! Of that I can attest!

Vince

[mybutthurts]

i live in groton ct.
i just cant believe greg did this.
or can i?
nice save greg. lol-

[RagleGumm]

the title of this post made me laugh.
the quotation mark made my think to myself, "is this story true 'fossilman', if that is in fact ...your real name!".

good times good times