AT fold

[Schneids]

UTG limp. MP1 limp. MP2 raise. SB calls. I call in BB with ATs.

Flop Ad9d8c.

I bet, UTG raises, nobody folds so four plus me to the turn after my call.

Turn Q. I check. UTG checks. MP1 bets. Raiser calls. SB calls. I fold.

[TStoneMBD]

i really doubt anything that anyone says on these forums is going to change your mind about this hand, so i dont know why you posted it.

regardless, i think its a terrible fold.

[Schneids]

[ QUOTE ]
very weak.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks for the insight. (EDIt: aka I am going to infer you're implying I have more than 3 outs almost always and when I hit a 3 outer I'm rarely chopping it.)

[GreywolfNYC]

[ QUOTE ]
very weak.

[/ QUOTE ]

No, very smart. He's got too many ways to make the second best hand. Good fold.

[Schneids]

[ QUOTE ]
i really doubt anything that anyone says on these forums is going to change your mind about this hand, so i dont know why you posted it.

regardless, i think its a terrible fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

No, I'm open to anything if lots of people tell me the fold sucks. I'm just wondering.

[James282]

Hey mike, looks like someone could have the JT, but I would definitely call here. You have the odds for your gutshot, and there is a distinct possibility you have the best hand since the pfr hasn't bet or raised yet. I wouldcall and re-evalulate on the river.
-James

[Danenania]

Was this played in one of the higher limit on-line games? At Party 15/30 I would say it's a very bad fold but it could be fairly table/read specific.

[Schneids]

$40/80.

[astroglide]

i would checkraise the flop to hose gutshots/single pairs. you happened to get the same effect (minus a natural appearing leading bet on the the turn) by getting utg to surprisingly raise, but i think the flop bet is bad. i also don't like the fold. bigger ace, a straight, a flush draw are possibilities if your opponents are competent but you have plenty of odds for a gutshot if that's all you have. even a 3 out gutshot isn't the end of the world, and neither is a payoff if you end up having to do it based on the river action.

[disjunction]

This hand makes my head hurt. You need about 3 outs to breakeven (more? less?). You have 3 outs, but it's not 3, because somebody else may have a nonsuited 10, so let's call it 2.5 outs. You'll have to chop sometimes, so let's call it 1.5 outs. You need to be ahead and stay ahead 3.33% of the time to breakeven for 1BB, but the river will cost you another, so it's say 5%.

You can hope for 2 opponents on flush draws, which leaves 1 OESD and an ace, and you have to hope the OESD is the wrong side, which is less likely. I think you may be ahead here more than you think, but that's still not too much, and if there are 2 flush draws out, 1/4 to 1/3 of the deck will hurt you. As I said before it'll cost you 2 BB to find out. I do think you're ahead and will stay ahead about 5% of the time, but I dunno', all this convoluted logic just to break even? I say fold, unless there is anything at all in any of your opponents (would cold-call with weak ace, etc), to make you stay in.

[Schneids]

Agree with Astro -- betting out sucks.

Anyway, moving on...

[ QUOTE ]
Flop Ad9d8c.

I bet, UTG raises, nobody folds so four plus me to the turn after my call.

Turn Q. I check. UTG checks. MP1 bets. Raiser calls. SB calls. I fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

UTG also calls on the turn.

There river was a low card blank. Checked to MP1 who bets. 2 folds and UTG calls. MP1 shows Th6h for ten high. UTG wins the pot with As3s. I feel foolish and wonder if my fold was bad because it's hard to ignore the result. Post confirms it may have been right to call the turn and see what happens on the river.

[Senor Choppy]

[ QUOTE ]
even a 3 out gutshot isn't the end of the world

[/ QUOTE ]

I think the problem is a 1.5 out gutshot.

Even so, the posibility of having the best hand in addition to added outs makes it a bad fold unless all the opponents are well known thinking players.

[imashyboi]

Here's my thoughts before reading the results...

Since UTG just limped, he probably has a small/mid pair, Axs if he's a little loose. Since no one raised after he limped I don't think any of the other callers have any A either, probably just overpair or any A or a suited connector.

On the flop betting is fine, calling the raise is fine as well. No point of reraising here since thers too many draws.

On the turn, I felt that a c/r or calling was better than just folding, betting out wouldn't be that bad either. There are still draws on the board so betting out will not fold many hands, you would hate to get c/r here as well but you wouldn't mind since you still have a straight draw. Raising the turn is probably the best play specially after the UTG checked(he might even fold his Axs in this position), MP1 and MP2 surely don't have an A(at least not a kicker higher than yours) and are probably on a draws. The fact that they bet after UTG checked doesn't mean they have JT, lots of the time they are on a draw or a pair with a gutshot. Since you are ahead you can still raise here since you still have outs, 4 outter to complete your straight if you are behind or your lone A will win you the pot or split it with UTG. If you are reraised, I'll fold if I don't improve to my straight.

Your play on the river will depend on what flops and if it completes a flush or the T for your 2 pair but makes someone a straight. Check-Call or Bet-Call.

Any comments?