Payback for Slumlords?

[kemystery]

After a recent falling out w/ the owners of the house I rent
in regards to the damaged septic system - pipes run very slow, during heavy rains the water level rises up into the sinks and shower drains.

They refused to do anything other than have a friend of theirs locally (They live out of state) come out and add bacteria to the septic tank - which did nothing during the heavy rains we have had this year in CA. I complained and got into a pretty good argument w/ them and I told them I wasn't going to pay them March's rent until they sorted it out. Well they left a few phone messages, highlights being when she told me she had called the district attny, to report a bounced check I sent them about a year ago for a $1000. I sent off a money order to her at the time being to cover the check and bank fees and have never heard about it until now.

Now this morning: I recv'd an Unlawful Detainer and an Eviction notice. At this time I'm pretty sure that I could pay them the late rent and get back on some kind of terms. However I am now angry and am wondering if 'Payback' is what they deserve.

How would you guys play it? Drag it out legally - make it expensive. Pour cement down the pipes and move out in the middle of the night? Bite lip and pay what you owe.

History has been tumultuous between myself and the landlords, the have several times backed out of things like 'New Carpet' (which left me with NO carpet after I had pulled all the old stuff up) Tried to charge me $5000.00 for damage to the driveway after 1999's El Nino storms eroded the ground underneath the driveway (Still unrepaired and unusable btw)

On the short list of good things is that the rent is only $1000 a month for a 3b2ba in CA.

Any Landlords or renters have any experience here? /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[nothumb]

In MA you would be on solid legal ground disputing this and could easily force them to repair it in court. I don't know the law in CA. There's a woman that lives in apartments owned by this big reale estate jerk here who hasn't paid her rent in over 2 years because the heat went out for 3 days last winter and the court stuff is still pending.

I would fight them every inch of the way.

NT

[Shajen]

The only advice I can give is pay up, then move as soon as you can.

They hold the nuts here, unless you have other housing setup.

I would strongly advise against doing anything illegal.

Sounds like they are playing hard ball.

Pay up, then move.

[nothumb]

Terrible advice. The landlord is obligated to maintain the premises and, at least in most states back East, could not evict you for this. I would expect CA to have at least as good laws for tenants as states over here. Giving up like this without researching local laws is silly.

Get an attorney duder. Unless you're good at poring over housing codes.

NT

[astroglide]

[censored] it, dude. let's go bowling.

[Ray Zee]

you should move if you arent happy living in their house. the rent they get from you is alot less than the value of the money the house should bring in in another investment.
it is their house and they decide how to care for it. but you as a renter are required to maintain it as well. each has its own responsibilities. you are not allowed to with hold rent to force repairs you feel should be made. they are requied to maintain it to livable conditions. you should require that. if the septic backs up you can call the city and get the place declared unhapitable until fixed. but not good for you. payback will get you sued or criminal action. good luck i know its frustrating.

[Shajen]

[ QUOTE ]
Terrible advice. The landlord is obligated to maintain the premises and, at least in most states back East, could not evict you for this. I would expect CA to have at least as good laws for tenants as states over here. Giving up like this without researching local laws is silly.

Get an attorney duder. Unless you're good at poring over housing codes.

NT

[/ QUOTE ]

Perhaps I worded myself badly. My point was this:

there is a history here already of crap like this happening. Even if he wins, these assholes sound like the type to make his life miserable. Sure, he has some legal actions he can take (seems like the owners have more though) and he may even get ahead. But for how long?

Long run, his best choice is to leave as soon as he can.

Your advice is spot on, as always. I'm just thinking how I'd handle the situation. [censored] em, they can get rent off of someone else.

[nothumb]

Not knowing the housing situation out there I have to agree that if he can find a better deal he should. But I also tend to be stubborn on these kinds of issues because renters giving up and leaving rather than sticking up for their rights is part of what allows slumlords to operate.

If it was me I might end up getting it declared uninhabitable out of principle and waiting them out as long as possible, screwing them out of as much money as possible, etc. Your relationship with them is already [censored] so you might as well give them some JD. Next time you go to rent a place just make sure you have a girlfriend and use her references, you'll be golden. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

NT

[rusellmj]

I ran into this situation a few years ago. I live in SoCal. I remember as the tenant you aren't legally allowed to withhold your rent payment. If there is an issue with the residence being uninhabitable you can get it fixed and charge the landlord but thats about it. There is plenty of info available online. I think I just did a search for CA housing laws and it led me to some state website.
Good luck.

Russ

[kemystery]

a better housing deal is not the problem -

this post is about avenues of retribution - the orig. posting is incomplete because it doesn't detail ALL of the occurences over the years, but I think the impression is made.

To add a little history, I NEVER have made any formal arrangment w/ these people. I was renting a room from the previous renter and he just up and left, I had a conversation with one of the landlords over the phone to the effect of (landlord) "Do you want to still live there?" (Me) "Yes". That was five years ago. I plan to pay all back and current rent for time I am in this house, my intention is not to get something for nothing.

