The end of Rakebacks or the end of PokerNow?

[LImitPlayer]

As some of you already have read, PokerNow has suspended their payments to their affiliates for the month of Febuary, because of an audit.

One affiliate website has posted that PokerNow will no longer make Rakeback payments at all, and another has stated that they will not be making payments until their audit is over on March 17th.

This poses a few questions.

1) are rakebacks soon to be a thing of the past?

2) Is PokerNow soon to be a thing of the past?

I don't have access to any #'s but it would seem that PokerNow's decison to stop Rakeback entirely, would send a slew of players running from their site to join up on another one.

It is possible that they have crunched the numbers and figured that the number of players that they would lose if they stopped the rakeback programs would be minimal and would not effect their bottom line that much, however if that was the case then why would they implement a policy that would cause them to lose business?

Is this a cost cutting measure from a company that may possibly be on it's last legs? (Purely speculation on my part)Or is this the 1st step towards all the party skins ending rakebacks entirely?

Not paying the affiliates is a drastic move and it has caught a lot of people off guard.

Ask yourself, what is the 1st thing a company does when it is having financial difficulties?

They cut operating costs, and delay payments.

I don't know about you put I have emptied my PokerNow account and I will play elsewhee until this whole thing gets straighened out.

[ripped]

was there a reason to start a new string for this when the string below it is the same topic??

jesus what a waste of damn space.

[LImitPlayer]

1st it's not the same topic, I was asking if people thought POkerNow was hurting finaincially.

2nd when I started this thread there were maybe 8 or 9 posts under the original one, I can't help it if it balloned to 35 or so posts by the time I finished writing this one, I can't type that fasty.

I think someone needs to relax, take a pill, take a drink whatever works for you.



well by the time i finished writing this post there were only a few replies under the 1st one and no one had mentioned that PokerNow

[AngryCola]

[ QUOTE ]

2nd when I started this thread there were maybe 8 or 9 posts under the original one, I can't help it if it balloned to 35 or so posts by the time I finished writing this one, I can't type that fasty

[/ QUOTE ]

Why would it matter that it had 9 or 50 posts?

It's basically the same topic.

"It is always better to post in an existing thread than to start a new one."

[soah]

Just to make sure I'm not crazy, the thread just got deleted, right? Just as I was trying to see MicroBob's thoughts. =(

[Michael Davis]

I don't really see why it got deleted. It was just news. I guess because people were on there declaring themselves as affiliates.

-Michael

[lefty rosen]

I was paid. They didn't send me a report but I was paid... I am an affiliate and have a few signees only one real one though......

[goodguy_1]

I was aware of this earlier in the day and am not going to comment right now but I think this thread SHOULD NOT be edited by 2+2..this is too important unless 2+2 is just worried about keeping IGM happy for advertising reasons.
I made money before rakeback.I'll make it w/o if that happens.

[lorinda]

but I think this thread SHOULD NOT be edited by 2+2

It was a total spamfest.*

I don't know if that was the reason, but I assume it was.

*The previous one that is.....

Lori

[goodguy_1]

[ QUOTE ]
It was a total spamfest.


[/ QUOTE ]
what the heck are you talking about?It was not a spamfest at all.It was a discussion amongst mostly players, a few small affiliates/players and a couple of huge affiliates that have been pretty honest about wtf is going on!why is everything a conspiracy with you Lori?
If you think that rakes are going to come down IF Party gets rid of the affiliate system you will be sorely disappointed.
This whole situation is horrific not just for the affiliates-many of whom were honest and worked hard and their players but this could take a shine off all of Party.Party better be very careful how they let this thing evolve because their player-base could take a huge hit.
I agree with Jason thu.I think Partys' growth in revenues really has been stiffled by the growing affiliate biz. at other skins.Dont look at just at the number of players total at Party that doesnt tell us dick.What has happened is that as each new player is added into the Party Network Party has been making less money on that player because more and more players are coming thru the backdoor ie skins w/rakeback deals.I am not privy to specific skin/licensing agreements with Party and it's skins.

Party needs to be really careful with this or the whole Party may be over-heh!

[lorinda]

why is everything a conspiracy with you Lori?

Well let's see.

