KK, absurd pot, did I do ok? [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

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SomethingClever

03-17-2005, 04:21 PM

No reads yet, but the table seemed a little loose and more maniacal than average.

River action to follow.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (6 max, 5 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
Hero raises, MP 3-bets, Button calls, SB calls, BB caps, Hero calls, MP calls, Button calls, SB calls.

Flop: (20 SB) 8/images/graemlins/club.gif, 3/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 6/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (5 players)
SB checks, BB bets, Hero raises, MP 3-bets, Button calls, SB calls, BB caps, Hero calls, MP calls, Button calls, SB calls.

Turn: (20 BB) 8/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (5 players)
SB checks, BB bets, Hero calls, MP raises, Button folds, SB calls, BB 3-bets, Hero calls, MP caps, SB calls, BB calls, Hero calls.

SomethingClever

03-17-2005, 04:35 PM

Follow-up: When it's two back to me on the turn, should I drop?

And assuming you play as I did up to this point, what's your plan on the river unimproved?

J.R.

03-17-2005, 04:44 PM

--Follow-up: When it's two back to me on the turn, should I drop?

it would be hard too with manaical action, as the raisers were both pfrs and unlikely to have an 8, and could have ovepirs other than AA. I am suprised you failed to raise the turn.

--And assuming you play as I did up to this point, what's your plan on the river unimproved?

after playing the turn like you did you better not fold.

SomethingClever

03-17-2005, 04:51 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I am suprised you failed to raise the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, regarding raising the turn myself... when it was capped 5 ways on the first two streets and then the turn paired the top card on board, I got scared.

[ QUOTE ]

after playing the turn like you did you better not fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

Even if it's two to you and you think you might have to call two more?

I'm not saying I wouldn't... just wondering aloud.

Piz0wn0reD!!!!!!

03-17-2005, 05:43 PM

fold for 2 on the turn or call down.

J.R.

03-17-2005, 05:51 PM

but you weren't scared enough to fold for 2 more back to you?

SomethingClever

03-17-2005, 05:59 PM

[ QUOTE ]
but you weren't scared enough to fold for 2 more back to you?

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, I was getting something like 14 to 1 ... not quite enough to draw to 2 outs, but I sort of fudged and estimated that the % of times I'm actually ahead makes up for this. Plus implied odds on the river when I hit.

This is the critical point of the hand, obviously.

I thought... calling in that spot can't be a *huge* mistake, because I'm getting decent odds to draw and some nonzero percent of the time I'm ahead.

But folding could either be slightly correct or a huge mistake.

So I went with calling.... just looking for validation or dismissal of the play.

deacsoft

03-17-2005, 06:03 PM

[ QUOTE ]
fold for 2 on the turn or call down.

[/ QUOTE ]

J.R.

03-17-2005, 06:05 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I thought... calling down can't be a *huge* mistake, because I'm getting decent odds to draw and some nonzero percent of the time I'm ahead.

[/ QUOTE ]

i think raising when the action first got to you is better cause the pot is huge, so do whatever you can to maximize your chance of winning it. If its close raise. your opponents are maniacal so the preflop and flop action may not be very reliable, no one needs to have an 8, you have kings up, and if you call they may view you as weaker than you are and make you face some tough decisions later on (see the two back to you in this hand). IMO I would have capped the flop in your shoes had I had the chance, and I don't think the turn card changes much most of the time and in fact is a good card for you most of the time.

Alobar

03-17-2005, 06:07 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Follow-up: When it's two back to me on the turn, should I drop?

[/ QUOTE ]

against a table full of suspected maniacs, none of which are likely to have an 8, and there only be one pocket pair higher than yours, on a board where the biggest card is an 8? I would NEVER fold in this spot in this situation.

SomethingClever

03-17-2005, 06:20 PM

So, sounds like raising turn is the best... folding is probably bad.

The river played itself. I /images/graemlins/heart.gif MP and SB.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (6 max, 5 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
Hero raises, MP 3-bets, Button calls, SB calls, BB caps, Hero calls, MP calls, Button calls, SB calls.

Flop: (20 SB) 8/images/graemlins/club.gif, 3/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 6/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (5 players)
SB checks, BB bets, Hero raises, MP 3-bets, Button calls, SB calls, BB caps, Hero calls, MP calls, Button calls, SB calls.

Turn: (20 BB) 8/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (5 players)
SB checks, BB bets, Hero calls, MP raises, Button folds, SB calls, BB 3-bets, Hero calls, MP caps, SB calls, BB calls, Hero calls.

River: (36 BB) K/images/graemlins/spade.gif (4 players)
SB checks, BB bets, Hero raises, MP calls, SB calls $1.25 (All-In), BB calls.

Final Pot: 42.62 BB

Results in white below:
BB has 8s 7s (three of a kind, eights).
Hero has Kd Kh (full house, kings full of eights).
MP has Qd 9d (one pair, eights).
SB has 6h 7h (two pair, eights and sixes).
Outcome: Hero wins 42.62 BB.

Alobar

03-17-2005, 06:27 PM

hella nice pot, Im glad you snagged your 2 outter on that donk

I hope you made lots of notes

SomethingClever

03-17-2005, 06:29 PM

[ QUOTE ]
hella nice pot, Im glad you snagged your 2 outter on that donk

I hope you made lots of notes

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah. I just wonder what MP and SB were thinking.

MP: "Hmm... I'll call two with a busted flush on the river. Q high might play."

SB: "I hope bottom pair, 7 kicker holds up in this 42 BB pot."

Alobar

03-17-2005, 06:41 PM

or maybe..

MP "I dont want to fold and appear weak after all the raising ive been doing, its only 2 more bets, I have metagame considerations to take into effect

Sb "God damn this BJ is good..."