I posted this to get some opinions on what kind of legal (quasi-legal) recourse I have. I mean if it were you:

Would you milk the eviction for all the time you can? I could store most of my stuff easily and then make it painful and time consuming for them (They live out of state)

Do you contact the neccesary State offices and try to get the house declared uninhabitable. (In CA, there is a new law on the books that states the property owner is liable for all the renter's living expenses during repairs (hotel/motel, rentals) should they be forced out of home.

That stuff is all perfectly legal, I didn't even mention the quasi stuff (BUT PLEASE FEEL FREE TO DO SO) and as far as needing any type of references for future rentals etc, these people have NEVER had any type of written paperwork with me, and I also have another party who will provide references for me for the last 5 years. As an aside I am within 6-8 months of purchasing a home and my mortage arrangment will not be adversly affected by this. Also, I can move to any one of my family's 2 homes in this area in the interim.

[Bluffoon]

[ QUOTE ]
Not knowing the housing situation out there I have to agree that if he can find a better deal he should. But I also tend to be stubborn on these kinds of issues because renters giving up and leaving rather than sticking up for their rights is part of what allows slumlords to operate.

If it was me I might end up getting it declared uninhabitable out of principle and waiting them out as long as possible, screwing them out of as much money as possible, etc. Your relationship with them is already [censored] so you might as well give them some JD. Next time you go to rent a place just make sure you have a girlfriend and use her references, you'll be golden. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

NT

[/ QUOTE ]

I would rather be happy than right. I rent a uhaul and move to a new place.

Let your miserable landlords make some other tenant miserable. Get on with your life and be happy.

[jakethebake]

Why have you lived there so long?

[KJS]

Find out if there is a Tenants Union near you. They will be able to answer a lot of your questions. In many states you are able to withhold rent if the landlord does not make certain repairs, but usually there has to be some documentation going back and forth to show that you specifically asked that the repairs be done and they were not. I am an apt. manager in Seattle and that is the case here. Not sure about SoCal.

KJS

[bookie socks]

I am a landlord and I would say you probably can't withhold all of the rent.

They probably can't file for an eviction without proof they contacted you about evicting you. They must send you notice you will be evicted then if you don't respond within said period they can start the eviction process. Then if you get an eviction notice you should have a certain amount of time to respond to it. If you pay them something and you go to court you can tell the judge the problem and let him decide what should be done. He will probably order them to clean it up.

My advice (and I'm not a lawyer nor do I live in California) is to respond to the eviction notice in a way to get it sent to court and plead your case to the judge. It will be a small claims court so you don't need a lawyer and most judges will favor tenants. In the mean time send a partial payment with a letter stating something like you are with holding part of the rent to cover the future costs of the repair should you decide to have it fixed on your own. Be careful with the content of the letter because they will probably take it to court.

Trust me, they don't want the house empty collecting no rent so some rent is good.

And if you can stand it I would live there until you bought or if you think there will be continuous trouble go ahead and move. By no means should you try to "get back at them" by damaging their house. They will get a judgement against you for damages and you may go to jail. But hey, the sewer works at the jail.

And as KJS stated you should probably send them a certified letter asking for it to be fixed and take pictures also.

[bookie socks]

Looks like you've been there over 6 years. If I were your landlords i would be trying to get you to stay. Unless maybe they are trying to get you to move out.

Have you been a good tenant paying your rent on time and keeping the place nice?

Can you get your landlord to sign up on 2+2 and reply to this thread?

[TimM]

It sounds like they have no lease and no security deposit from you?

I would move out fast, and not pay any back rent, to pay for my trouble over the years. Also do that thing with having it declared uninhabitable. This plus the fact that they have no lease with you should help if they try to collect this back rent. As for the bounced check, you made good on it and they accepted it. I don't see what they could do about it now, assuming you have record of it.

[Ray Zee]

i hope you come out okay. but if i read it right you havent paid your rent. of course they want you out. you havent paid your rent. you owe rent for the time you live there even if you dont like the house. you still owe the rent. even if you decide to move on. you still owe the rent. pay what you owe and part ways. and yes they can put this on your credit report and you may have trouble getting a loan for your new house.

[TimM]

[ QUOTE ]
pay what you owe and part ways

[/ QUOTE ]

This is probably the smartest thing, as it sounds like any attempt to screw them will be met with an attempt to screw him back.

Personally I think going for revenge with nothing to gain is stupid, which is why I suggested the possibility that maybe they can't legally collect that rent without any kind of lease or rental agreement. Without these, and probably not having his SS#, can they really try to collect or damage his credit? Maybe they can make it more costly that it's worth though, and probably the time he spends fighting them will be worth more to him than the money as well.

[bookie socks]

I think he probably had a lease when he first rented. Even if he didn't records will show he's been paying rent for many years. His rental application should have his SSN for a credit check before he moved in.
But I agree, if he's having problems he should pay up and leave. He should pay up because where ever he goes next will probably want to talk to his previous land lord.

[Ray Zee]

no, he should pay up because he owes the money.

[Randy_Refeld]

[ QUOTE ]
I told them I wasn't going to pay them March's rent until they sorted it out.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is a mistake. I don't know what the procedure in CA is. In some states you can fiel a complaint and have the court hold the rent in escrow. In some states if repairs are less than 1 months rent you have the repairs done and subtract it from the next month's rent.