How to deal with repeated bad beats(long)

[David]

I posted this here because I didn't want it to turn into a conspiracy theory post which it would if I posted it in the internet section.

Results of my last 5 tournies (all at Pokerstars)

5) $30 PL Holdem, App. 145 entrants, I finish in 2'nd place.Heads up I get AKo and raise it the pot. He calls (we are almost dead even with him ahead slightly) and flop comes KJx I bet the pot and he raises I rearaise and he calls, turn is x (no flush possible) I bet pot (allin) he calls and turns over J2 and 2 hits on river. OK not that bad.

4)$50 NL To make a long story short I make nut flush on turn and get rivered by str8 flush (first hand at final table)I'm out. I had 3'rd biggest stack-2'nd biggest put me out.

3) $30 NL Down to 17 players, playing 8 handed. I get AdQc in middle position. Folded to me, I raise app pot size. 1 caller (button). flop comes Qx4c5c. I bet all-in and button calls (he has me covered slightly). He turns over AcQd. Needless to say he catches running clubs and I'm gone.

2) $30 NL Down to 20 or so players. In SB I get AA with slightly less than average stack, raised to me and I go all-in. BB calls for slightly 5 times more than his original Blind. Raiser folds,????. flop comes K72 and his 72 suited takes me out.

1) $30 PL down to about 30 players from original 90 or so. I get 99 in middle position. Folded to me and I raise pot size. Button only caller. By the way I have 6'th biggest stack. Flop comes Q96 rainbow. I bet the pot, button raises back the pot and I reraise all-in and he has me covered. He turns over 1010. I figure if he hits 10 then oh well! turn is 8 and river is 7 for str8 and I'm out again. I was stunned.

OK maybe none of these by themselves should upset me too much, but my problem is I am really getting the feeling of playing scared now. How do you deal with these type of situations when they seem to occur with such regularity. I have sworn I will not put any more money in POkerstars even though I know that it was just bad luck and not any shenanigans. Do I stay away from there for awhile? Do I jump right back in there? What do I tell myself? HElp?

[puppydog_ct]

Five tournaments is not a significant losing streak. You don't say how many players started these contests, but I assume they're multi-table not single-table. There are many many many good tournament players who don't win 1 out of 5 - hell, there are plenty who don't win 1 out of 20. Plus in one you took 2nd! Yes, it's frustrating to lose, but if this is how you react to not winning five tournaments in a row, you might consider not playing tournaments.

Seriously, I'm not trying to make fun of you, but you have to learn to have a little perspective or you'll make yourself insane.

[David]

It's not losing so much as the way I am losing that is getting to me. I do understand that 5 tournies is not enough to do any statistical analisys on. I am just a bit discouraged by the manner of the beats I am getting lately and looking for ways to encourage myself in dealing with these situations. Thanks for the response.

[bernie]

this is 5 different tourneys...how will you react if it all happened in one ringgame session?

understand where you were the favorite, and where you werent. also, stay away from entitlement thoughts. the pot isnt yours til they shove you the chips. but after enough beats, it wont suprise you what beats you at times. you'll have seen it before...

lets take a look..

"5) $30 PL Holdem, App. 145 entrants, I finish in 2'nd place.Heads up I get AKo and raise it the pot. He calls (we are almost dead even with him ahead slightly) and flop comes KJx I bet the pot and he raises I rearaise and he calls, turn is x (no flush possible) I bet pot (allin) he calls and turns over J2 and 2 hits on river. OK not that bad."

your ahead, but if this is HU, he'd likely call you all the way with mid pair...he just caught. you must like him calling for 5 outs though...

"4)$50 NL To make a long story short I make nut flush on turn and get rivered by str8 flush (first hand at final table)I'm out. I had 3'rd biggest stack-2'nd biggest put me out."

would you rather have him hit his card on the turn? the fact he has a flush also, usually means he'll see you at the river. tough break though....

"3) $30 NL Down to 17 players, playing 8 handed. I get AdQc in middle position. Folded to me, I raise app pot size. 1 caller (button). flop comes Qx4c5c. I bet all-in and button calls (he has me covered slightly). He turns over AcQd. Needless to say he catches running clubs and I'm gone."

nothing really bad about this. he was slightly ahead from the flop on....

"2) $30 NL Down to 20 or so players. In SB I get AA with slightly less than average stack, raised to me and I go all-in. BB calls for slightly 5 times more than his original Blind. Raiser folds,????. flop comes K72 and his 72 suited takes me out."

this can be aggravating. a perfect flop. gotta love these. its a perfect flop for him. i find these types of flops a little too convenient online. like when the flop hits 3 or 4 out of the 3 or 4 seeing the flop. seems to happen a little too often. however, raiser folded probably because someone called your allin. thus he may move up a level. im guessing he didnt raise alot, but enough......you had the best of it preflop, you cant complain about the 72 calling can you? i mean, ya gotta love that. sucks that he caught it though. was he one of the chipleaders on your table? anyway, just realize that if he never catches this play, he'd never play that bad. it's gotta hit sometime for him. it just happened on this occasion.

