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View Full Version : I am a woosie and need to take up tiddly-winks


keikiwai
03-29-2005, 11:50 PM
So how wimpy am I? Raise the turn? Raise the river? Or is wimpy the way to go here?

Table is relatively loose 4-6 players on each flop when not raised pf. With pf raise it is sometimes quite a few players, 4-5 sometimes only 3, never does it all fold. I don't have reads on the particular players in this hand. They are not the pf raisers....

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is BB with A/images/graemlins/heart.gif, K/images/graemlins/club.gif. UTG posts a blind of $0.5.
UTG (poster) checks, <font color="#666666">5 folds</font>, CO calls, Button calls, SB completes, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, UTG calls, CO calls, Button calls, SB folds.

Flop: (9 SB) 5/images/graemlins/spade.gif, J/images/graemlins/club.gif, 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG calls, CO folds, Button calls.

Turn: (6 BB) 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
Hero checks, UTG checks, Button checks.

River: (6 BB) 6/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
Hero checks, UTG checks, Button checks.

Final Pot: 6 BB

DeathbySuckout
03-29-2005, 11:56 PM
PF= Good
Flop= Good
Turn= Bet
River= Bet

ArturiusX
03-30-2005, 12:16 AM
[ QUOTE ]
PF= Good
Flop= Good
Turn= Bet
River= Bet

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't like a turn bet, if they didn't fold the flop what makes you think they'll fold the turn? Jx and rag pairs aren't going anywhere.

Henniker
03-30-2005, 12:24 AM
AKo is tough to play out of position when it misses the flop. Your flop bet is not terrible, but you could probably check here also. You could get lucky and have only one caller, but it's very helpful to vary your play after a PF raise, it may allow you to pick up more pots in the future when there are fewer players.

Turn, check the river with two more to act. With this flop, one of them is likely to have at least a pair, and you will get called or even raised. You will sometimes get lucky and it will check around the table, like it did here.

Solid play, but consider checking the flop here sometimes.

DeathbySuckout
03-30-2005, 12:25 AM
But you might get rid of a draw, no?

MrWookie47
03-30-2005, 12:37 AM
Flush draws are already getting more than proper odds. There are very, very few opportunities you'll have that can give a flush draw improper odds to call. You just have to assume that they'll be with you to the end. Hell, I think gutshots could even call profitably. You could only give small PP's improper odds to call. On the other hand, a bet does give your opponents the chance to make an incorrect fold.

While you could debatably bet the turn to try and get a better hand to fold, you have to check the river. No worse hand is calling, and no better hand is folding.

atnels
03-30-2005, 12:44 AM
I disagree. Yes, you are correct that spade or OES draws aren't going anywhere for a bet, but what makes you so sure those draws are out there? I think you MUST bet this since you raised preflop. True, if you're up against a bunch of calling stations it might not get you anywhere but in that situation you are also less likely to get raised by someone who has AJ or a good draw in late position.

Given all the calls, I would also check the turn and river unimproved.

ArturiusX
03-30-2005, 12:46 AM
Giving flush/other draws inproper odds to call is a No-limit concept.

What you can do is push loose draws, like two pair/set draws with lower pairs off the hand by raising. Thats the only way to protect at this limit.

A_C_Slater
03-30-2005, 01:15 AM
Don't bluff calling stations with AK high out of position.

Now if it was a single calling station I would bet the turn, but two? No.

If the single call station calls the turn I check/fold the river unimproved. Preflop and flop line is standard.

I like the way you played it the whole way.

Ringo_Mojo
03-30-2005, 01:35 AM
I think if there are weak hands here they would have folded on the flop, anyone left is not likely to fold for one bet on the turn.

Duerig
03-30-2005, 01:45 AM
[ QUOTE ]
I think if there are weak hands here they would have folded on the flop, anyone left is not likely to fold for one bet on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually I think people are far more likely to fold on the turn than the flop with a weak hand. But out of position against 2 limpers, I would check this turn / river as well.

Entity
03-30-2005, 01:46 AM
I probably wouldn't bet this flop. A bet isn't terrible though.

Anyway, turn and river are fine.

SCfuji
03-30-2005, 01:53 AM
hero is building to one pair. the hand looks good.