Pokernow starts up, I say you'll all get screwed, you do.

Choice starts up, I say you'll all get screwed, you do.

Pro Poker starts up, I say you'll all get screwed, you do.

Pokerchamps starts up, I say it'll be huge..... er ....

People break rules to get rakeback, I say they'll get screwed, they do.

Please, show me that my hit rate of kookiness is under 50% and I'll be amazed.

Lori

[URMeowed]

I got a hot date tomorrow. Will I be screwed? Thanks in advance.

Meow.

[lorinda]

Anyone who has survived on the internet as long as you have will never be screwed.

Lori

[jaxUp]

So, are we thinking that we should clear out most (or all) of our PokerNow money? This worried me a bit.

[goodguy_1]

haha thats funny.Lori I removed the kook reference as you can see I dont want to get into any personal bashing over such a divisive issue.As you know I was one of the last original posters to finally get rakeback.All the accounts I play on get rakeback currently.I will be sad to see it go if that happens but if it happens I'm prepared for it.

Now I gotta go get unstuck!

[AngryCola]

[ QUOTE ]
So, are we thinking that we should clear out most (or all) of our PokerNow money? This worried me a bit.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't see why that would be necessary.
It's not like they are raiding accounts.

[PsYcHo-ScHnAuZeR]

If PokerNow is in trouble, it is because they catered to the whoring crowd, who make maximum use of reload bonuses and rakeback.

Did they ever market to any fish?

[lorinda]

I removed the kook reference as you can see I dont want to get into any personal bashing over such a divisive issue.

Thanks GG.

I'll take other insults with no issues. Being a kook is not the right one to fire at me /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Next time I upset you , I recommend insane as a good starting point.
Hard for me to argue that one /images/graemlins/frown.gif

Lori

[debater]

Why/when did you predict the downfall fo PokerNow? Would you provide a link? I would be very interested in understanding a veteran's reasoning.

[PsYcHo-ScHnAuZeR]

It was probably the Shark code affilate that she predicted would bring many of us down. And he has been a disappointment.

[lorinda]

In fairness I didn't predict a downfall, just a "Be wary".

It was SHARK related and something else which I forget (I didn't actually go to PN myself and kinda stopped following stuff)

The point I was trying to make is that although I do post a lot of conspiracy stuff, I usually try to reason why I feel that way and leave it to the reader to decide, even if I do get defensive of my views.

I objected to the use of the word, because I certainly avoid stuff like "This site is rigged" unless I can possibly help it.

I'd say the biggest I ever went the other way was the Empire bonus thing where I totally misread the situation.

I pitched the challenge at 50% because I'm sure I'm nowhere near 100% accurate.

Lori

[ripped]

with all due respect I dont think it was unless by the time I stopped reading that people all stated they were affiliates. People were only commenting that they were affiliates getting paid and challenging the original poster on their credibility.

[ripped]

Pokernow actually advertises on the 2 biggest radio stations in Toronto so they are doing some major advertising.

[Luv2DriveTT]

[ QUOTE ]
If PokerNow is in trouble, it is because they catered to the whoring crowd, who make maximum use of reload bonuses and rakeback.

Did they ever market to any fish?

[/ QUOTE ]

Poker Now markets and advertises in Canada only to my knowlege.

TT /images/graemlins/club.gif

[frank_iii]

[ QUOTE ]
why is everything a conspiracy with you Lori?

Well let's see.

Pokernow starts up, I say you'll all get screwed, you do.


[/ QUOTE ]

How does receiving money for doing something you'd be doing anyway qualify as getting screwed? If the program ends, it ends. But we're not screwed.

What is your problem, anyway? Get a hobby that doesn't include trolling internet forums.

[MattHatter]

With the money that some ppl are getting back from rakeback every month even if they eventually get caught wouldn't it still be +EV.

Do you think party would just stop the rakeback or would they sieze acct balances?

I don't think they would immediately sieze the accounts of a large group of thier highest volume players, would they? They'll probably just close the loophole, right?

