questions observation

[aslowjoe]

Every once in awhile I take and break and play some o/8. Never paid a lot of attention because I would drop down a few levels and it was usually to burn off a little bonus while relaxing and changing pace(my usual my is LHE6max) I downloaded PTO last week and now it is a bit easier to quantify my results and play. Please feel free to critisize any stupid conclusions I might be coming to.I have only about 3000 hands in PTO and I realize
that I should have 10x that before making any conclusions. All conclusions are based at very low levels.

6max vpip should be around 30%
PL VPIP is slightly higher then Limit. 16%/13%. Due to the higher implied odds of limping late in a unraised pot.
Variance is much less in O8 then on HE.
Raising early is little or -ev
PL one of your worst fears is beeing 1/4. In limit it is no big deal.
I was able to play 6 tables of PLO8 while HE this would never be possible as hand opponents hand reading is more important in HE and less important in O8.
Flame away. I am sure some comments here are erroneous. I am just trying to fast track my education by exposing my false beliefs. Thank you for any comments
Joe

[e_fermat]

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6max vpip should be around 30%
PL VPIP is slightly higher then Limit. 16%/13%. Due to the higher implied odds of limping late in a unraised pot.
Variance is much less in O8 then on HE.
Raising early is little or -ev
PL one of your worst fears is beeing 1/4. In limit it is no big deal.
I was able to play 6 tables of PLO8 while HE this would never be possible as hand opponents hand reading is more important in HE and less important in O8.

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I'm a noob at this too but I'll give you my comments anyways from my 12,000 hands of experience. All limit so can't comment on PLO.

My VPIP for 6-max is around 38% with PFR of 15%; full table is about 28% and 5% (maybe I'm too loose but it seems to work for me; I try to only play at fairly loose passive tables).

I disagree that PFR has little value as I find increased pot sized gives fish more reasons to call flop and turn bets looking for runner-runner straights/flushes/full houses and lows with only 1 low on the flop. I try to only PFR with good two-way scoop hands playing full ring but playing 6-max I will raise any A with 2 other wheel cards except A45X.; I'll also raise A2 high pair, etc.

I also find variance is low - I 4-table and rarely have a losing session. Funny that you increased # of tables played while for me, I go from 8 SNG's to 4 tabling at 6max O8. There's definitely more thinking required than push or fold in SNG NL play.

[aslowjoe]

Thanks for your response. 6max you could be entirely right about about your vpip I am just not sure.

Somewhere it seems to me I seen a comment(I think Ray Zee, I am not sure) that vpip for O8 should be lowere then HE. Maybe somebody else can comment.

Raising VS limping in a full game in early position is that you don't want to discourage the A45 or 23 to come along.

Raising VS limping in 6max might be a different story. Of course you will always raise opening late but raising a premium hand to get you heads up with the BB. Or do you just get cold callers anyway?

A situtation that I was thinking about in 6max. Suppose you have A223 double suited. Raised pot your heads up with the blind. The flop comes 78JQ no 2 suits of yours. BB bets. You pretty well have to fold this right?

I agree playing 6maxO8 even 4 tables at once is difficult.

[e_fermat]

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Raising VS limping in a full game in early position is that you don't want to discourage the A45 or 23 to come along.


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Ok, then I agree completely with what you've said; that is indeed a key difference between full ring and 6-max. I don't think you want to drive out weaker hands when you can draw to the nuts and/or scoop.

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A situtation that I was thinking about in 6max. Suppose you have A223 double suited. Raised pot your heads up with the blind. The flop comes 78JQ no 2 suits of yours. BB bets. You pretty well have to fold this right?


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I'm not sure I'd take the same line. Depending on my opponent, I'd either bet out or check-call on the flop. If I don't have a read then by default I'm going to definitely fire out a bet on this flop. There are 2BB in the pot and it's a .5BB bet so unless the flop hits him really hard, I don't expect to be re-raised. Any fold equity at all makes this a +EV play. I have 27 outs to the nut low with counterfeit protection so I am over 70% to take half the pot and can always check-fold the river if I don't hit; I can't worry about getting quartered in this situation. If the turn misses, I check-call (3BB pot with ~61% chance to make low on river so I definitely have equity to call a bet). I figure the probability of getting quartered if I hit is roughly offset by the probability that an A or 2 will scoop the pot. Likely check-fold the river in virtually all cases if I miss again.

[aslowjoe]

I was talking about the BB betting into you. you are putting on .5 to win one BB minus rake minus the 40% of the time you actually miss low. It seems like a break even prop at best.
Maybe you should raise and then fire again hoping for a fold? It would seem calling makes no sense but then again folding seems pretty silly.
Is the key to 6max sort of the opposite of full ring. While of course you are looking for a hand in both to scoop. In full ring you are looking for the nuts while in 6max you are more looking for the hand that is good both ways.

A223 prefered in full while in 6max maybe 23KK would be better. Does this make sense?