"1) $30 PL down to about 30 players from original 90 or so. I get 99 in middle position. Folded to me and I raise pot size. Button only caller. By the way I have 6'th biggest stack. Flop comes Q96 rainbow. I bet the pot, button raises back the pot and I reraise all-in and he has me covered. He turns over 1010. I figure if he hits 10 then oh well! turn is 8 and river is 7 for str8 and I'm out again. I was stunned"

TT usually beats 99...its a huge favorite. and this is one way it beats it. but would you be any more stunned if he had QQ or JTs? but im thinking he also was one of the chipleaders on this table.

id say look at the possibilities of the players hands, not just the results of the hand. what 'could' he have had that wouldve still beat you. understand that these beats and 'worse' beats are part of the game. and yes...they SUCK. but you want them to occur at times. a great line in a CP article was 'if your on a table showing many bad beats, your on a beatable table.' just remember, you get to pay some bad beat dues for the profit to be made on such tables. and the profit may not show up that session, but in a different session with other, just as bad, players. sometimes ya gotta 'chum' the waters.

like i've been doing the past couple sessions /forums/images/icons/tongue.gif

but it does get old. if it's really bothering you, take a break. let the emotions and the timid, 'scared', feelings dissipate. then come back with a clearer mind. all the while, with the experience of 'surviving' some bad beats. it shouldnt suprise you when they happen again, since you will have seen them before...

or just a change of venue can be enough to recharge you game. the feng shui may help....

just some ideas...

hang in there...

b

many times a chipleader will play a little looser against a smaller stack to try and take them out. not always though.

First, never play at a table, on a site or in a room where you're not comfortable for any reason. Your feelings are reason enough. We all play better when we're relaxed, and part of that is trusting the house.

Second, learning to lose is a major part of playing poker. Some players talk about it, some don't. But everyone loses. Over time you'll run great, you'll run terrible, you'll run a little ahead, a little behind and everything in between. Over the long term, your relative skill level will determine your EV -- the cards will even out. Over the short term, the cards can make more of a difference. All you can do is assess your play -- is it just cards or are the other players better/reading you better? Are you tilting and not playing well after a beat? This is where it really helps to have a playing friend to talk things over with -- someone close in ability, so they'll be interested, who really wants you to win but isn't afraid to be critical.

How many bad beats did you put on other players in these same tournies? I sure you hit a two outter or two or better yet tie a hand that you were clearly losing. It happens. When Chris F was playing TJ a few years ago in the WSOP a few years ago Chris put about 3 bad beats on TJ. He won by hitting a 3 outter on the river. Do you think TJ was pissed? He wasn't that pissed he still won over a million dollars. Stuff happens.

tournament poker is all about bad beats ... if 100 people enter ... well over three quarters of the field held the best hand with all the chips in the middle ... and were outdrawn ... basically ... we all sit around hoping our hands hold up ... and eventually ... 99 out of the 100 players get broke ... the majority of these players held the best hand when their last chips went in.

your "analysis" makes it sound like you are astonished that you are outdrawn at one point or another along the way ... it makes no difference WHEN the suckout occurs ... your big pocket pair can just as easily be outdrawn on the first hand of the tournament ... as it can on the last hand.

Point is ... at SOME point in the tournament ... every player get's unlucky ... and finds themselves the victim of a bad beat ... the lucky player who survives the suckout filled waters ... ends up with all the chips.

If you look at it this way ... maybe you won't feel so bad about being outdrawn.

Look at this another way ... pretend you are playing Blackjack instead of Holdem ... you are dealt two face cards every hand ... and the dealer shows a six in the window each time ... your bets increase as the tournament moves into the later rounds ... each time you play a hand ... you are the favorite. It's pretty clear that at SOME point along the way ... the dealer will hit a lucky 21 ... clearly ONE player outlasts the others in this tournament ... he's the "suckout proof" player of the day .. and the winner!

You can't say you were 'unlucky' to be sucked out on in these tournaments ... sounds like you did pretty well, actually! What do you expect, to WIN the whole thing .... to outlast hundreds of other players just like you ??? No way.

[roGER]

During Susie Issacs' long and somewhat tedious writing career, she did come up with one gem:

"To win a big poker tournament, you need to get lucky at least five times."

Its not an exact quote, but that was the gist of it. The person who wins or even places where you have a hundred or more players has to suck-out on someone. And the bigger the field, the more often you're going to have to get lucky in order to do well.

Some cynicas have noticed that Mr. Philip Helmuth doesn't seem to have grasped this concept, despite a tournament career as long and considerably more illustrious than Ms. Issacs.

- roGER

[J_V]

You think he wasn't that pissed? Ask him. He acted like a gentleman but a three outer is probably still haunting him.

[Boris]

go sit in your car and repeatedly bang your head against the steering wheel.