If my reasoning is correct.. T&C or not.. you would be a fool not to get rakeback. (note: reasoning has been seriously flawed in the past :P)

Matt

[GrannyMae]

Party needs to be really careful with this or the whole Party may be over-heh!

if party wants to get max $$$ for their IPO, they HAVE to stop losing players to the skins.

from what i hear, the party IPO does not include all these skins, and investors will NOT pay 2 billion dollars for a company that is bleeding players every day.

they have lost tons of players to the skins and this is certainly not good for maximizing the effects of an IPO. i would guess this is for appearance sake AND for the sake of getting back lost players.

the way you will know is if party themselves do nothing, or even loosen up on their enforcement of rakeback within party itself.

[MicroBob]

[ QUOTE ]
It was a total spamfest.

[/ QUOTE ]


I disagree that it was a "total" spamfest....but I certainly agree with Lori on this more than goodguy or a couple others.


I think most of the people saying "I'm an affiliate there and I got paid" were innocent...and trying to be harmless.

But if you're perusing through the thread...who are you going to send a PM too saying "Hey....you said you're still getting paid as an affiliate at pokernow. Can I sign up under you?"?


A couple of others were saying things like "this is why it's better to sign-up with a small affiliate than with the bigger groups."
this was akin to saying "you should sign up with a smaller affiliate LIKE ME!!!"


I don't think it was EXPLICITLY spammy. Again, I thought most of the "I'm an affiliate there and this is my situation" was mostly innocent and just trying to figure out what the hell is gonig on.

But it was getting fairly spammish in that thread.
I didn't think of reporting it or anything....and really didn't think about it being deleted. But when it WAS deleted my reaction was "well....I guess it's not that surprising that the mods took action on it. Now that I think about it it was getting to a point where I can understand doing that."


FWIW - I had the last post in that thread (my first on the subject) before it got deleted.
So maybe THAT was the real reason why!! (just kidding....it was a short post where I basically just said, "not the end of the world. if I get rake-back, Great! If not, I'm pretty sure I'll live.")

[FlFishOn]

...I would get all my money right now. The first hint may be all the lead time you get.

When PokerSpot went south I dithered for a couple days and it cost me all my BR there.

How in the world would you be able to assess their financial health other than looking at this one puzzle piece and extrapolating?

[TylerD]

So will Party (IGM) pull the plug on Empire affliates as well?

[Sandstone]

[ QUOTE ]
...I would get all my money right now. The first hint may be all the lead time you get.

When PokerSpot went south I dithered for a couple days and it cost me all my BR there.

How in the world would you be able to assess their financial health other than looking at this one puzzle piece and extrapolating?

[/ QUOTE ] PokerNOW couldn't run off with your money if they wanted to.

PayPro handles all your cash transactions.

[Perseus]

I would think they will eventually pull the plug on all rakeback. If there was no such thing as rakeback many many more players would play on party instead of the skins simply because they offer more in terms of multi-player tournaments. Not saying poeple wouldn't play on the skins, but I know I never would have moved because there would have been very little reason to, and I'm sure others are in my boat...

...did they release what day Party is going to IPO? I apologize if this has been discussed

[Soleo]

[ QUOTE ]
Do you think party would just stop the rakeback or would they sieze acct balances?

[/ QUOTE ]
LOL. I think worst thing which may happen is that all skins will cancel MGR payouts affiliate scheme and leave only pay-per-sign scheme.

[Moyer]

If all Party skins stopped offering rakeback, it would be a huge incentive to play more at sites like UB that do offer rakeback, and any site with a current reload bonus.

[Soleo]

[ QUOTE ]
If all Party skins stopped offering rakeback, it would be a huge incentive to play more at sites like UB that do offer rakeback, and any site with a current reload bonus.

[/ QUOTE ]
It would be nice but many will just open an account in the name of relative at Party with quasi-official gift certificates rake rebate.

[lorinda]

Get a hobby that doesn't include trolling internet forums.

The height of your knowledge was revealed a week ago, in a different response to me.

I must have been under a rock, but this thread is the first in which I've even heard the legitimacy of rakeback questioned.

One has to wonder which of us was correct.

Lori

[scotty34]

I know rakeback itself is against the T&C of sites such as Party. How about affiliates that run a point system, and allow you to purchase from their store using points (ex PSO). Are these legal, or are they in danger of being shut down as well?